The Arms Compendium

[Deleted]

Which has nothing to do with rage efficiency.

Not using a rage-efficient spell as often as one could and instead using a less rage-efficient spell certainly does. But sure, just be a dick about it.

[Murloch]

So on ST only fights, Arms is way ahead of Fury.

I know I'm gonna get yelled at, but what are the current BiS Leggos for Arms? I didn't see that in the compendium, just a general insight on how each one works for Arms.

[Eriasu]

the best leggos with t20 are helm+ring

[orgonutil]

So on ST only fights, Arms is way ahead of Fury.

I know I'm gonna get yelled at, but what are the current BiS Leggos for Arms? I didn't see that in the compendium, just a general insight on how each one works for Arms.

So You should read again with atention

[Archimtiros]

Not using a rage-efficient spell as often as one could and instead using a less rage-efficient spell certainly does. But sure, just be a dick about it.

Quit acting indignant, what I said was MS being delayed during Execute has nothing to do with rage efficiency, not that there were any other more efficient spells; it's delayed because the multiplicative effect of stacking EP with SD. Rage efficiency only matters if you're running out of it, and during Arms Execute, that's difficult to do.

You're also misunderstanding the concept of rage efficiency. Stacking up EP before using MS with SD is actually more rage efficient than using MS on CD in the long run, even if MS is higher DPR than Execute alone. You can't just ignore these stacking mechanics and only look one GCD at a time, or you'd be maintaining Rend at all times during Execute as well.

[Deleted]

Got a few Questions in regards to AoE. Talents SS, Trauma, Fervor, since I do mostly M+. If I am in a 3 Target Situation and Cleave comes up just before MS, should I use it and use the Buff up later, let it expire IF I have a string of tactician procs or just WW?
Does the extra shadowdmg for 3 targets make enough of a difference or would it be the same for 2 Targets?

[Deleted]

Got a few Questions in regards to AoE. Talents SS, Trauma, Fervor, since I do mostly M+. If I am in a 3 Target Situation and Cleave comes up just before MS, should I use it and use the Buff up later, let it expire IF I have a string of tactician procs or just WW?
Does the extra shadowdmg for 3 targets make enough of a difference or would it be the same for 2 Targets?

In a 3 target situation, CS MS and cleave must be kept on cd. With the priority being MS over Cleave.
The cleave golden trait is still Shit, you are using cleave only for the buff it gives to WW, the shadowdamage is just a minor bonus.

[Prime92]

So we've got some Mythic logs now and the question that strikes me is: Why on ST fights like Goroth Arms warriors use Ravager only in conjunction with CoF? Without CoF Ravager+Warbreaker+BC synergize perfectly, with CoF we should expect 5-10s shorter CD on each BC, which basically means we're skipping every 2nd Ravager Wouldn't it be better to use literally any other trinket instead?

[Archimtiros]

So we've got some Mythic logs now and the question that strikes me is: Why on ST fights like Goroth Arms warriors use Ravager only in conjunction with CoF? Without CoF Ravager+Warbreaker+BC synergize perfectly, with CoF we should expect 5-10s shorter CD on each BC, which basically means we're skipping every 2nd Ravager Wouldn't it be better to use literally any other trinket instead?

Because you don't need Warbreaker to apply CS on single target fights (or at all, if using Rend with Titanic Might), and Ravager's CD is reduced by the T20 2p. CoF then helps keep Ravager in sync with BC's lower CD.

[phantomlink]

I started dumping my AP into my arms artifact finally since my Fury one is almost rank 60 and I wanted to try it out for single target fights, dont have concordance yet or decent relic traits but oh well.

I'm getting pretty rage starved following the rotation and using slam as a filler, by any chance do arms raiders intentionally not use a GCD to keep enough rage for other abilities? Trauma felt like it wasnt as rage starved as Rend but it's supposed to be the better ST option. Right now i'm sitting at 24.4% crit, 20.4% haste, and 65% mastery

[Archimtiros]

I started dumping my AP into my arms artifact finally since my Fury one is almost rank 60 and I wanted to try it out for single target fights, dont have concordance yet or decent relic traits but oh well.

I'm getting pretty rage starved following the rotation and using slam as a filler, by any chance do arms raiders intentionally not use a GCD to keep enough rage for other abilities? Trauma felt like it wasnt as rage starved as Rend but it's supposed to be the better ST option. Right now i'm sitting at 24.4% crit, 20.4% haste, and 65% mastery

Arms is not a GCD capped spec, so yes, there will always be some instances of rage starvation.

[Arbiter]

I'm getting pretty rage starved following the rotation and using slam as a filler, by any chance do arms raiders intentionally not use a GCD to keep enough rage for other abilities? Trauma felt like it wasnt as rage starved as Rend but it's supposed to be the better ST option. Right now i'm sitting at 24.4% crit, 20.4% haste, and 65% mastery

That actually doesn't make much sense. Rend/TM build is a lot less rage starving than FoB/Trauma build due to whirlwind's high cost.

