Is M Goroth easier than H KJ?

[meroko]

to be honest the first 3 are easier on Mythic than Heroic KJ.

[Svisalith]

KJ is way harder IMO, easy to cheese goroth with extra healers

[Nitros14]

to be honest the first 3 are easier on Mythic than Heroic KJ.

I don't agree with that. Enrage and damage are way tighter on Harjatan than Kil'jaeden.

[Sting]

For people who blew past Kil'jaeden and Goroth and are 4+ mythic bosses in I'm sure Goroth was easier.

Having struggled on both Goroth is a much harder numbers check than Kil'jaeden is.

Also for later, we comfortably beat heroic Kil'jaeden's enrage with a 8m30s kill but keep hitting berserk timer on Harjatan mythic at around 10%.

If you haven't killed it yet, just start burning the boss before the last set of eggs spawns. I think it's after 3 hatches, you basically ignore everything that comes out of the 4th and tunnel down boss. Worked for us.

[antelope591]

KJ is slightly more difficult but not by much. Harjatan is much easier. I wouldn't try the rest if u cant beat KJ

[Jastall]

It's pretty similar I think. KJ is more about mechanics for the entire raid, Goroth is about rotating healer CDs, tank survivability and a select number of people doing their job. Both are made much easier with a healthy amount of classes that can immune. But Goroth is a lot easier to learn since he only has one extra mechanic from Heroic and it's not a very difficult one.

Out guild took fewer pulls to down Goroth than KJ, for what it's worth.

[Count Zero]

Slightly more people have killed H KJ than M Goroth (around 2700 guilds vs around 2400 guilds), but H KJ was available for an extra week than M Goroth, so ... overall they're pretty comparable.

[meroko]

I don't agree with that. Enrage and damage are way tighter on Harjatan than Kil'jaeden.

I'll give you that, the enrage is pretty tight on Harj but mechanically I felt it was way easier than KJ.

[Marrilaife]

Can add my guild to the list of people who killed M Goroth before H KJ and had "less wipes on 3 mythic bosses combined than on H KJ", H KJ was really sad experience for us mostly because of the fact "1 person's mistake = wipe", when you play with people who do mistakes it makes a huge difference whether a mistake means "you die" or "the whole raid dies". So you kinda need to ask yourself "is my guild good at following tactics and positioning we just have low dps or something" or rather "we just tend to have some people who are good and some people who kinda mess up".

And tbh many casual guilds have "that guy" who is a nice chap but you really don't wanna have to rely on him on anything. HC KJ isn't a boss where you can have 5 people doing mechanics and rest just pew pewing with reckless abandon.

[MrExcelion]

Definitely recommend getting Goroth done at the least

[Eapoe]

Do mythic Goroth, it's an easy mythic fight (basically all 1st fights are the easiest). If your raid has the gear to kill him, then do it. Keep in mind, if you can kill Goroth relatively quickly, he drops really great items for your raid. Getting mythic level relics and that melee trinket will even help your HKJ kill.
Now, I'm not saying stop banging your head against KJ to go bang your head against Goroth, but giving Goroth a few tries and seeing how it goes isn't a bad idea. If you can kill him on your first raid night and have plenty of time to get back into heroic, there's no reason not to try.

[Xequecal]

Goroth is harder than both Harjatan and Demonic Inquisition. He also has some super annoying rng bugs, sometimes the fireball goes through pillars without breaking them and wipes you, and sometimes the Burning Armor -> Infernal Burning combo has the Burning Armor delayed a few seconds, making it impossible for the tank to get behind a pillar (<1 sec between the armor going off and burning cast completion) and that kills your tank even through multiple overlapping cooldowns.

[lawomous]

Goroth is harder than both Harjatan and Demonic Inquisition. He also has some super annoying rng bugs, sometimes the fireball goes through pillars without breaking them and wipes you, and sometimes the Burning Armor -> Infernal Burning combo has the Burning Armor delayed a few seconds, making it impossible for the tank to get behind a pillar (<1 sec between the armor going off and burning cast completion) and that kills your tank even through multiple overlapping cooldowns.

