fire lich king?

[Piamonte]

so i have a question about the state of Bolvar, he was raised by the flame of the red dragons, but, what does that mean? is he a diferent kind of undead?? what happens if he raise a red dragon and use his abilities to resurrect other undeads?? what kind of necromancy is this??

[Dastreus]

The red dragons cast their flames to cleanse the area of the Forsaken blight, and burn the dead soldiers, using their ashes to grow plants there. Son of Saurfang was taken away and made into a DK as the damage was done when Frostmourne killed him. The difference with Bolvar is, the Forsaken blight + red dragon magic. Thus he should have been dead, but the Blight is different than Scourge plague and so he was res'd... kind of. The dragon's flames burn incessantly.

[TheFirstOnes]

He's his own version of Undead! He should've died at the Wrathgate, but thanks to the Red Flames, he "Lived".

Now, he's a Living dead, fire body! Must hurt being like that, honestly...

Even with all of that Arthas torment. D:

[darkoms]

The sentence "Bolvar was reanimated by the flames of the Red Dragonflight", alone, would imply that Bolvar died and was brought back to life, implying he's undead. However in the Ultimate Visual Guide it is stated that, in fact, Bolvar was "kept at the edge of life", meaning he did not die. This is supported by another sentence a bit further: "Thought to have been killed by the plague at the battle of the Wrathgate, Bolvar was saved but charred beyond recognition."

[Evaddon]

The Flames for some reason kept him alive for one reason or another, he's is Undead but a different kind of Undeath that's very true. Rather the Blight or the flames caused this effect is confusing at most TBH. The blight caused all life/Non-life to just begin and instant state of decay and crumble/fall so maybe a combination of the two kept him alive or inbetween

[Deleted]

Bolvar never died, just like arthas never died.

They never became true undead, they were infused with the powers in the helm of domination, the helm only seems to make you immune to cold? and able to control undead as well as grant necromantic powers I assume?

But he didnt die.

[Piamonte]

The sentence "Bolvar was reanimated by the flames of the Red Dragonflight", alone, would imply that Bolvar died and was brought back to life, implying he's undead. However in the Ultimate Visual Guide it is stated that, in fact, Bolvar was "kept at the edge of life", meaning he did not die. This is supported by another sentence a bit further: "Thought to have been killed by the plague at the battle of the Wrathgate, Bolvar was saved but charred beyond recognition."

so his soul was never separated from his body? thats weird, if he is still alive then he is feeling the flames all the time?? or are the flames the ones that keep him from dying?? and if that so, then why the flames never end??

- - - Updated - - -

Bolvar never died, just like arthas never died.

They never became true undead, they were infused with the powers in the helm of domination, the helm only seems to make you immune to cold? and able to control undead as well as grant necromantic powers I assume?

But he didnt die.

arthas did die, not from a natural death like being killed in combat but from frostmourne taking his soul

[Aucald]

The flames of the Red Dragonflight preserved his life, but charred his body and left him hanging in a kind of limbo - not fully alive, but unable to die. A painful state of affairs, no doubt; and not one made any easier by the Lich King's tortures atop Icecrown Citadel. Bolvar was technically "alive" before donning the Helm of Domination - though his current state now is anyone's guess. Since he never took up Frostmourne he retains his soul, but the effect of the Helm of Domination seems pretty strong even without Frostmourne's influence (especially if his statements during DK Order Hall campaign are taken as they appear to be). Bolvar, even as the Lich King, is still "alive" for want of a better term - and he retains both the fires of the Red Dragonflight in his essence, causing the burning eyes and burnt appearance, as well as whatever powers resides within the Helm that connects him to the hive-mind of the Scourge.

[Radaney]

arthas did die, not from a natural death like being killed in combat but from frostmourne taking his soul

Arthas having no heart is a pretty clear indicator that he is dead/undead/not alive/fantasy alive not alive, thing.

[Aucald]

Arthas having no heart is a pretty clear indicator that he is dead.

By the point that Arthas cast his heart away I'm pretty sure he was definitely beyond mortality - whether he was undead or something more can be argued, but he definitely was no longer mortal.

[MikeBogina]

Arthas having no heart is a pretty clear indicator that he is dead/undead/not alive/fantasy alive not alive, thing.

Arthas was by all means a god/deity at that point, fueled by the 1000's of souls in Frostmourne and the 100's of 1000's that make up the Scourge. His immunity to death was so great that he survived the blight that literally melted people's faces off. His physical form was still Arthas, but as the Lich King, there was so much more behind that. Removing his vessels heart isn't surprising that he didn't die, what's even more odd is that destroying the heart damaged him, proving there was a magical connection to him and he still lived.

