The "Rush Mentality" of WoW needs to die.

[Armourboy]

It wasn't repetitive when it was new dude. And I dunno what's to argue. I got my paladin to 910, he actually outgears my mage. It took like no time at all. You don't need the habits of Method to enjoy the game.

The second character is always faster than the first, if for no other reason then the AK jump, not to mention the first probably didn't have the catch up in Broken Shore and other places.

That said, while I agree with the OP that things have gotten pretty nuts, I also agree this isn't a new problem. Part of it is the fact that design allows it now, the other is that gear allows it as well. Frankly at this point you probably lose more people than you gain by making the change to a more old school format. Granted that isn't guaranteed either, most of my guild quit because they got tired of the go go go the game had turned in too.

I could get off on a tangent about wanting to see things like threat, CC and other things make a comeback, but it would just be wasted time as the faster, mindless form of gameplay we have today isn't going anywhere.

[Deleted]

Pretty much. I mean look at the started threads from the OP. 18 of his 25 started threads (the latest 25) have been locked too.

What has to do his started threads to the game going downhill ? Fucking retard

[ThrashMetalFtw]

Why do you think this is a new thing? Ppl have been chaingpulling and going as fast as they can since WotLK. It also happened in TBC if you ever did 5mans / t4 raids with t6 geared ppl.

If you are tanking, it's your job to pull at a steady pace, ESPECIALLY in M+. If you are waiting 5sec between each pull in a M+, I WILL pull the next pack for you, especially when I'm playing my Shadow Priest, a class which NEEDS constant pulls to do anywhere close to respectable Dps. Can't think of anything more soulcrushingly annoying than having my Insanity deplete between each pack.

5man HCs can be done with 5 Dps at this point, so it doesn't matter who pulls.

[Shakou]

You can rush dungeons even on vanilla servers, if you aren't that simply means you're garbage. If you take the top 100 Mythic raiders and throw them back into vanilla(without bugged content), they would finish everything in 2 weeks.

Pure nonsense, you would hardly even be lvl'd up to 60 on a classic vanilla server in 2 weeks, you definitely would not have your mount, and you for sure 100% would not have a single character let alone an entire 40 person raid geared enough to do most of the end game content.

Vanilla wasn't all about mechanics, it was about endless farming and gear checks.

[Deleted]

Maybe you are just old. Kids need a lot of rush nowadays. My simple answer: this game is not for you anymore. Get your friends and go golfing or play poker.
That is why they say: "adults should not play videogames"

[Teri]

The only rush mentality I hate is skipping dungeon WQ in heroic 5 mans. Especially when I am on an alt that can't just solo it anyways.

Also people not waiting like 10 seconds before pulling an LFR boss, often locking a few people out that just joined mid-instance (yes people leave/get kicked and get replaced)

[Masternewt]

I, for one, agree with you but at this point you are preaching to a differrent breed of players we knew back when things had a different pace. That's why the majority of players who seek depth, story, immersion and similar qualities in a game were by now replaced by pragmatic, goal oriented and selfish players who only seek the epic loot in the end. Gimme gimme gimme, fast fast fast. Anecdotal example: my gulld used to be professors, writers, artists, book readers, now it's plumbers, security guards, butchers and people who think reading is quest text is inefficient. Gaming has become football - for the massess who see it as vacation for their brains.

[Echocho]

I, for one, agree with you but at this point you are preaching to a differrent breed of players we knew back when things had a different pace. That's why the majority of players who seek depth, story, immersion and similar qualities in a game were by now replaced by pragmatic, goal oriented and selfish players who only seek the epic loot in the end. Gimme gimme gimme, fast fast fast. Anecdotal example: my gulld used to be professors, writers, artists, book readers, now it's plumbers, security guards, butchers and people who think reading is quest text is inefficient. Gaming has become football - for the massess who see it as vacation for their brains.

The positive is that there are games focusing on depth, story and immersion that run at a much slower and satisfying pace, even in the MMORPG genre.
People just have to get over that WoW is never going to be one of those games again and just leave. You can't change the game and you can't change the mentality of players who've been indoctrinated over a span of 8 years to believe that this is how a MMORPG should be like. The vast majority doesn't even know how the game played prior to cataclysm.

[mindpsyche]

Returning to WoW after a very long hiatus (7 years).

Some changes I noticed this far while leveling my lvl 70 rogue (now 75).

1. Although I am really behind in everything and am still getting to know new stuff on my rogue, I am not at all feeling overwhelmed or in a hurry to get to lvl 110. In fact I just login / empty bags / start questing and queue for an instance. Within a few minutes I'm in an instance and mobs are being pulled and I get into the action. Comparing this to 7 or more years ago when one had to wait for a group to form, even for 5 man, and then make their way to the instance or be summoned etc...etc..So this feels so much better, especially as someone who can't play for hours given I have a wife and son now and at least this way I get to be part of some action which is the whole reason I'm playing. Also, once the group is over, most players leave immediately but I take my time, hand in my quests and then go back to doing my business which is exploring and questing.

