Sunstrider Highguard in Azuremyst Isle
Why are you trying to argue when you make it blatantly obvious if you ever did read any book with Alleria you forgot her character?Yeah, see, hating on an entire species because of one individual isn't nowhere near hating on an entire species for most of that species allying with orcs.
She's an undead testing deadly diseases on the living, mostly innocent humans she captured from Hillsbrad since Vanilla. Spin that whatever way you want, it doesn't get any less evil. When the Alliance destroyed Taurajo everyone was up in arms yet the Forsaken fanboys seem to forgive Sylvanas for targeting farmers.
I love this argument
"They are Alliance, and immediately innocent. It didn't matter that they fought the forsaken since vanilla. Innocent Innocent innocent!
its really terrible how she forces people and doesn't give them a choice.They are twisting souls, that is evil and always will be.
You mean "the only atrocities are the ones I didn't commit" guy? Garrosh only hated Sylvanas and the Val'kyr because it ruined his plans." Isn't it obvious, Warchief? I server the Horde. "
Not even Garrosh believed that shite. Neither should you.
also stop using a sarcastic response as "see? SHES EVUL!!1"
Given how the farmers in the region formed a militia against the Forsaken, where's your source for the ones that have been captured being innocent?
Wat.
Are you people seriously still using Sylvanas sarcastically shit talking to Garrosh as any real argument?
Well she's not "pro-Sons of Lothar" as she's counted among their roster. Khadgar, too, was always more willing to extend an olive branch and at least try to understand his previous opponents (given the relative quickness of him striking up a friendship with Garona). As for her loyalty to Quel'thalas, didn't she essentially disobey her king to prove a point by helping the Alliance in WC2 despite Anasterian not believing the Horde threat was a legitimate reason to call in the debt he owed to the Arathi? Not to say she's not loyal to Quel'thalas, but this kind of stands in contrast to your portrayal of her loyalties.
I don't recall Gruul ever being considered a hero of the Alliance and a marquee Alliance in WC2: TD, I think I'll have to go back and re-play it. I don't recall Gruul even being a character, and that seems like a huge lore concern. I do remember Alleria being an Alliance hero, but maybe that's a fever dream brought on by following odd chains of logic laced with directionless sarcasm too often.
So when the city was being rebuilt at the end of the Second War, the survivors and returning refugees of that war along with their leaders decide to erect immense stone statues of who they view as heroes of said war - and that means absolutely nothing? Sounds reasonable.
Or it's data-mined PTR dialogue and some of it may be missing or unfinished. There seemed to be an odd jump/cut in the conversation to me, possibly indicating there is more to it (like a minor in-game cutscene or recap of events) not currently present in the data. Difficult to say until we see something closer to the final product.
And in that retelling she would probably put more of a spotlight on the Alliance's failure to stop or respond to Arthas, their failures to protect Quel'thalas, etc. etc. Partisanship doesn't require complete dishonesty, as I'm sure you're well aware - it is less about upfront deceit and more about the portrayal of the truth while omitting certain factors (like, for example, Arthas the Death Knight operating at the behest of an Orcish spirit in the form of Ner'zhul). Details that weren't known then but are certainly known now - and a detail that might color Alleria's take on the Horde. That's just one example of how the above narrative could be spun to put a favorable light on the current Horde and a negative one on the Alliance. Vereesa, of course, is going to do much the same except tilted to the Alliance - excusing their many mistakes and missteps while demonizing the Horde and ensuring the the Old/New Horde split is minimized. You and I both know how the game is played.
"We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see." ― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead
How about we put an end to the olympics of twisting the storyline in favour of personal flavour and check out how Blizzard defines the character's own feelings about the situation?
Arator the Redeemer: No doubt my mother will soon ask about Sylvanas. What are you going to tell her?
Vereesa Windrunner: It is a conversation I know we must have, but the thought of it fills me with dread. How can I explain to Alleria what our sister has become? The truth will break her heart.
Alleria Windrunner: I must know, Vereesa. What fate befell our sister?
Vereesa Windrunner: Give me a moment. I will do my best to explain...
Alleria Windrunner: Impossible! I refuse to believe she now leads the Horde. Not after all they did to our people during the war.
Last edited by Magnagarde; 2017-07-08 at 02:40 PM.