I think the moment the Lich King lost/kicked out of Arthas... that Arthas didn't die to us, but to the lack of a heart in his chest.

[MikeBogina]

so i have a question about the state of Bolvar, he was raised by the flame of the red dragons, but, what does that mean? is he a diferent kind of undead?? what happens if he raise a red dragon and use his abilities to resurrect other undeads?? what kind of necromancy is this??

Bolvar was a paladin who became heavily infected with the blight, but quickly engulfed in life flames. I'd like to think that he isn't or wasnt undead when we find him, but that his body is constantly being ravaged by the blight and flames and he was the only one to survive thanks to his faith in the light. But now that seems to be not the case. The persona of the Lich King is clearly back(also proving that Arthas was never the Lich King) and Bolvar is no longer a man of the Light. His Necromancy is still necromancy, it doesn't hybrid with life magic or light, they don't work with decay.

[Razion]

Currently Bolvar's body is just toasty with dragon fire.
His mind though, is melded with the Helm of Domination.
However, his soul hasn't been torn and taken by Frostmourne.

Still, the player Death Knight's soul may be torn by Frostmourne, which would be why Bolvar would have such influence over the player Death Knight in Legion, as the Helm is what grants the Lich King his control over undead.

[darkoms]

Arthas was by all means a god/deity at that point, fueled by the 1000's of souls in Frostmourne and the 100's of 1000's that make up the Scourge. His immunity to death was so great that he survived the blight that literally melted people's faces off. His physical form was still Arthas, but as the Lich King, there was so much more behind that. Removing his vessels heart isn't surprising that he didn't die, what's even more odd is that destroying the heart damaged him, proving there was a magical connection to him and he still lived.

I think the moment the Lich King lost/kicked out of Arthas... that Arthas didn't die to us, but to the lack of a heart in his chest.

Where do you get this nonsense about the fact that Arthas is a god?

[IgnisVenom]

Where do you get this nonsense about the fact that Arthas is a god?

Technically, he isn't wrong- Arthas was considered a God lorewise as far as I remember. Not because of his sheer power, though, as Lei Shen at his prime would according to Blizz be able to take on the Lich King in a 1v1 and Deathwing would straight up 1-shot him.

[darkoms]

You are wrong
Arthas is a demigod.

[Aeula]

Basically the red dragons are plonkers who thought breathing life-giving fire on a mist of plague that destroys those it touches would be a good thing. As a result Bolvar is on fire for all eternity and kept alive by their 'gift'. Did they try to put him out? Nope.
So naturally being on fire kinda made him think putting the lich kings helmet on and freezing himself in a block of ice would make it stop hurting. It didn't. So now he's turned into a full lich king driven mad by the helm and being on fire forever and it's probably why he endorses killing all the red dragons during the Death Knight campaign because (lets face it) they deserve it. (God knows I killed the shit out of them. Dragon's are for hunting, not befriending!).

I mean imagine it, a hideous chemical weapon is disintegrating your insides and liquefying your brain, then some idiot decides to keep you alive by burning you with fire that won't go out. I'd be pretty pissed off too.

Beyond that he's just your run of the mill lich king. No hint at being able to cast fire or use fire related spells... yet...

[TheWindWalker]

Technically, he isn't wrong- Arthas was considered a God lorewise as far as I remember. Not because of his sheer power, though, as Lei Shen at his prime would according to Blizz be able to take on the Lich King in a 1v1 and Deathwing would straight up 1-shot him.

That will always bother me about the mishandling of Mists. They took the biggest threat and coolest concept, a nearly-incorruptable army of Titanic Constructs that wanted to dominate everything (living, dead, otherwise), and said "uh.. midtier and move on." Lei Shen should have been the ultimate Big Bad of Mists and if WoD just had to happen then it should have began with Garrosh's final level of betrayal when he was executing non-Orc Horde civilians in his streets.

[ChairmanKaga]

Do you mean the Mogu were literally incorruptible? Hadn't they already succumbed to the Curse of Flesh including the Thunder King etc?

Also by this point in Legion I had really hoped for some 'enemy of my enemy' support from Bolvar and the current scourge with fending off the Legion. I haven't played a DK though so perhaps there is some in their order hall campaign. It would have been interesting to see that and support from things/races usually only antagonistic to the players like Mogu/Mantid.

[Voidism]

In a possible future Lich King expansion, I could see the theme being about fire-undead rather than ice-undead like wrath. This imo is reinforced when you do the Chromie scenario, in the cave there're fire-undead.