Two-year old girl savaged by pit bulls and left scarred for life

[Coconuter]

Nature vs. Nurture. Nature still has a role to play in how a dog behaves. It's then amplified because people don't treat their dogs properly and/or socialize them properly. Including the dog lovers who treat their dogs as if they are people (4 dogs have attacked me, all owned by morons who treat them like a person, and all some small terrier breed).

Owner's imo should be punished as if they committed the crime themselves (then lower one degree) both in criminal and civil courts. Dog should be put down on the spot.

Is the owner more responsible? Sure. The dog still is willing to commit the act though, they aren't some innocent little angel that needs a new home of somebody else who can't raise them properly.

Dogs need leadership, discipline, exposure (both humans and other dogs), and love. The majority of dogs get one of those four needs, two at most with most owners, because people forget what a dog is by its very nature.

[prwraith]

He had 18...read that EIGHTEEN dogs in his apartment.

And people think this was the dog's fault....

[Radaney]

Dog owner was retarded.

Also an American Bully Dog isn't a Pitbull.

[Dug]

EDIT: This post is not about the article simply a general statement about toddlers interacting with dogs and @ the morons who want certain breeds banned

Don't leave your toddler children unattended around dogs, how about that? Matter of fact just don't let them near dogs until they're old enough to learn how to properly interact with them. Too many dumb ass parents let their kids play with dogs and the kids, being inexperienced, go around sticking their face right in the dogs own or pulling on their ears/tail etc. Then the dog bites them and the parents get pissed off.

[unbound]

From Wikipedia:

Yes, like any other dog pit bulls can be raised to be gentle and caring and just like any other dog they can snap without warning and attack. In case of pit bulls, they were bred to be strong fighting dogs so any attack by them is going to be way more dangerous. You would exercise caution around a tamed bear, wouldn't you? So why not a pit bull?

Because the reality is that the vast, overwhelming majority of "pit bulls" are not meaningfully different from any other breed.

If you would take the time to read the Wikipedia entry just a bit further down (I suspect you did, but ignored that section because it did not support your argument) - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pit_bull :

In a 2014 literature review of dog bite studies, the American Veterinary Medical Association (AVMA) states that breed is a poor sole predictor of dog bites.[29] Controlled studies do not show pit bulls to be disproportionately dangerous. While pit bull-type dogs are more frequently identified with cases involving very severe injuries or fatalities than other breeds, the review suggests this may relate to the popularity of the breed, noting that sled dogs and Siberian Huskies compose a majority of fatal dog attacks in some areas of Canada.[24]

In a 2000 review by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, which examines data from both media reports and from The Humane Society of the United States, pit bull-type dogs were identified in approximately one-third of dog bite-related fatalities in the United States between 1981 and 1992. However, the review notes that studies on dog bite-related fatalities which collect information by surveying news reports are subject to potential errors, as some fatal attacks may not have been reported, a study might not find all relevant news reports, and the dog breed might be misidentified.[30] The AVMA has also noted fundamental problems with tracking breed in dog bite-related fatalities.[31] In a 2013 study of 256 fatalities in the United States from 2000–2009, the AVMA determined that valid breed determination was possible for only 17.6% of cases.[32]

Contrary to popular myth, pit bulls do not have "locking jaws".[33] There is no physiological "locking mechanism" in the jaw muscle and bone structure of pit bulls or other dogs.[34] Pit bull-type dogs, like other terriers, hunting and bull-baiting breeds,[35] can exhibit a bite, hold, and shake behavior and at times refuse to release.[13][36][37] Pit bulls also have wide skulls, well-developed facial muscles, and strong jaws,[33] and some research suggests that pit bull bites are particularly serious because they tend to bite deeply and grind their molars into tissue.[38] Breaking an ammonia ampule and holding it up to the dog's nose can cause the dog to release its hold.[36]

In other words, you have no more reason to be afraid of a pit bull than any other breed. It all comes down to how the dog was raised and what behaviors have been encouraged...which has absolutely nothing to do with breed.

