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  1. #141
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Bicycle is not cleaner than a horse. You need oil for it to operate. You know as a lubricant for bearings and the chain. Not to mention metallurgy, plastics... you get the drill. Also when you ride a bicycle you produce more CO2 than just walking or riding a horse.
    What? Riding a bicycle is signifigantly more energy efficient per distance traveled. There is no way you produce more Co2 if you use a bike to cover a given distance than you do if you walk. And a healthy human is more energy efficient for long distance travel than a horse is, so the same concept would apply.

    As for materials? You think saddles appear out of thin air? A full set of horse riding equipment is going to set you back a thousand dollars easy, and that is probably on the cheap end. You will need saddle, bridle, reins, saddle blanket and likely other things i am forgetting. Those have a production cost and maintenance cost as well. Hell, a full set of horseshoes alone probably contain more metal than my bike does.

    Meanwhile, you can get a high quality general use bike for around 500 bucks. A well made properly maintained bicycle probably costs you less in maintenance than a horse would, especially considering you don't need to feed a bike. And oil? Lol. You probably use about as much oil oiling a pair of leather riding chaps as you would oiling a bike chain / gears in a year.

    Also, you don't need to make bikes entirely out of metal. Composite Laminate Wood Fiber and Bamboo can be used to make bike frames that are environmentally friendly and just as durable as anything made of modern metals. Helll, these guys will even teach you how to build a bamboo bike frame from the comfort of your own home.
    Last edited by Surfd; 2017-07-06 at 03:02 PM.

  2. #142
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Electric engines are widely used for public transportation since invention of electric engines, I dunno, at least 50 years. It's the only efficient way to use electric engines as transportation. Instead of putting heavy batteries (that need recharging) in each vehicle you build electric lines along the roads - and public transport is attached to these lines at all times, drawing electricity from the city's energy grid directly.
    That kind of infrastructure is expensive to build and maintain. It also restrains vehicle size and design. It also looks bad.

  3. #143
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    What is cleaner than a horse? Do you get it now? If you set your goal to "clean" this is what you get. Electric engines are not clean, they are just a bit cleaner, and less powerful - do you see the trend?
    Horses produce lots of methane gas and shit... how exactly would that be clearer than an electric engine?

  4. #144
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    I like that we are trying to move away from draining this planet dry but I live where electric cars dont fare to well.
    Today is Beautiful and so are you, here's to having a wonderful day.

  5. #145
    Quote Originally Posted by Linkedblade View Post
    Highest speed limit in the US is 85 mph (137 kmh). Top speed is impractical.

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    Ok, how about other vehicular metrics? In which category is a horse better than an electric car?

  6. #146
    The Unstoppable Force Ghostpanther's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    It's not misleading. The phasing out process involves moving to electric engines via both hybrid and electric engines, which was explained in the OP. That's why they're phasing out the combustion engine, not immediately stopping the use of them.
    Yeah. Agree. And it is a good goal to shoot for at least.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mormolyce View Post
    Don't all electric car engines have a combustion backup?

    If your car breaks down you could hitch it to a horse so technically we never phased out the horse and carriage too.
    I think there may be ones which only have a electric engine. Could be wrong however.

  7. #147
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post

    That was not even my point. But do you really need such acceleration for your grocery runs?

    Your point was the logical step after moving to electric engines is to go back to horses.
    I simply referred to the fact that horses are in all aspects inferior to electric cars, even in the most irrelevant categories such as acceleration and top speed.
    It probably would have been easier to call your argument fallacious due to appeal to the extreme, then denying the antecedent and then argument from fallacy, but I'm in a good mood today.

  8. #148
    Quote Originally Posted by The Jabberwock View Post
    And, again, so fucking what? Who gives a shit what you do in relation to the discussion at hand?

    So you like to destroy the environment for fun. Bully for you.
    I'm not sure if that's a sarcasm or what.

  9. #149
    Quote Originally Posted by Eazy View Post
    I'm not sure if that's a sarcasm or what.
    It wasn't. I was saying that who gives a fuck if you like being an asshole. It has zero relevance to the conversation at hand.

    "Derp, I liek to tear up terrain and burn fossil fuelz in obnoxious engeenz for FUN, yo! Ergo, electric cars are dum!!!"

  10. #150
    Quote Originally Posted by The Jabberwock View Post
    It wasn't. I was saying that who gives a fuck if you like being an asshole. It has zero relevance to the conversation at hand.

    "Derp, I liek to tear up terrain and burn fossil fuelz in obnoxious engeenz for FUN, yo! Ergo, electric cars are dum!!!"
    That quote... aren't you kinda overreacting too much? You didn't get the point of my post - it was simple(but it seems it could be too complex for some ) - electric cars are not better in every aspect.

    Anyway - Who are you to judge my decissions? No one.

  11. #151
    Quote Originally Posted by Eazy View Post
    That quote... aren't you kinda overreacting too much? You didn't get the point of my post - it was simple(but it seems it could be too complex for some ) - electric cars are not better in every aspect.
    Except that they are in every practical aspect. Your asinine hobby is not and, again, has zero relevance in the discussion at hand. If you want to point out obscure, destructive, and/or pointless uses for things as redeeming aspects for those things, you'd be every bit as idiotic then, too.

    Anyway - Who are you to judge my decissions? No one.
    Hypocrite much? Nevermind, given your "hobby," the answer is already clear enough.

  12. #152
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Several cities will have such temperatures throughout the year. It may only be for a few days but still, it will happen. Heck I think this year all of Europe had cities record -20 C at some point and in many places for more than a week.
    What ?
    You do realize a good third of Europe consider even -10°C to be abysmally low ?
    I've not seen anything below -10°C such temperature for more than a 25 years, and I've NEVER seen -20°C.
    Quote Originally Posted by Elim Garak View Post
    Electric engines are widely used for public transportation since invention of electric engines, I dunno, at least 50 years.
    Make that 120 more. Tramways existed before 1900.
    Last edited by Akka; 2017-07-06 at 05:28 PM.

