Battle for Azeroth Alpha/Beta General Discussion

[Teriz]

But they could be smaller. Naga are somehow elves, too. We could call the new race frog people.

Anyone thinking we will fight humans in new expansion? Something like.. Kul'Tiras is now bad.. something like WoD, just for the alliance? Kul Tiras has a big hate for the horde and seeing the alliance teaming up with the horde against the legion might get them mad (also Jaina and Theramore). Bosses are the whole Proudmoore clan, with Jaina and Daelin as Raidbosses? Jaina could take Dalaran as a Raid Dungeon.. so many possibilities!

The divide between Kul'Tiras and the Alliance could also be fueled by the naivety of King Anduin, and his desire for peace between the factions.

[munkeyinorbit]

This comment is lore-wise absolutely ridiculous.

EVERY (!!!) Old God we fought was either weakened, trapped or dead. N'zoth, if we'll deal with him, is neither weakened nor trapped nor dead.

You must be new to WoW. Let me explain it to you. You were correct until Blizzard retconned the old gods to make them into something we would not even consider a real threat anymore. There use to be hundreds of Old Gods vs Sageras threads until Chronicles. Blizzard laid that argument to rest. Old Gods are not that much of a threat. A raid end boss? Why not, we had Xavius. But an expansion? Come on now, you are better than that. When the Old Gods were super powerful, they still were not an expansion headline. Now that they are weak as fuck people expect them to suddenly become an expansion headline? People have to stop thinking with their hearts and start thinking with their heads. Just because your hearts tell you that an Old God expansion would be cool doesn't mean you are right. Think back to the last time you thought like this. Don't remember? Warlords of Draenor.

[Inukashi]

The divide between Kul'Tiras and the Alliance could also be fueled by the inexperience of Anduin, and his desire for peace between the factions.

And the hate for the scourge, with them leading the Horde now somehow (didn't play for some month, so I may not be uptodate)

So Kul'Tiras might team up with the naga.. or fight them .. or use them.. somehow like Orcs and Sha as two races in MoP.

And the new Race is some Fish people as peaceful race and suffering from Naga and Kul Tiras, like the Panda in Mop and we might get them as new race!

Maybe some Worgen might join Kul'Tiras, too. Including Greymane?

[seleri]

Uh, why can't we have all of that AND new races?

An expansion where the main "new" feature is that you can be a brown Orc that stands up straight doesn't sound all that exciting, nor does it do a good job of drawing in new and old players.

Pretty much this. At least WoD model update affected all races more or less equally (except goblins/worgen but those are Soon™ right guys?). Sub-races would be awesome for a lot of current races but for others it only amounts to a change in skin/eye color or some tattoos. I really want sub-races but they should go along with a new race not replace them.

[SilverCoin]

World of Warcraft: Wrath of the Witch Queen?

[Teriz]

And the hate for the scourge, with them leading the Horde now somehow (didn't play for some month, so I may not be uptodate)

So Kul'Tiras might team up with the naga.. or fight them .. or use them.. somehow like Orcs and Sha as two races in MoP.

And the new Race is some Fish people as peaceful race and suffering from Naga and Kul Tiras, like the Panda in Mop and we might get them as new race!

Maybe some Worgen might join Kul'Tiras, too. Including Greymane?

Yeah, I could imagine Sylvannas wanting some payback on Greymane for ruining her plans. The bad blood between the Worgen and the Forsaken could easily lead to a full-blown faction war.

[Hitei]

You seem to have completely misunderstood my point. I'm not asking for them to shove lore in my face, I'm asking for them to build the Void Lords up, make them do something noteworthy, make me care about killing them, because currently, large chunks of the playerbase don't. A few allusions to the existence of something and/or said thing's "unseen plots" isn't the kind of development they need.

Let's look at two of the hallmark "big bad" factions in Warcraft:
Burning Legion:
-1st Invasion led to the sundering of the Azerothian supercontinent. The fall of one of the greatest empires in Azeroth's history, etc.
-Used the Orcish Horde as a vanguard, effectively kickstarting the story of the franchise (retconned in, I know).
-Created the Scourge to serve as a vanguard for their invasion.
-Wiped out Dalaran
-Felwood
etc.

The list could go on, but they've made an obvious and noteworthy impact on Azeroth. Their actions have shaped and changed the world.

Scourge:
-Wiped out Lordaeron
-Defiled a very large chunk of the Northern Eastern Kingdoms
-Helped wipe out Dalaran
-Severely damaged Silvermoon. Defiled the Sunwell. Started the mana addiction of the then-High Elves. Driving force behind the name change.
-Indirectly contributed to the repelling of the Burning Legion (Arthas & Illidan Skull of Gul'dan dialogue)

What have the Void Lords/Void done save for act indirectly through Old Gods? Why should players care? Some find themselves struggling to care about Old Gods at this point, due to their indirect nature.