[AleksaMaster]

I was playing fury since start of the legion and have recently switched to arms. Can anyone give me advice on analysing logs as arms warrior?
For instance, I know that as fury I was looking at enrage and FB uptime, if rampage is cast only at 100, if BC window rotation is ok, if cds are lined up, but I want to improve as arms and I dont know what to look when analysing logs. So any advice would be appreciated.

[phantomlink]

That actually doesn't make much sense. Rend/TM build is a lot less rage starving than FoB/Trauma build due to whirlwind's high cost.

Dunno what to say, I was getting practice on the rotations all last night and while Rend did more damage if I had enough procs, Trauma was a smoother rotation with less empty GCDs

[orgonutil]

Dunno what to say, I was getting practice on the rotations all last night and while Rend did more damage if I had enough procs, Trauma was a smoother rotation with less empty GCDs

Were you practicing in a low health dummie? If no, you are doing something wrong in rend / TM build

[AleksaMaster]

On 2-4 target fight where I have SS, and one target is under 20% health do I do the same execute rotation as on ST fight? The AOE rotation in the guide is really confusing, I have no idea what to do.

[Archimtiros]

On 2-4 target fight where I have SS, and one target is under 20% health do I do the same execute rotation as on ST fight? The AOE rotation in the guide is really confusing, I have no idea what to do.

Execute and Mortal Strike cleave, that's your AoE rotation.

[Deleted]

On 2-4 target fight where I have SS, and one target is under 20% health do I do the same execute rotation as on ST fight? The AOE rotation in the guide is really confusing, I have no idea what to do.

Think about it this way: Guide says from 2-7 targets u do normal rota and fill with cleave+ww. So u use cleave and ww as filler whenever u can't execute(ayalas) or use MS as required (SD or no ep stacks), but once u are below 20% mob HP, u can always use execute, so u never need to use ww as filler. Hence u simply do normal execute rotation which cleaves automatically and only go cleave+ww if there's 8+ mobs.

[AleksaMaster]

Execute and Mortal Strike cleave, that's your AoE rotation.

I am looking at Simcraft APL and if I understood correctly, above 20% priority is MS > Execute(Ayala) > CS > Whirlwind, and below 20% just normal Execute rotation (same as ST). Right?

[Polopollo]

Hello!

First thanks a lot for this compendium, I really love it! I have few questions (which might be helpful to edit the compendium to add the answers):

1. FoB/Trauma build: It is written to use MS on CD, but at the same time to only use MS if SD buff up. So if I am in the case of low rage, and no CS proc and CS debuff falls off, and I can do either a MS or a WW, which one should I do? I feel with more experience, I should try to, or use warbreaker + MS or run out and back and use WW till it proc a CS, but I would like to clarify that.
2. I am surprised to see the ETW relic ranked so low. Right now I still use the t19 2p + t20 4p, without any ETW relic, and god there are moments without any CS proc for the whole CS cd duration. Shouldn't it be adviced to put at least one ETW relic in your weapon? (Especially with one of them dropping in ToS) Or really not worth it at all and stacking the PS one is the way to go and follow the sims?
3. I come from Fury, so my only Arms legendary is the Alaya execute ring. How well will I do in m+ compared to over 1M dps without the arms legendary legs or the new helm? Should I try to "maintain" both dps spec at the same time? With your warrior experience, what would you advice for this new important content that are the m+ runs?
4. Execute rotation: I don't get the difference, between fob/trauma build and the rend one, of putting the "MS if you have EP x2 and SD" upper or lower than "CS if no SD". What am I missing?
5. Speaking of the rend build, if I do not have the legendary helm, is it still worth it to try? (sorry I'm bad with sims, trying to improve that)
6. "CS -> BC + Bladestorm": I don't see anything in the compendium about that so sorry to ask this dummy questions: Should I also use it during the execute phase or should I BC+execute and skip BS? Also should I delay my "CS->BC+BS" for like maiden's shields (for maiden and for avatar's maiden as well), or is it a huge DPS loss and I should use that as soon as they are both available ?
7. I am reading above something about using CoF in order to have more often "BC+BS". My guess is it isn't that necessary else it would be written in the guide, right?
8. I feel I could get screwed by the "no CS proc", I would love a dedicated section in the arms compendium So far I think I really need to work on the "Run out and Charge back in when MS and CS are on cooldown, you have low rage, and you've just swung (Get a swing timer WeakAura or use Quartz)." to maybe do that more often. Is there any other tricks? (Like pooling rage at a certain point like if the boss will transition or keeping a CS proc or something like that?)

Sorry for my English, thanks again!

Other questions I had that you already answered:

1. Execute rotation: Without the t19 2p, I feel it might be hard to get a CS proc, should I just execute twice, even in the event of a CS proc on the 1st of the 2, just to be able to CS->MS after? (so the MS has a EPx2), or is it a big loss of dps to don't use the CS proc right away (and might possible to have to then execute 3-4 times before the next CS->MS proc) ? ---> You answered here: /threads/2246706-Arms-Questions-about-Execute-Rage-Pooling?p=46345578#post46345578