  13. #153
    Quote Originally Posted by The Jabberwock View Post
    Except that they are in every practical aspect. Your asinine hobby is not and, again, has zero relevance in the discussion at hand. If you want to point out obscure, destructive, and/or pointless uses for things as redeeming aspects for those things, you'd be every bit as idiotic then, too.
    You just did add practical word. But still - my point stands. No matter if you're going to change what you've written already.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Jabberwock View Post
    Hypocrite much? Nevermind, given your "hobby," the answer is already clear enough.
    It has nothing to do with hypocrisy, learn what that word means first.

  14. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baikalsan View Post

    Please open a shipping company with trucks and go all electric. And then when you completely failed after 1 week I just want to stand there and laugh at you.

    This blind fanboyism for electric is such nonsense. You mention ONE part of a car and say that it is efficient (100% is wrong anyway). You just forgot to mention the shitty batteries...........
    If you had read what I said before in another post about electric cars and me never owning one because battery and charging issues..... but this is mmo-champ, I can't expect people to read previous posts. Electric engines give 100% of their pull power right off the bat, Gasoline/diesel engines do not. Simple fact.

  15. #155
    Deleted
    What is sad about electric cars is that it will kill the car culture, or at least what is left of it.

  16. #156
    Quote Originally Posted by Nymrohd View Post
    Eh OK. Though I doubt it would change anything for you:

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Januar...pean_cold_wave
    So again we are talking about the very minority of the minority since it's the poorest regions of europe plus you are still making the assumptions of how tech will be standing still. I can imagine that car manufactures will look into how to best deal with cold overall since that's part of being in a competitive market.

    But just for argument sake lets talk about the weather conditions like if that was the norm that effected not just eastern Europe but the entire Europe and for 3 months and not just a few days a year.

    It may have been called global warming at some point and idiots may have brought in snowballs to congress to wonder why their was snow outside but wouldn't reducing our extreme weathers be a good goal to have? It's called climate change now because the extreme heat results in the extreme cold.

    Electric and hybrids is the small step in reducing these emissions but since it's also attitude change we need to do these kind of things where we look at alternative powers.

    Also in regards to those studies that talk about power generation. Unless you are a right-wing wanker that literally wanks on coal most countries are stepping away from coal because it's just expensive plus even including the manufacturing studies show that overall still less pollution over the course of it's lifetime.

    Their is no logical reason to be against electric cars development, everything including price and limitations will be fixed over time like any other tech. One of the next major thing companies are investing are in SSD batteries for example, that's a perfect for cars but also smarthphones so in essence development one way or another won't ever stop.

    We started with electric cars btw which got overtaken cars with a internal combustion engine and now the tech allows us to get back to electric between now and a few years.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Scubaskot View Post
    What is sad about electric cars is that it will kill the car culture, or at least what is left of it.
    climate change will kill car culture, seriously what's wrong with people in wanting to live in a city that doesn't allow cars to be driven because of smog issues

  17. #157
    Bold move, but I feel too early.
    Investment in and production of I can understand, but putting your eggs in one basket with a reliance on that.
    That is risky, and I am not confident it will pay off.
    There are too many heavily invested in fossil fuels to let them go, no matter the benefits.
    Quote Originally Posted by DeadmanWalking View Post
    Your forgot to include the part where we blame casuals for everything because blizzard is catering to casuals when casuals got jack squat for new content the entire expansion, like new dungeons and scenarios.
    Quote Originally Posted by Reinaerd View Post
    T'is good to see there are still people valiantly putting the "Ass" in assumption.

  18. #158
    Quote Originally Posted by ComputerNerd View Post
    Bold move, but I feel too early.
    Investment in and production of I can understand, but putting your eggs in one basket with a reliance on that.
    That is risky, and I am not confident it will pay off.
    There are too many heavily invested in fossil fuels to let them go, no matter the benefits.
    Well, yeah, it's 25 years in the future, that's not that early at all...

  19. #159
    Quote Originally Posted by Scubaskot View Post
    What is sad about electric cars is that it will kill the car culture, or at least what is left of it.
    Autonomous cars will kill car culture. You won't have to spend half your paycheck on car payments and insurance because you can have a car pull up to your house and pick you up for less than the cost of a coffee. Companies like Uber are drooling over this. Electric cars are just more efficient and will replace gas in the long run, but they aren't as big a change as self driving is.

    I think it's an overwhelmingly positive thing. Cars killed horse culture. I'm sure many people thought that was a bad thing then. But the people who like horses still can have horses, so I'm pretty sure car culture will be fine. Not everyone wants to be part of the car culture. It's very expensive and time consuming.

    I suppose killed is to harsh a word. It will become much less pervasive.
    Last edited by Zmaniac17; 2017-07-07 at 12:18 AM.

  20. #160
    Quote Originally Posted by Flarelaine View Post
    I suspect it is not unrelated to the fact that Europe and Japan leapt headfirst into electric car tech while Detroit decided to just bad-mouth it instead. Add pre-existing notions of the superiority of American cars and you can see stateside reluctance.

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    That bit I could never understood. Maybe because I've grown up around noisy Eastern Bloc cars? For whatever reason, I've always felt that a good car must feel effortless and therefore must be quiet.
    Try an actual well made performance car.
    1) Load the amount of weight I would deadlift onto the bench
    2) Unrack
    3) Crank out 15 reps
    4) Be ashamed of constantly skipping leg day

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