What has Sargeras done save for act indirectly through Kil'Jaeden, Archimonde and the other highers ups of the Legion? It seems a bit unfair to generic the entire hierarchy of the Legion into a single entity, but expect that Void Lords specifically be examined. The question is "What have the forces of the void done?"

The Void
-Destroyed the Ethereal Homeworld
-Transformed Queen Azshara and most of the highborne into the Naga
-Corrupted the Emerald Dream, creating the Emerald Nightmare
-Created Humans, Dwarves and Gnomes through the Curse of Flesh
-Ruled the entire planet in the distant past
-Drove Neltharion insane, creating Deathwing
--Caused the cataclysm through the above
-Captured Ahn'Qiraj and fought the War of Shifting Sands
-Infested the World Soul, creating the Well of Eternity when removed
--And thus creating Night Elves and allowing for Sargeras to find Azeroth

The Void Lords acting through the Old Gods have had far more of an impact than the scourge, and as much of an impact as the Legion. The forces of the void have always been the main antagonist of World of Warcraft right alongside the Legion. Just because we've started to learn that there is meaning behind the chaos, and that those actions are part of a far bigger, far more dangerous scheme, doesn't just invalidate everything those enemy forces have done. Void Lords is just another name to put on those events now that we better know who is really in control.

You must be new to WoW. Let me explain it to you. You were correct until Blizzard retconned the old gods to make them into something we would not even consider a real threat anymore. There use to be hundreds of Old Gods vs Sageras threads until Chronicles. Blizzard laid that argument to rest. Old Gods are not that much of a threat. A raid end boss? Why not, we had Xavius. But an expansion? Come on now, you are better than that. When the Old Gods were super powerful, they still were not an expansion headline. Now that they are weak as fuck people expect them to suddenly become an expansion headline? People have to stop thinking with their hearts and start thinking with their heads. Just because your hearts tell you that an Old God expansion would be cool doesn't mean you are right. Think back to the last time you thought like this. Don't remember? Warlords of Draenor.

The power level of the Old Gods hasn't really changed at all. They were never about being some unstoppable destructive force who could kill anyone and fight Sargeras 1 on 1. It was always about their persistence and inescapable corruption. The Titans cannot handle the Old Gods. The entire pantheon together could not figure out a way to purge the 4-5 Old Gods on Azeroth from the world soul, every containment they set up has failed or is on the verge of failing. Every form of protector or vassal they have left on the world has been successfully corrupted. Even the one God they killed, Y'shaarj, only needed a touch from the healing waters of the Vale of Eternal Blossoms to be brought back into a state of partial life powerful enough to reacquire consciousness. C'thun has been "killed" three times now. Yogg-Saron is various obviously not completely dead.

The Old Gods are not something to be underestimated, and they are far, far beyond our power level to handle without serious help or the advantage of catching one in a severely weakened state--and even then all we can manage is delaying them.

They are very much an expansion headline. Cataclysm is an expansion about what happens when the minions of a capable Old God are let loose.

[Wildberry]

What has Sargeras done save for act indirectly through Kil'Jaeden, Archimonde and the other highers ups of the Legion? It seems a bit unfair to generic the entire hierarchy of the Legion into a single entity, but expect that Void Lords specifically be examined. The question is "What have the forces of the void done?"

Is it though? We don't know any particular Void Lord, we've seen no interaction between the Old Gods and their supposed masters, whereas Sargeras has had direct involvement with the Burning Legion. Since the inception of the Burning Legion, Sargeras has been its master. Old Gods (in real time, of course, not canon) predate the Void Lords, and we really already have an issue with the Old Gods being too indirect. A recently introduced force that may, or may not be actively coordinating with the Old Gods isn't really that interesting to a number of people.

[Nyel]

You must be new to WoW. Let me explain it to you. You were correct until Blizzard retconned the old gods to make them into something we would not even consider a real threat anymore. There use to be hundreds of Old Gods vs Sageras threads until Chronicles. Blizzard laid that argument to rest. Old Gods are not that much of a threat. A raid end boss? Why not, we had Xavius. But an expansion? Come on now, you are better than that. When the Old Gods were super powerful, they still were not an expansion headline. Now that they are weak as fuck people expect them to suddenly become an expansion headline? People have to stop thinking with their hearts and start thinking with their heads. Just because your hearts tell you that an Old God expansion would be cool doesn't mean you are right. Think back to the last time you thought like this. Don't remember? Warlords of Draenor.

I hated WoD from the moment it was revealed. It was horrible in nearly every aspect. That doesn't mean an Old God expansion can't happen. It can and it will especially when the Old God we're talking about is connected to the Void. It really doesn't matter though, I think an N'zoth expansion would be the interlude to the upcoming Void expansion and nothing as big as Legion and Argus / Sargeras itself.

And your argument with the new "lore cannon" established by Blizzard... why does it make N'zoth weak(er)? Just because he's not on the same level as Sargeras? He's still the only Old God that seems to have retained it's power and is going to free himself from everything that tied him to his prison.

