Growing anti-science stance in "skeptic community"

[derpkitteh]

And your work to disprove their theories is where?

being a woman and realizing i am inclined to some feminine things that guys typically aren't inclined to? not denying reality.

your gender does effect things you like to a degree, that's all there is to it. there's only two of them, corresponding to the only two sexes we have. it's that simple.

you're essentially saying transpeople can't exist when you say gender doesn't exist. you're completely devaluing them. there's a reason they feel like a man/woman even though they're in a female/male body. it's their gender, and they need to transition so they feel right.

[Mittens]

I sleep well knowing that Peterson hates the type of guy that link his videos in order to make arguments on an online forum.

[Techno-Druid]

I think that's the proverbial motte for the bailey of the arguments I see get trotted out. I don't think you're wrong at all, but I do think people use references to social construction as a distraction from biology when its convenient for whatever they're arguing at a given moment.

Fair enough, the only other argument I can see for "race being a social construct" is that many wrongly associate "biological races" with subspecies.

"Race" is a very vague term that will continue to evolve as we become more globalized. Our basic ethnic groups might not change significantly in terms of genetics, but our societal labels and subsequent connotations will.

I believe in biological race, but I would not lump a Habesha from Ethiopia as being the same race as say a Xhosa from South Africa or even a Sicilian with a Swede.

[Jakexe]

being a woman and realizing i am inclined to some feminine things that guys typically aren't inclined to? not denying reality.

your gender does effect things you like to a degree, that's all there is to it. there's only two of them, corresponding to the only two sexes we have. it's that simple.

you're essentially saying transpeople can't exist when you say gender doesn't exist. you're completely devaluing them. there's a reason they feel like a man/woman even though they're in a female/male body. it's their gender, and they need to transition so they feel right.

So just a bunch of anecdotes and personal experiences?

How scientific of you.

[Theodarzna]

Fair enough, the only other argument I can see for "race being a social construct" is that many wrongly associate "biological races" with subspecies.

"Race" is a very vague term that will continue to evolve as we become more globalized. Our basic ethnic groups might not change significantly in terms of genetics, but our societal labels and subsequent connotations will.

I believe in biological race, but I would not lump a Habesha from Ethiopia as being the same race as say a Xhosa from South Africa or even a Sicilian with a Swede.

The race realists are ultimately why I find the Alt-Right pants on head dumb and unable to really achieve what they claim. But a lot of youtubers have decided its a thing worth obsessing over.

[Runenwächter]

And your work to disprove their theories is where?

Lets do away with the pretense that these are theories that qualify as such in the scientific sense. They are not. They are not because they lack any resemblance to the scientific method. They are a sham. You do not have to take my word for it, you can also ask biologists or those that have studied medicine.

[Heladys]

Actual skeptics reserve judgement until presented with better evidence, because of an actual describable issue they have with the current evidence, not "gut feeling".

These fucktards don't deserve the name.

[derpkitteh]

So just a bunch of anecdotes and personal experiences?

How scientific of you.

explain transpeople then.

do you people believe they're just sick in the head or something? you're the ones that are wrong if you do.

[Runenwächter]

And how do things like "anthropogenic climate change," "the earth is spherical," and "evolution" fall into "dogmatic ideologies?"


A major problem is that the "anti-SJW" people are blindly hitching their wagons to whomever shares their stinted views on whatever SJW hotbutton issue they choose to bitch about- including hitching themselves to rightwing, anti-science nutjobs.


A lot of people seem to be selling their scruples because they found some whackadoo that agrees with them on some minor point. Thus degrading the intellectual honesty of all involved.

I see your statements but I fail to recognize an argument with relevance to what Ive said in there. I cant say I follow the discussion regarding the topics youve brought up very closely so I cant comment on that. The drama in the opening post seems related to the "evolution" thing mostly, so if theres something I'd need to know to comment on you'd have to point me in the right direction (and hope our dear secretary of justice Heiko Maas and his little Stasi havent blocked the videos or social media posts in question so that I can form my own opinion on the matter).

[Jakexe]

Lets do away with the pretense that these are theories that qualify as such in the scientific sense. They are not. They are not because they lack any resemblance to the scientific method. They are a sham. You do not have to take my word for it, you can also ask biologists or those that have studied medicine.

I'm a biologist. Thanks for confirming my opinion is an expert one.

My point was meant to be how easily people disregard science they don't like, by using unscientific methods. Not the science behind gender itself, which is part of psychology which in itself isn't a hard science. I say that while holding a bach in psychology, which was a joke to get. My personal position is I don't know what's going on in some else's head nor do I care what they do to address those feelings. So whatever, really. If I had to stand for a position i'd say gender reassignment to too easily decided these days, especially in young children but i really dont care enough so research the issue to a great degree. Hence my final position of, I don't really know. I'm fine with not knowing things, especially when they concern something as complicated as the human mind.

[Runenwächter]

I'm a biologist. Thanks for confirming my opinion is an expert one.

My point was meant to be how easily people disregard science they don't like, by using unscientific methods. Not the science behind gender itself, which is part of psychology which in itself isn't a hard science. I say that while holding a bach in psychology, which was a joke to get. My personal position is I don't know what's going on in some else's head nor do I care what they do to address those feelings. So whatever, really. If I had to stand for a position i'd say gender reassignment to too easily decided these days, especially in young children but i really dont care enough so research the issue to a great degree. Hence my final position of, I don't really know. I'm fine with not knowing things, especially when they concern something as complicated as the human mind.