It's not impossible, the tank just has to run behind the raid and blow up there instead of where they usually go. (But they do need to use a CD, from pillars breaking)

[Toore]

Goroth is harder than both Harjatan and Demonic Inquisition. He also has some super annoying rng bugs, sometimes the fireball goes through pillars without breaking them and wipes you, and sometimes the Burning Armor -> Infernal Burning combo has the Burning Armor delayed a few seconds, making it impossible for the tank to get behind a pillar (<1 sec between the armor going off and burning cast completion) and that kills your tank even through multiple overlapping cooldowns.

Didnt try him on Mythic yet but on heroic as a paly i dont run behind pillars - spellwarding first InfBurn, bubble second, if happens spellwarding should be back on 3rd (can use lay on hands on someone to reduce cooldown on spellwarding if needed) - my plan for mythic is only do it if i have the tank debuff at InfBurn cast to not hide at all, if my co tank has it ill hide normally

[Marrilaife]

Slightly more people have killed H KJ than M Goroth (around 2700 guilds vs around 2400 guilds), but H KJ was available for an extra week than M Goroth, so ... overall they're pretty comparable.

Also H KJ doesn't require you to collect 20 people together, which actually might be a barrier for some guilds.

and sometimes the Burning Armor -> Infernal Burning combo has the Burning Armor delayed a few seconds, making it impossible for the tank to get behind a pillar (<1 sec between the armor going off and burning cast completion) and that kills your tank even through multiple overlapping cooldowns.

One of the few situations in TOS where I'm happy to be a paladin.

But yeah, for other tanks you probably need to save a pillar away from the raid so the raid hides on the opposite side and the tank circle doesn't reach them. Good mobility tank classes probably help.

Do mythic Goroth, it's an easy mythic fight (basically all 1st fights are the easiest).

Also soaking Goroth's infernals is a good practice for Armageddon awareness.

[KaPe]

Also soaking Goroth's infernals is a good practice for Armageddon awareness.

I find them far more annoying and sneaky than Armageddon. There's only three, but sometimes you have to frantically look for that last one, cleverly hidden behind pillars or Goroth's fat ass. KJ is less subtle, simply putting five of them in one corner.

[Ailylia]

sometimes the Burning Armor -> Infernal Burning combo has the Burning Armor delayed a few seconds, making it impossible for the tank to get behind a pillar (<1 sec between the armor going off and burning cast completion) and that kills your tank even through multiple overlapping cooldowns.

This is why you have holy/disc priests around to lifegrip.

But yes I have to agree M Goroth is pretty easy. It's mostly a heals check and if your DPS are decent you can afford to run 5 healers. Prydaz helps smooth out some of the spike damage. If you have enough classes that can solo soak brimstone it's a breeze (or just coordinate 3+ people to stand in it, but solos are easier). Missing a brimstone is pretty much a wipe just like missing an armageddon on KJ, but there are only 3 brimstones and they don't leave a debuff.

But as with any mythic fight the key to making this fight easy is good communication.

[Killface1]

Heroic KJ has a bunch of mechanics that will wipe you if you fuck em up.

Mythic Goroth has like one mechanic that will wipe you if you fuck it up.

There is no dps check in it to speak of. Its debatably one of the the easiest "first boss of the tier" fights I've ever seen. Just make sure people soak (or setup a solosoak rotation depending on your group) and make sure the tanks get behind pillars and have cooldowns running if there is a shooting star and they have melted armor, and its gg.

[Marrilaife]

Its debatably one of the the easiest "first boss of the tier" fights I've ever seen.

Nah... Most 1st bosses were significantly easier than the rest, at least more than half. I think M Kargath was significantly easier than hc Imperator, similar story with Hellfire Assault, Jin'rokh and Immerseus. If we talk non-mythic, Flame Leviathan was the biggest "first boss is a loot pinata" example.

[KaPe]

Nah... Most 1st bosses were significantly easier than the rest, at least more than half. I think M Kargath was significantly easier than hc Imperator, similar story with Hellfire Assault, Jin'rokh and Immerseus. If we talk non-mythic, Flame Leviathan was the biggest "first boss is a loot pinata" example.

Not to mention that first bosses almost never have any instant wipe mechanics. And while Goroth's version isn't that difficult to handle, it's still way above the likes of Kargath.