Tomb of Sargeras Progression Thread

[stablon]

The fight has mechanic overlaps that are literally impossible to handle.

I love these extremely certain statements. Thank you for giving a break from the world first race and informing us!

[BiggestNoob]

They don't need to be competent. Use some GM tools to make their characters reasonably overpowered (not enough to oneshot crap but about two tiers higher than the content) and have a go.

But that requires competence in how to test things. I don't think anyone at Blizzard has the competence to do anything at all, but especially not build or use tools that would make it easy to test content.

Almost everything in Legion is or was bugged at some point, and despite almost all of it being reported in beta, it took months into release to get most things fixed, so even in taking player reports of bugs and fixing them is too competent for Blizzard.

[Twilight Cultist]

I forget whats the longest we've gone from the instance opening on Mythic/Heroic to the endboss dying in modern (MOP/WOD/Legion) times?

Mythic HFC opened on July 1st for EU and was cleared on July 16th by Method. But you have to take into consideration that HFC was a 13 boss raid. I would say that it is better to compare time to kill end bosses (since, obviously, there are always end bosses in a raid). Mythic Archimonde was killed in a little bit under 9 days.

I wonder if that means they hit a bug preventing progress past a certain point, or just "wah its too hard"

Top guilds (at least in the modern era) have never complained about a boss being too difficult. The only complaint that is ever made about an end boss (during progress) is that they are buggy or not tuned correctly (e.g. abilities literally one shotting people). Remember, the last boss in a raid on Mythic is the only boss never tested on PTR, so they are usually really buggy. Gul'dan last tier was praised for being relatively polished when top guilds reached him. It seems that is not the case for Kil'jaeden.

[VarianceWoW]

But that requires competence in how to test things. I don't think anyone at Blizzard has the competence to do anything at all, but especially not build or use tools that would make it easy to test content.

Almost everything in Legion is or was bugged at some point, and despite almost all of it being reported in beta, it took months into release to get most things fixed, so even in taking player reports of bugs and fixing them is too competent for Blizzard.

Blizzard definitely has an internal raid team composed of many former hardcore raiders that now work for blizzard doing various things.

[Frolk]

I sometimes wonder, does Blizzard beat it's own encounters internally before releasing them?

They do, but with godemode turned on.

So even if they get to enrage timer, they are fine.

[Deleted]

Anything past 3 ironfurs is just over the armorcap. Roar is good tho yes.

Wrong. Every single Stack increases Armor-DR%.

[Twdft]

But that requires competence in how to test things. I don't think anyone at Blizzard has the competence to do anything at all, but especially not build or use tools that would make it easy to test content.

Almost everything in Legion is or was bugged at some point, and despite almost all of it being reported in beta, it took months into release to get most things fixed, so even in taking player reports of bugs and fixing them is too competent for Blizzard.

Weather: a small leaf is fluttering in the wind for a brief moment
Plastkin: the world is ending in a giant thunderstorm right now

[Deleted]

How's UH in ToS? Better than Frost in terms of playability and overall... fun!?

[Vorkreist]

But that requires competence in how to test things. I don't think anyone at Blizzard has the competence to do anything at all, but especially not build or use tools that would make it easy to test content.

Almost everything in Legion is or was bugged at some point, and despite almost all of it being reported in beta, it took months into release to get most things fixed, so even in taking player reports of bugs and fixing them is too competent for Blizzard.

They only test the basic functionality of the extra mechanics with cheat mode characters. They can't really test how all that will work balance wise or more complicated mechanics scenarios in a real environment without actually using normal characters and best players in the world on them.

You can take any number of hardcore raiders bellow top 20-50 and you can let the test their hearts out. Theres still a very high chance even with months of testing they won't reproduce the same strategies/execution/scenarios that method or exorsus get to in 500 tries.

[FareweII]

Method started running splits it looks like? I assumed they did a few before Avatar again, but looking at wowprogress - last H KJ kill is from a week ago.

[BiggestNoob]

Blizzard definitely has an internal raid team composed of many former hardcore raiders that now work for blizzard doing various things.

If any company with even a tiny real impact in the world had as bad a QA as Blizzard, they could cause billions in damage. I highly doubt they have such a team (or that it's what you claim, because "hardcore" is literally meaningless because everyone thinks of themselves as hardcore and even most people in "hardcore" guilds are incredibly bad especially if they don't care enough to be good) and if they do, the entire team is, as one would expect from Blizzard, totally incompetent.

Weather: a small leaf is fluttering in the wind for a brief moment
Plastkin: the world is ending in a giant thunderstorm right now

You're not even good at hyperbole. I feel sorry for your life because being that bad at even simple literary devices means you're probably around 70 in the IQ department.

[durrtygoodz]

If any company with even a tiny real impact in the world had as bad a QA as Blizzard, they could cause billions in damage. I highly doubt they have such a team (or that it's what you claim, because "hardcore" is literally meaningless because everyone thinks of themselves as hardcore and even most people in "hardcore" guilds are incredibly bad especially if they don't care enough to be good) and if they do, the entire team is, as one would expect from Blizzard, totally incompetent.