Pit bull breeds have become famous for their roles as soldiers, police dogs, search and rescue dogs, actors, television personalities, seeing eye dogs, and celebrity pets. The Bull Terrier mix Nipper, the model for the painting His Master's Voice, and the American Staffordshire Terrier, Pete the Pup from the movie Little Rascals are two historically well known pit bulls. Lesser known, but still historically notable pit bulls include Billie Holiday's companion "Mister",[76] Helen Keller's dog "Sir Thomas",[77] Buster Brown's dog "Tige",[78] Horatio Jackson's dog "Bud",[79][80] President Theodore Roosevelt's Pit Bull terrier "Pete", "Jack Brutus" who served for Company K, the First Connecticut Volunteer Infantry during the civil war,[81] Sergeant Stubby who served for the 102nd Infantry, 26th (Yankee) Division during World War I, and Sir Walter Scott's "Wasp".[82]

Contemporary significant pit bulls are: Weela, who helped save 32 people, 29 dogs, 3 horses, and 1 cat during southern California's widespread flooding in 1993;[83] Popsicle, a five-month-old puppy originally found nearly dead in a freezer, who grew to become one of the nation's most important police dogs;[84] Norton, who was placed in the Purina Animal Hall of Fame after he rescued his owner from a severe reaction to a spider bite;[85] Titan, who rescued his owner's wife, who would have died from an aneurysm, D-Boy, who took three bullets to save his family from an intruder with a gun,[86] and Lilly, who lost a leg after being struck by a freight train while pulling her unconscious owner from the train tracks.[87] Daddy, Cesar Millan's right-hand dog was famous for his mellow temperament and his ability to interact calmly with ill-mannered dogs.

[Deleted]

Im not even going to waste time arguing against the stupid arbitrary breed arguments because they're just that stupid. Instead I will express sympathy towards the victim

[Evangeliste]

Yet another thread about a dangerous breed.

Yes they were bred for fighting. So was Chihuahua's bred to bed carried in arm. Pugs were bred til their faces sunk into themselves rather than perturbed like most breeds.
Aggressive dogs happen as much as any other species. The simple fact is the dog owner was an idiot.

There's so much hypocrisy in complaining about a dog breed. It was us that made them like it is in the first place. And complaining about the end product and not addressing the actual source is why it's dumb. Nature versus Nurture is always up to debate and on the regular occasion it's shown that nurture can change a basis nature. And you have friendly dogs when they are deemed a vicious and aggressive breed.

I don't see many campaigning or giving two fucks about the cruelties that lie within breeding programs or puppy farms of any breed - some of them are devastating and can be as bad as caged hens.

[truckboattruck]

genetics are very real, and dictate everything

[Deleted]

genetics are very real, and dictate everything

Therefore all dogs are dangerous because all dogs were wolves

[Ozzyorcborne]

18 dogs in a 3 room house??? Youd need a farm for that many.

[Jtbrig7390]

Did you even read the article? The unsupervised dogs (reportedly) tore through a fence in order to get to the girl who was playing in her Aunt's garden (on their own property)

This is one of those scenarios where you can place zero blame on the people who got injured

Did u read under the bolded because its clear u didn't.

[Deleted]

18 dogs in a 3 room house??? Youd need a farm for that many.

3 or more dogs together will usually form a pack mentality so 18 is beyond ridiculous

[Jtbrig7390]

You obviously DID NOT read the actual article and just immediately jumped to the dogs' defense. Typical of the internet and the "but they can be good dogs!" nonsense.

And you obviously didn't read under the part u bolded.

Both are the simple fix to 90% of the dog bullshit that happens.

[matt4pack]

3 or more dogs together will usually form a pack mentality so 18 is beyond ridiculous

Obviously it was a puppy mill. How this stuff is allowed is absurd and then you get more stupid humans on top of it coming along blaming the dogs like they had a choice.

[A dot Ham]

Here is a idea....

Don't let ur 2 year old be near a dog (doesn't matter the breed)

And if you are a owner of a dog (doesn't matter the breed) and won't be around. How about putting them up until you are.

Dog jumped through the fence.

A 2 year old isn't allowed to play in their own back yard?

Dafuq?

[Aggrophobic]

Oh look. Yet another example of why breeds of dogs that were bred to be aggressive pieces of shit shouldn't be allowed to live anymore.

Seriously, why the hell are these types of dogs still allowed to exist? If I EVER saw a dog like this anywhere near my property, I'd fucking shoot it on the spot. It's not worth the potential harm to my family to let the fucking thing live.

Because the owners would just get another breed that would turn out just as fucked up as the bulldog and after a while there would be no dogs left.
The breed really is not to blame, the owners are.

[Coconuter]

Don't leave your toddler children unattended around dogs, how about that? Matter of fact just don't let them near dogs until they're old enough to learn how to properly interact with them. Too many dumb ass parents let their kids play with dogs and the kids, being inexperienced, go around sticking their face right in the dogs own or pulling on their ears/tail etc. Then the dog bites them and the parents get pissed off.

It wasn't the toddler's fault. If anyone is a dumbass it's not the parents, it's you for not reading, or people who can't raise dogs properly.