Well I'm a Mil Mi-24 attack helicopter and let me tell you I am so sick of my physical frame being appropriated as a gender. Just in case someone brings it up, kindly refer to my expertise as a totes legit internet helicopter. Other than that, no disagreement.

[Toxsins]

Here is Sam Harris on the issue of race and IQ for whomever might be interested:

Quick explanation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGp06vMPERE

Long explanation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1lEPQYQk8s

[Jakexe]

Well I'm a Mil Mi-24 attack helicopter and let me tell you I am so sick of my physical frame being appropriated as a gender. Just in case someone brings it up, kindly refer to my expertise as a totes legit internet helicopter. Other than that, no disagreement.

And here I was hoping for an intelligent conversion.

[Techno-Druid]

The race realists are ultimately why I find the Alt-Right pants on head dumb and unable to really achieve what they claim. But a lot of youtubers have decided its a thing worth obsessing over.

I have no problem admitting that different countries have different IQ levels or at genetics may influence IQ to an extent, but to use it to justify social policies like immigration echo back to the times where Irish, Southern Italian and Eastern European immigrants were thought to be less intelligent and subject to social bigotry.

Even with measuring intelligence, Ethiopia has a lower IQ than many other African countries, African countries that were relatively primitive like Zamibia. However, those who know a thing or two about Ethiopia know that Africa's first original script, Ge'az arose from Ethiopia. Coffee and donkeys were domesticated in Ethiopia among other indigenous crops.

The Askum Empire even tried to conquer Mecca (at that time inhabited by Arab pagans) for Ethiopian Orthodox Christianity.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_of_the_Elephant

[Super Kami Dende]

For as long as the Far left continues spouting stupid shit like Anti-Vaccination, 72 Genders, Healthy at any weight or any other such anti-science nonsense as well, they really are just being as retarded as the far Right anti-science people. Thus It's mostly a pot meet kettle situation.

[Independent voter]

10 years ago I thought access to information via the internet would make the ignorant people more informed, but instead they made the information become more ignorant.

-- Some random dude on reddit

[vhatever]

10 years ago I thought access to information via the internet would make the ignorant people more informed, but instead they made the information become more ignorant.

-- Some random dude on reddit

The irony of it being posted on Reddit....

[cface]

For as long as the Far left continues spouting stupid shit like Anti-Vaccination, 72 Genders, Healthy at any weight or any other such anti-science nonsense as well, they really are just being as retarded as the far Right anti-science people. Thus It's mostly a pot meet kettle situation.

It seems to me, that all these Alt-movements, needs someone to bash, not to discuss with. Alt-left and Alt-right have been at it for a long time. 10 years ago, the left was really good in Norway, but increasingly, they just kept attacking regular people for absolutely no reason. They didn't want a debate. Most people just thought of them of being too passionate in their stance.
What worked for me is to give them no attention, cause if you did, what would that do? You can't convince them, cause they're not ready for that. You can't lock them up, that would be silly. Eventually, I think most of them will just grow tired. But no need to attack them

[KrazyK923]

Kraut and Tea, Sargon, Harmful Opinions and TL;DR and Naked Ape are at least people who try to avoid unrelated drama

Rofl give me a fucking break here. Sargon, HO, and TL;DR made themselves off of pointless drama bullshit like going after Anita Sarkeesian 24/7 and whining about retarded things people say on Twitter.. Sargon is the biggest joke of all, who throws fits and tantrums every time somebody attacks him while he then makes videos talking about how people are snowflakes and need thicker skin.

[Mormolyce]

The "skeptic community" as they like to call themselves have long been a thinly veiled front for the far right. Basically a recruitment tool now that they realise they can't rely on Christians for their voter base anymore.

Without getting too much into it because race threads are forbidden. She cited the Daily Stormer and when a few other fellow Youtubers tried to open up dialogue with her, she accused them of "virtue signalling" (a word that has lost all meaning).

"Virtue signalling" is a weird kind of Orwellian doublespeak. It's a derogatory term for virtue. I mean think about that for a minute.

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The Skeptic community is a term used by some to describe anti-SJW Youtubers like Armoured Skeptic, Amazing Atheist, Sargon of Akkad, etc. They mainly make video rebuttals against SJWs.

They self-identify as "rationalists" or "skeptics" because once upon a time they were making anti-religion videos. But now they spend almost all their time bashing feminists and propping up the party of the religious right.

the only "science" i deny is the pseudo science spat out by idiots speaking about gender.

that's not science in the least.

I eagerly await the studies you can cite me to that effect.

Because last I checked gender identity was an ongoing area of research within a number of fields of science.

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being a woman and realizing i am inclined to some feminine things that guys typically aren't inclined to? not denying reality.

your gender does effect things you like to a degree, that's all there is to it. there's only two of them, corresponding to the only two sexes we have. it's that simple.

So your personal experiences enable you to speak for 7.3 billion people? That's super handy, I guess we don't need science at all anymore, we can just as you how you feel about every subject.

Rational skepticism in action!

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It seems to me, that all these Alt-movements, needs someone to bash, not to discuss with. Alt-left and Alt-right have been at it for a long time. 10 years ago, the left was really good in Norway, but increasingly, they just kept attacking regular people for absolutely no reason. They didn't want a debate. Most people just thought of them of being too passionate in their stance.
What worked for me is to give them no attention, cause if you did, what would that do? You can't convince them, cause they're not ready for that. You can't lock them up, that would be silly. Eventually, I think most of them will just grow tired. But no need to attack them

Do you mean far left and far right? There is no "alt left". The whole left is already alternative.