Heroic Leveling 1-110

[Deleted]

You're certainly having some problems understanding basic concepts, aren't you? There is no such thing as a binary in skill. It's not that something either takes skill, or it doesn't.

I'm officer of a 4/9 Mythic raiding guild. Of course I wouldn't recruit someone on the basis that they understand aggro radius alone. However, to say that having to understand that concept does not make the game harder than not having to understand it is completely retarded.

The game isn't either "hard" or "not hard". Things are many different levels of difficulty. If you cannot grasp this fundamental point of game design, then frankly I think that's humiliating for you, and I see no reason to carry on this conversation.

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No, Heroic and Mythic each adds around 2-3 extra mechanics. The developers have to figure out how to take mechanics out and add them in to change the flow and difficulty of the encounter for each difficulty level. It's far more than just tuning. Have you actually tried anything other than Normal?

It's really cute you have no clue how easy it is to disable abilities in an encounter, then again why are you so dense to understand that the developers themselves stated this in the past?

[SirCowdog]

You missed the part where I commented even in Vanilla you would not finish all zone and dungeon quests by the time you hit 60. You still had a good chunk of quests missing. So it's no different now than it was back then. That's why you have the option of either completing the zone for little XP if you wish or turning off XP.

The new zones Blizzard adds has no effect on your questing as they were always max level zones or areas added. You were never meant to complete all the zones originally. This is just some idea people get stuck in their heads.

I didn't miss it. It was trying to describe how it feels to level through old content when the context is in a MUCH larger world, with all the extra zones and newer expansion content. I probably didn't do a very good job. I guess instead of leveling I should have said "progressing".

When you reach level cap in the most current expansion, your levels stop, but you continue to progress through the designed story. While you've stopping gaining new levels, you still continue to progress the story and gear. It all makes sense within the context of the expansion, and feels natural because of that context. A player who starts Legion right now could expect to get a reasonably linear experience of the progression, despite there being content patches that added new stuff at level cap.

Whereas a player who starts a new character from level 1 gets a MASSIVELY disjointed experience as they progress, even if they don't immediately go to new areas as soon as their level allows. Their leveling will feel unnatural, and their progress will be equally bizarre as they gain access to new abilities and gear that outlevels and overpowers the original design of the content being played.

People also think it's easier for everything to flow perfectly and it never will. So many things change story wise every expansion that if they had to go back and constantly alter things because of it then you'd get people complaining about:

Agreed. I never said it would be easy to go back and streamline everything. Blizzard tried that with Cata, and it only worked to a certain degree. To go back and try to re-arrange and re-balance EVERYTHING before the current expansion would require a colossal expenditure of time and money. There's just too much old content.

While I think it would be AMAZING if Blizzard did something like that, I don't realistically expect them to ever even make the attempt.

Though frankly I'd imagine the people would ignore Option A despite how much they try to advocate for that experience. People would fit more into Option C as max level is where you have the most options to do what you want (including going back and finishing previous zones). Option B would have more people than Option A, but less than Option C.

Again, I have to agree. It's the same situation where people say they don't like flying, but then use it as soon as it's available. Or when someone says they want vanilla servers back, but are forgetting about just how dull things were due to nostalgia, and how far the game has really advanced.

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It's actually the opposite in SWTOR. Leveling is fun while nedgame content is utter trash.

In FFXIV both are fun-

It's my understanding that FFXIV's content has all it's content locked behind story progression? If it was like this in WoW, you couldn't go on to TBC until you'd finished the story of Vanilla?

It seems like an interesting idea. But I wonder what it does to FFXIV's raiding scene? I suppose it probably helps a LOT that one character can theoretically play all classes, so you only have to finish the story once.

[Deleted]

Very very interesting. Too bad games gives you a free almost max level boost, because you know, the majority of players want to play with friends at max level.

Do you want a real challenge? Do the iron man one with a cloth class, have fun.

[Ishayu]

It's really cute you have no clue how easy it is to disable abilities in an encounter, then again why are you so dense to understand that the developers themselves stated this in the past?

The technical aspect is not difficult. I said so already. What's difficult is design. Figuring out which abilities to deactive and retune, and why exactly those. Each of the 4 versions of the encounter will need its own separate testing and tuning.

I get tired of repeating myself.

[Kazlofski]

The more I think about it, the more I like it. I'm one of the ones that kind of hates raiding, but enjoys other aspects of the game.

There is a lot they could do with it and it'd make leveling something you'd have to get crafty with again to do well in, instead of strapping on BoA gear and rolling your face across the keyboard till 110.

Mythic mode could have (and much more)

- additional abilities to mobs (maybe even keystone modifiers)
- No heirlooms
- rewards for completing different content (dungeons, zones, etc)
- a unique mount or transmog set for getting lore master in mythic.
- keep mythic and regular players separate with CRZ until max level.
- scaling content like Diablo (things scale higher with more people in group for people in group)
- Hardcore mode (or similar)
- vanity reward for leveling different classes. For example level a mage to 110 and get a new skin for water elemental.
- Start at level 15

low development time with a high replay value and an alternative way to play.