The child didn't touch the dog, and even if a 2 year old grabs the tail of a dog, the dog shouldn't have a reaction to bite. If you think that is an okay response, then I hope you don't own any dogs because you sure as shit don't know how to raise them.

I own a Komandor, they are a much more dangerous breed and he responds perfectly to little kids, even the ones that are too grabby. I also ensure I'm there and stop children from being children occasionally too.

But hey, do your usual and blame somebody the victim.

[Dug]

It wasn't the toddler's fault. If anyone is a dumbass it's not the parents, it's you for not reading, or people who can't raise dogs properly.

The child didn't touch the dog, and even if a 2 year old grabs the tail of a dog, the dog shouldn't have a reaction to bite. If you think that is an okay response, then I hope you don't own any dogs because you sure as shit don't know how to raise them.

I own a Komandor, they are a much more dangerous breed and he responds perfectly to little kids, even the ones that are too grabby. I also ensure I'm there and stop children from being children occasionally too.

But hey, do your usual and blame somebody the victim.

I was making a general statement to the blame the breed/ban breed crowds. In this instance the dogs attacked unprovoked and should be put down and the owner rightfully charged.

Still a lot of "attacks" on young children by dogs come down to shit parents letting their kids fuck around with dogs when they shouldn't be.

[Coconuter]

I was making a general statement to the blame the breed/ban breed crowds. In this instance the dogs attacked unprovoked and should be put down and the owner rightfully charged.

Still a lot of "attacks" on young children by dogs come down to shit parents letting their kids fuck around with dogs when they shouldn't be.

Kids will always go up to dogs and mess with them. Look up Komondors, they have dreadlocks. Kids mess with my dog plenty, especially his hair, and I know it's bound to happen. If my dog attacks a kid, it's primarily my fault and my dog's fault. I'm not going to blame the child or parent. I don't have kids currently, but, every parent admits every single kid gets out of their site at some point in time. Even the great parents.

Difference is I've known my dog is potentially dangerous (they can kill bears), I've spent significantly more time with him than previous dogs I've owned, and I made sure he is prepared for the child who is bound to harass him. Dogs need to get out and see people, including obnoxious kids. And my role is I'll stop the kid or get ahold of the parents and get them to stop. And no parent has complained when I tell them their kid needs to back away from my giant of a dog because they aren't acting appropriately.

[A dot Ham]

Yet another thread about a dangerous breed.

Yes they were bred for fighting. So was Chihuahua's bred to bed carried in arm. Pugs were bred til their faces sunk into themselves rather than perturbed like most breeds.
Aggressive dogs happen as much as any other species. The simple fact is the dog owner was an idiot.

There's so much hypocrisy in complaining about a dog breed. It was us that made them like it is in the first place. And complaining about the end product and not addressing the actual source is why it's dumb. Nature versus Nurture is always up to debate the on regular occasions it's shown that nurture can change a basis nature. And you have friendly dogs when they are deemed a vicious and aggressive breed.

I don't see many campaigning or giving two fucks about the cruelties that lie within breeding programs or puppy farms of any breed - some of them are devastating and can be as bad as caged hens.

How many wolves are trained/bred as pets?

How many bears are trained/bred as pets?

This fallacy created by dog breeders who simply want to continue to breed aggressive dogs is just that... a fallacy. Certain animals cannot be domesticated... yes there are exceptions, but not everyone is fucking Cesar Millan.

The aggression is a desirable trait (just as you yourself mentioned) it is no different than a sunken face, or floppy ears, or color, etc. Rottweilers, German Shepherds, Dobermans, Pits, Bull Dogs, Rhodesian Ridgebacks (cool dog btw) [also used to guard against... fucking Lions mmmkay].

The point here is that the aggression is innate. You can do these that curb that, but in my experience very few people are truly capable of the type of control and command that is necessary to keep that kind of aggression safely at bay.

With these types of dogs (high energy dogs) even an inadequate amount of attention can lead to aggressive behavior. Also, the type of play and attention given (even when perfectly innocent) can lead to aggressive/undesirable behavior.

This idea that only people who are idiots and neglect their pets, or those "thugs" that breed them for fighting are the only cases of aggressive dogs is poppycock.

Even a group of Chihuahuas will (if left to nature) either learn to hunt/scavenge... or they will die. Instinct plays a significant role. Canines though are built as predators/meat eaters.

- - - Updated - - -

Therefore all dogs are dangerous because all dogs were wolves

There is some truth to that. As a trainer/breeder its ignorant to forget their roots.