2. Before I quit WotLK (Just before ICC) where I played Warlock, I had all the time in the world, played at a decent level, but I always felt like I was "behind"and missing out, although I raided Ulduar and cleared it excepting for Yogg (and Algalon ofc), and was part of a decent raiding guild and even doing pug raids and what not. I always felt like it wasn't enough and I was striving to go for more and the game seemed more of a chore / job than fun which eventually led me to leaving it. So, I guess after going through that phase, when I play now and see some crazily geared 110 (heck I can't even tell, if their gear is good or amazing) with some new title I have never seen before, I no longer feel like I am behind or need to catch up, more like wow that's cool, and continue to play my quests / dungeons.

Heck I didn't even know that Blizz had done away with learning new skills with every level like they used to have and spent 1 hour looking for a rogue trainer eventually to be sent to the Prove Yourself quest which of course is never ending as it's only to learn how to use your skills I guess?

Also, the new Talent system is so much nicer than the old.

3. As a returning player I have to say that whatever changes I have seen upto now, I am happy with. The game has become more playable for all people, and I don't think it's because Blizzard wants to get rid of elitism or elitist players by making content more accessible to all, but rather that Blizzard has realized that for it to continue, the game has to be more reasonable in terms of time consumption required to play it, or those who have only an hour or two per day to play video games will move on to something that caters to their need.

Here is what it comes down to, if you think that people are rushing or the game is forcing people to rush, then it seems to me like, you have to decide what you want to do in the game and just have fun doing it. If you are doing dailies because everyone is doing it or similar but not because you want to do it then you should stop that and just focus on that side of the game which will give you some satisfaction as you are playing this to have fun for yourself and not to impress others.

Anyway, just my 2 cents.

[Armourboy]

I, for one, agree with you but at this point you are preaching to a differrent breed of players we knew back when things had a different pace. That's why the majority of players who seek depth, story, immersion and similar qualities in a game were by now replaced by pragmatic, goal oriented and selfish players who only seek the epic loot in the end. Gimme gimme gimme, fast fast fast. Anecdotal example: my gulld used to be professors, writers, artists, book readers, now it's plumbers, security guards, butchers and people who think reading is quest text is inefficient. Gaming has become football - for the massess who see it as vacation for their brains.

I'll agree with that, the player base has definitely changed. MMORPG's used to be the home of the nerds, now it's more the land of gamers. Not saying it's good or bad, but it is a different group looking for different things.

[Galathir]

DPS rushing on ahead and pulling for the tank. Intentionally.
Tanks chain-pulling entire dungeons like complete idiots without a care in the world, then blaming others when things go awry.

When I queue as Blood DK tank I absolutely hate it when DDs run ahead and pull. Can't follow quick enough due to being a slow DK? Can't instantly build aggro because both charges of Blood Boil are on cd? Don't care.

This is why I feel myself forced to chainpull and set the pace myself, even if I am not entirely confident because if I don't the DDs will do it and everything gets more stressful.

That is also why I only tank when it is unavoidable.

[Deleted]

Lovely answers from "the community". Have you thought about LoL? By now it can be considerably less toxic.
And yes, the rush-rush-rush-ahead fvckwittery does suck ass. There's a good reason my favourite item in the game is Neural Silencer.

[hnlntm]

The "Rush Mentality" which currently defines WoW's gameplay and the community mindset has led me to the conclusion that this game is on the verge of entering its death throes and I can no longer put up with it.

DPS rushing on ahead and pulling for the tank. Intentionally.

This is usually a dpses way of communicating to the tank that they can pull bigger packs or move faster through the dungeon because the dps is well geared and can kill stuff before it becomes a problem.


Tanks chain-pulling entire dungeons like complete idiots without a care in the world, then blaming others when things go awry.

If this happens more than once then the tank is an idiot, if this happens once and the tank slows down then I don't see the problem. If the tank is going to fast and the group is struggling try asking him to slow down. It's called communication.

Everyone and their dog ALWAYS doing stuff as fast as possible in vain attempts to get as fast as they can up the gear ladder.

If you're pugging then surely this is to be expected, people want to join get it done quick and move on. If you want a slower pace then join a guild with like minded people.


Leveling being reduced to a power-grind up levels as quickly as possible, and feeling left behind if you don't take advantage of the statistically overpowered heirlooms.

How about you level at a pace that suits you. Why should the way you want to level impact how anyone else wants to level and vice versa. I agree that levelling needs to be adjusted but more akin to the older areas using the scaling tech that was introduced in to legion, imagine being level 30 and levelling in a Wrath zone.

The constantly funneling of players into the newest content.

Again, play the game at your own pace. There's plenty of social guild that run older content.

Many bits of content and grinding being time-sensitive, in the sense that they WILL be removed if you don't complete them by the time they're no longer current.

While this is something that Blizz have said, they have also said that those same things will still be obtainable but in different ways.

Even the most friendly guilds and groups proscribing to this attitude and the idea that they NEED to push through content as quickly as possible.
Insane stat-inflation enabling all of the above behaviours.