Great idea, they could also add, as I said before, Beyond Exalted chests (Like the ones with Legion factions atm) and WQs to the zones
(obviously from existing quests to lower the work required for this to be done).
That will give incentive to do the WQs and normal quests that reward the reputation of factions we are probably already exalted with.
Chests could contain relevant pets/mounts/toys/transmog items/timewarped badges/T3 at a very low chance? / TCG stuff?

So basically the main part of the work would be scaling the zones like Legion, and working on creating lots of pets/mounts/toys/transmog items...
The second part is probably too much of a hassle but I believe it could make the whole world very much alive and active.
This way even pvp, dungeons and raids could have WQs, just thinking of all this makes me so excited

[Deleted]

It's my understanding that FFXIV's content has all it's content locked behind story progression? If it was like this in WoW, you couldn't go on to TBC until you'd finished the story of Vanilla?

It seems like an interesting idea. But I wonder what it does to FFXIV's raiding scene? I suppose it probably helps a LOT that one character can theoretically play all classes, so you only have to finish the story once.

Correct. While it does sound scary that almost everything is locked behind the main scenario, it is also the most effective way to level up your main class. I checked in Stormblood and a main scenario quest gave twice the XP a same level sidequest did.

It doesn't hurt the raiding community much. Mostly because the main story is told with dungeons and trials with raids being just side stories that flesh out the universe. It helps non-raiders see the whole story without needing to do nonesense like LFR.

You have to hit the level cap and finish the main story, but not the patch content. So even if a raid releases in 3.5 you only need to do the 2.0 story to unlock it.

So it goes like this:
1. You do the 2.0 story (all raids, hard mode versions of 2.0 dungeons, and side quest lines released in 2.x unlocked.)
2. You do the 2.1-2.5 story (3.0 areas and story unlocked)
3. You do the 3.0 stoy (all raids, hard mode versions of 3.0 dungeons and side quest lines relased in 3.x unlocked.)
4. You do the 3.1-3.5 story (4.0 unlocked)
5. You do the 4.0 story (the first part of the Omega raid, two endgame dungeons and three extreme trials unlocked.)

To be continued in 4.1

[Worgoblin]

I'd rather have a hardcore server. Where leveling rates are drastically reduced, mobs have 5x hp and dmg, and stuff like heirlooms do not exist. And of course no lvling boosts.

[Kazlofski]

I'd rather have a hardcore server. Where leveling rates are drastically reduced, mobs have 5x hp and dmg, and stuff like heirlooms do not exist. And of course no lvling boosts.

Sounds good for me, might have actually started playing there then, but then when Blizz realizes this, they will implement it to other realms as that server will be overloaded with players :P, either way a win-win.

Does that mean questing content like WQs and such at max level is also x5 hp and 5x dmg?

Leaving dungeons and raids outside of this of course as they have their own difficulties.

[Resentless]

I'd be more interested in zone level scaling all the way through than in getting an experience handicap.

this. 1-85 old world zones plz.

[Glaziola]

Even better make Mythic+ leveling, you can choose endless difficulties until mobs start to oneshot you.

[Taurengod]

It's actually the opposite in SWTOR. Leveling is fun while nedgame content is utter trash.

In FFXIV both are fun-

Never could really get hooked on TESO but my friend liked leveling.

First, SWTOR leveling is fun once, the first time you level a character. After that you know the story of the planets/expansions and its just something you do. You are confusing the like of the class story of the original game with people actually liking leveling. There is a reason they increased XP gains so you can level only off class story now. The endgame only sucks because Eaoware made their game on a terrible game engine that riddled their game with bugs and design flaws, and everyone left the game. All their design time is spent on making content to make money, than content to make players happy and stay. Case in point there has been no new pvp battleground, no new operations, or actual flashpoints added in 3 years. now every flashpoint is treated more like a WoW scenario due to insufficient players.

Second, Just like in Swtor, FF14 leveling is fun once. Everything in the game is locked behind the 590ish long Main Story Quest. This includes the games raids, most dungeons, classes, and even going on to the next expansion. The story of the original game + its patches is roughly 300 quest alone, and it is dull boring, and tedious for about 250 of them. Its first expansion is better at this adding about 160 quest over its lifetime and the story is much better, and the newest expansion adds about 130 more quest and the story is better paced than the original, but is in no way as interesting as the first expansion. After you finish all this once you can join other players at the current endgame, however, if you want to level a second class thats where their leveling process falls apart. Quest are only completed once, so secondary classes have only 4 options to level up PVP, Dungeons (Average wait time for a dps is about 20-30 minutes), Fates (if you can find anyone to do them with) or Palace of the Dead. Palace is the best option but every 10 floors of it awards about 1/3 of a level till 50, and 1/5 or 1/10 of a level after that. Imagine running RFC from 1-110, easy, boring, repetitive and you are essentially forced into doing this for every dps class. That's not even talking about their endgame which is just easy single room boss encounters that have the complexity of a vanilla WoW raid.