__________________

I think a Kul'tiras themed expansion makes sense not only due to it being time finally finding its way into the game but because of the Jaina storyline that ended on a cliffhanger and hasn't evolved yet. Jaina and Anduin are friends, maybe even more than that. Anduin might consider Jaina as his "sister" when we think about their relationship. A grown up Anduin and a Savage-Mode-Jaina could make a nice (Alliance-centered) theme for the expansion. The counterpart on the Horde will be Sylvanas finally reuniting with (Void) Alleria.

[SkyTides]

eee exciting! expac hype threads are my favourite All I have to say is, Blizz have gone to quite some effort to fit those maps, tentacles and barnacles on the gear - they are actually pretty small when viewed normally. So I'm hoping this is a big hint to an Azshara themed 8.0.

[Zulkhan]

Are you saying the dude on reddit that leaked the expansion is a liar and he made it up?

Oh not really...

I hope so, but let me put things this way: While the Azshara-crowd has a track record of failure (bigger than Vol'jin's ), I was on the "Iron Horde datamining means nothing"-train. I was stupid enough to think we wouldn't be killing any more Orcs after Pandaria. I'm a little more sensitive to these sorts of things.

Regardless, fingers crossed for a miracle.

The Iron Horde was a rather unpredictable development and even though it may have been treated as a case of "well, this is too absurd to be true" when it's that unpredictable than there's surely reasons to worry, excatly because is unlikely that someone came up with something that weird rather than ideas that are bloody predictable exactly because they try to walk the "safe" route to sound "legit and plausible".

In this case though, all we got is a bunch of unsubstantiated hints that could literally mean shit and a "leak" that stinks of horseshit by a mile. I'll not pretend to know the future but I need more to start panicking.

[mingarrubia]

Nope, they've put that in the game just to throw us off. The next expansion is going to take place in the outer space.

[TriHard]

Holy shit, people gotta fight about the most stupid shit these days.

I for one am pretty sure this is for 8.0
I don't think there'll be another major content patch after 7.3
And pretty sure they said it would be the last raid of the expansion.

[In Ogres We Trust]

Holy shit, people gotta fight about the most stupid shit these days.

I for one am pretty sure this is for 8.0
I don't think there'll be another major content patch after 7.3
And pretty sure they said it would be the last raid of the expansion.

I can see them doing a "bridge" area like the Timeless Isle post-release of the Argus raid.

[Aeula]

Hope we can finally kill Jaina in said expansion.

[TriHard]

I can see them doing a "bridge" area like the Timeless Isle post-release of the Argus raid.

Well, yeah. I can see something like that happening too, but I don't think it'll be on the Ruby Sanctum level though.

- - - Updated - - -

Hope we can finally kill Jaina in said expansion.

If you see those tendrils on the Kul Tiras clothing, it kinda makes it seem like they're worshiping N'zoth in particular. Maybe he's taken control of Kul Tiras as well as Jaina at this point.

[Aeula]

Well, yeah. I can see something like that happening too, but I don't think it'll be on the Ruby Sanctum level though.

- - - Updated - - -



If you see those tendrils on the Kul Tiras clothing, it kinda makes it seem like they're worshiping N'zoth in particular. Maybe he's taken control of Kul Tiras as well as Jaina at this point.

Might be she willingly allied with them to attack the horde.

[purebalance]

Seems likely that it'll be a Naga based expansion since we know we need to deal the N'zoth soon, before we move on to the Void Lords, and we know that Azshara is up to something in the Tomb.

She wasn't. They wanted the Tidestone to take it away from the tomb. So if placing them was supposed to release Nzoth, then yeah..... If it wasn't supposed to release him, we still know why her forces were in the tomb so your statement makes 0 sense.

Also, 2 hacks of villains can't carry an expansion for the millionth time. Nzoth is still recovering from getting his ass beat by Yshaarj and Azshara is pitiful after losing her exclusive well access.

[RuneDK]

Seems likely that it'll be a Naga based expansion since we know we need to deal the N'zoth soon, before we move on to the Void Lords, and we know that Azshara is up to something in the Tomb.

I think it will be a void lord expansion with Azshara/N'zoth taking the front seat of the first tier.

[My User Name]

Void Lord #1 created supposedly created an Old God who supposedly created humans and dwarves? Orly? Who gives a fuck.

Void Lord #1 created an Old God who is currently a virus infecting Azeroth and there is a risk of Azeroth's world-soul turning into a Dark Titan which would be the end of all of us if the Old God in question isn't stopped.

There, a reason to give a fuck.

Also what's up with this "why should we care" bullshit? Almost every expansion started with an invasion. Wrath started with Undead Invasions in Org/SW which is the main reason why we left off for Northrend (we could have left earlier). Cata started with Elemental invasions. WoD started with Iron Horde invasions. Legion started with demon invasions.

8.0. will most likely start with Naga/Old God invasions. You can't just sit there and say "I don't give a fuck" if there is an invasion just behind your doors.