That's quite a broad statement, sure if you're in a friendly guild and you can't kill X boss because the group lacks dps, healing, whatever then you need to get gear, surprise that's the nature of the game. You get gear to kill bosses to get better gear, so you can kill even bigger bosses to get even better gear.


Fundamentally speaking:
The game is currently built in such a way that NO ONE can slow down and simply enjoy the game at their own pace.

Bull$hit, you just need to find the right people to play with.


Either you hop on board with the "Rush Mentality"... or both the game and the community will push you off the boat because you aren't constantly trying to get ahead.

I use to think this way, after my long time guild collapsed I went through 4 different guilds, I couldn't keep up with the "Rush Mentality" that was until I found my current guild, we are raiding and progress is slow, we're 2 bosses away from clearing normal and 1 boss down in HC, but it's at our pace and we're enjoying the game.

[primalmatter]

My idea was more along the lines of a buff all the mobs in the dungeon have. They do 1000x their normal damage to non-tank characters, removed when the tank gets on their threat list. So all those dps and heals who want to run ahead and "help" by pulling more mobs just get one shotted. I know it's old content, but it really makes me mad when I zone into Court of Stars (I have long load screens on that for some reason) and people are already up pulling trash and hitting the pillars before I'm in the boat. Makes me think "why am I even here? they don't need me".

They dont need you and what your proposing is just a stop measure to make you feel better.

[Echo of Soul]

I mean I liked MoP just fine but there were some pretty glaring issues in that expansion like the general hatred towards the daily quests that many felt forced to do for raiding. It was a bit out of hand with just how many you had to do per day and how far you fell behind if you missed a day or stopped doing them.

The dailies were a bit of a hassle yes, but they did have an end, and every day that passed you got a little bit closer to that end. The AP grinding, the titanforging and the world quests in Legion are very similar to the MOP dailies in that they all feel very tedious having to deal with them all day every day, but the difference is that there is no end in sight. This can, will and has led to massive burnout or extreme apathy towards the whole process. We need tangible finite goals in games like this, not a hamster wheel.

[Pull My Finger]

There's a major flaw in the argument of the "pro rushing" crowd that makes their viewpoint invalid. Ultimately, the issue isn't the mere time spent on a particular activity, even if they act as if it was ("why would I want to spend 60 minutes in a 15 minutes dungeon?"). The real issue is that the game, in surprisingly many areas, has become dysfunctional - you could call it outright broken. A threat is not a threat any longer, basic design and gameplay principles are invalidated, the dos and don'ts are rendered irrelevant, and class roles meaningless and interchangeable.

So to put it in simple terms, the problem isn't that everything's too fast - the problem is that everything's being done wrong and there's no penalty for it, you get away with it nonetheless. There's no finesse in the gameplay. There's little difference and often no consequence in choosing to do something the wrong over the right way.

It's the game's fault. People are generally feeble-minded, lazy and undisciplined. They will naturally gravitate towards the path of the least resistance, which they generally confuse with efficiency. It's the game's job to maintain itself and provide core boundaries for the players to operate and perform within. It's one of the core principles of game design. Or simply put: if your game fails at being a game and you let people play like monkeys, they will generally do so. The number of players who will intrisically refuse to succumb to that are in the minority, just as in a city without laws and law enforcement, it would not last long until the infrastructure would end up run down and ravaged, while only a minority of the citizens would uphold a sense of responsibility on their own.

[Miatog]

Hmmm never felt a need to rush other than some M+ where we're trying to get the biggest upgrade on the stone that we can.

[americandavey]

Wow three different threads about leveling. First of all, it seems the tanks that take it freaking slow, forget or does it on purpose that most DPS specs have to build up resources to actually DPS. So waiting around 30 seconds or more, that resource is gone and the DPS has spend time again building it up instead of nuking the next trash or whatever.

Yes we are in a rush, because all the content available, some people want to do other things than spend an hour in a dungeon. Just like a few hours ago. Blackrock Depths, the two bosses to get the bag and queue again is past Grim, you take the tunnler. So when I see people grabbing the quests to do the entire dungeon, nope I will take the 30 minutes and earn more XP then them trying to complete the whole dungeon.

This is again about, "Lets force everyone my way of thinking of how this game should be, instead of me taking off my heirlooms and find other people that want to play the game like me."

[Kyanion]

What has to do his started threads to the game going downhill ? Fucking retard

Try and keep up with the conversation before devolving into pointless insults.

[Deleted]

The simple problem is that a lot of players are "forced" into content they outgear by not even a mile but a million miles. There has been an incentive to do daily heroics through the LFD in form of gold and a rather large chunk of AP. As if that wasn't bad enough, they added the legendary upgrade items to it now.

This means that everyone, including the mythic raiders and even the heroic TOS raiders are pushed into their daily heroic. Although they can almost oneshot everything there. Of course I pull in those instances as dps because I actually could do them by myself and only do them in the group because that's what gives the incentive.

Because I'm "forced" into them I want to get them over with as quickly as possible. They are no challenge whatsoever, and are just a chore. Natural reaction: Get it over with. This really has nothing even to do with efficiency any more, just "I don't wanna do it, but I want the reward".