"I hail from Westfall, far to the south... as do these men that travel with me. We are farmers, and nothing more.
I had been told that Lordaeron had been healed, and that it was ready for tilling. However, this "Commander" now tells me that it's too dangerous to proceed. He says that there's a war going on, and that the plaguelands still aren't healed.
Before anything else, I need to get some food in my men's stomachs. Anything will do. Bear seems to be plentiful.
---//--//---
I told Commander Valorfist that we could hold our own, and we intend to. I had a little conversation with the death knight general, Thassarian, on my way over here. We farmers plan to help in our own way.
We will take control of this farm, begin to cultivate the land... and then when the battle for Andorhal commences, we will attack the Forsaken from the rear. They'll never expect it.
First, we need to get rid of these Forsaken outriders. Kill some, then return to me."
http://wow.gamepedia.com/Thurman_Grant
Hardly their lands.
I think they're referring to the Scarlet Crusade farmers in Tirisfal Glades. Scarlet Crusade.
Also, BLIZZARD GIVE ME THOSE BLOOD ELF SHOULDERS ALREADY FOR CRYING OUT LOUD!!! I NEED TO HAVE THAT SUNSTRIDER HIGHGUARD AS MY XMOG!!! (And let blood elf paladins xmog the Blood-Tempered Ranseur polearm onto a 1h weapon)
That doesn't really change a thing, since sylvanas with her own personal Alleria like moment wanted to wipe out all of humanity, for spawning Arthas.
Which once again hammers home how messed up that damn windrunner family is . Bunch of genocidal maniacs, the lot of them.
There's also the dwarven test subject in the basement of Brill's inn, but since there aren't (or weren't in Vanilla) any Forsaken strongholds by Khaz Modan, my inference is that the dwarf prisoner was captured from Dun Garok in Hillsbrad, perhaps in the course of the hostilities between Tarren Mill and Southshore, with Dun Garok backing them up, or he just wandered too close to Tirisfal Glades, which he shouldn't have been doing.
Nothing morally wrong with being an enemy combatant, but these test subjects were enemy combatants, so it's not like Sylvanas is traveling to the Care Bear land to capture innocent Care Bears and experiment on people who never did anything to her or her people or work against their interests.
Ehh. What's with married elf women and their racism?
Well we will get rid of it somehow.
Why? Everyone know Horde players love to follow Alliance races all the time. I mean all the non-orc Horde races are super developed.
Can I hope their starting zone will no longer suffer in TBC time after 8.0 hits?
Seems you forgot Alleria is pretty and gorgeous beauty with natural green eyes, Gruul's one ugly mofo. Ugly mofos do not get statues.
I mean, I literally don't even care about Alleria's supposed allegiances, I just hope that dialogue has more substance than that because, in all seriousness, Vereesa's worries about telling what Sylvanas has become merely leading to her being the Horde boss with no mention whatsoever of the whole fuckery she went through by the time Quel'Thalas was culled and sacked would be a show of utter hilarity.
It definitely would.
The bigger issue is that we now have the sister of the Horde's undead warchief, who happens to be an Alliance Second War hero, using the void essence obtained from a Naaru(most Alliance characters will surely want to have nothing to do with her once they find this out)... while her other sister is still with the Alliance together with her son, whom she had with the Alliance's supreme commander after Lothar's death. Why can't they just leave an easy conclusion to these elves. It always has to be some soap opera.
I think that's because everybody agrees that that's stupid, and only serves as a means for Blizzard to completely change Alleria and Turalyon's previous characterization if they want. I want patriotic Alleria and Alliance-paragon Turalyon. But what we're gonna get is Alleria brainwashed by Vereesa and Turalyon all about teamwork. And Blizzard can make Alleria not care about the blood/high elf schism so they don't have to take her anywhere near it by saying that after 1,000 years, she learned to care more about morals than reality. But hopefully with her doing void stuff, that's not the case. Blizzard is very inconsistent, so we'll see.
And I'm sure Turalyon being the high exarch probably got some boost from X'era to be so long-lived.
The Forsaken have been testing on people since Vanilla my dude. Sylvanas also killed Garithos and his men despite having a deal with them.
I don't know how blind people need to be to not see that she's evil. I mean, it doesn't get more obvious than killing peasants and forcing them into unlife.