<snip>
Infracted

[Temp name]

How's UH in ToS? Better than Frost in terms of playability and overall... fun!?

It does more dps than frost.
Fun we can't tell you, that depends on what you enjoy

[Deleted]

Libertad closed the gap after their ban was lifted and are now 7/9 also. Welcome back, I guess?

7/9 is relatively easy (for the real top guilds), they won't be competing for a good spot.

By the time they get up to par, the rest will be likely too far ahead of them.

[Tradu]

Praying to the TF/RNG gods on the way... thanks.

Not necessarily. In the early weeks it's a way of more or less guaranteeing that your important classes have the gear they need(tier, trinkets, relics), even without WF/TF. WF/TF obviously make it even more worth doing.

- - - Updated - - -

I wonder if that means they hit a bug preventing progress past a certain point, or just "wah its too hard"

Considering these are the 2 best guilds in the world talking, who have tons of experience with hard bosses, I'll go with it being a buggy mess(either making it directly impossible or just causing a frustrating amount of random wipes)

[Vorkreist]

If any company with even a tiny real impact in the world had as bad a QA as Blizzard, they could cause billions in damage. I highly doubt they have such a team (or that it's what you claim, because "hardcore" is literally meaningless because everyone thinks of themselves as hardcore and even most people in "hardcore" guilds are incredibly bad especially if they don't care enough to be good) and if they do, the entire team is, as one would expect from Blizzard, totally incompetent.



You're not even good at hyperbole. I feel sorry for your life because being that bad at even simple literary devices means you're probably around 70 in the IQ department.

They can't cause shit dmg. They do in fact have teams of hundred of qa people testing everything in wow all the time. Check the credits of any blizzard product once in a while.
You do know everyone signs NDAs before touching anything right?

[BiggestNoob]

kid trying way too hard to troll

One of the first rules of the internet and basic social interactions that you seem to have failed to learn (I'd blame your parents) is not to be such a try hard at shit nobody takes seriously, because it makes you look like a fucking autist.

They can't cause shit dmg. They do in fact have teams of hundred of qa people testing everything in wow all the time. Check the credits of any blizzard product once in a while.
You do know everyone signs NDAs before touching anything right?

You can have every monkey that has ever lived testing cars, and when they go out defective you can say "we have the most QA people in the world, we did the most extensive testing" it doesn't save you. One competent person in testing is worth 500000 retards.

In this case since you're not aware, testing something like this content or leveling content or world quests or ability interactions can be trivially done using a bot, and that's an extremely common way of testing complex software, as throwing bodies at it doesn't tend to scale or have sufficient detail orientation to catch anything but trivial issues (like "this doesn't work at all" or "this quest location is wrong" and will likely never do a good job of saying "this takes too long" or "this is unreasonably tuned" or "this doesn't work with too many people" because the conditions don't exist in the testing environment).
Infracted

[Tradu]

I sometimes wonder, does Blizzard beat it's own encounters internally before releasing them?

Not without using GM cheats/absurd gear, no. And clearly that amount of testing is insufficient considering the end-of-tier bosses that they don't publicly test on mythic have historically been full of bugs/issues.

[Vorkreist]

One of the first rules of the internet and basic social interactions that you seem to have failed to learn (I'd blame your parents) is not to be such a try hard at shit nobody takes seriously, because it makes you look like a fucking autist.



You can have every monkey that has ever lived testing cars, and when they go out defective you can say "we have the most QA people in the world, we did the most extensive testing" it doesn't save you. One competent person in testing is worth 500000 retards.

You seem clueless about how qa works so I'll try to explain as someone who actually worked 3 years in a gaming company.

Every single gaming company has hundreds of people that test everything from the earliest alpha to gold release.
Any major bug is observed and reported by those people to the devs that make a fix and send another version back for testing. The entire fucking qa team has to recheck and make sure all the previously reported bugs that got marked as fixed ARE indeed fixed.
You can not imagine the amount off double and triple checking involved in anything software related not to mention on a company that actually upholds one of the greatest standards of quality.
Your mind would be blown if you could see how many hours of work and how many people are required just to cover the basic collision and graphic gliches in a sandbox the size of wow. Or the infinite number of possible scenarios that can be reproduced only once in 1000 tries but break your game and you HAVE to find and fix those.

The point is that they can't perfectly test those original state mythic fights without using all those top 5 guilds to test them for months. When that state of the fight is targeted for them to experience and race through in the first place.
Complaining about this is stupid and childish. You don't even see those guilds making a huge fuss about. They just come out and say it, yeah that thing happened this doesn't work properly it sucks, we move on. Not OMG BLEZZARD HOW??? WHYY??? I NO LIFE SO HARD AND YOU GIVE ME BUGGS!!!!

[Eggroll]

7/9 is relatively easy (for the real top guilds), they won't be competing for a good spot.

By the time they get up to par, the rest will be likely too far ahead of them.

Probably not for WF but after they made 7/9 today they went to kill bosses 1-3 mythic once more.

Doesn't look too casual to me. They'll know they have no chance for a top spot but they put decent effort in the race anyways. Good sport!