Page 7 of 9 FirstFirst ...
5
6
7
8
9
LastLast
  1. #121
    Deleted
    What, the lore hasn't focused on horde vs alliance for ten plus years so it's bad? Fuck off. The lore has been decent enough justification for me grinding for hours (no, literal DAYS) since 2007.

    Don't get me wrong, it's largely pulpy trash - but what does you expect, Shakespeare?

    Go read some Dostoyevsky or something, you'll come back yearning for some pulpy, fantasy trash.

    Plus, we're finally breaking from the Legion story. Shit's about to go full-on Cthulu-lite. It's gonna be great.

  2. #122
    Moderator Aucald's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Epic Premium
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA-US
    Posts
    45,574
    It's fine to have a negative opinion of Warcraft's lore, and it is equally fine to have a positive opinion. But personal attacks on people who disagree with your view of it is unacceptable and need to stop. This is the first and final warning to the thread.
    "We're more of the love, blood, and rhetoric school. Well, we can do you blood and love without the rhetoric, and we can do you blood and rhetoric without the love, and we can do you all three concurrent or consecutive. But we can't give you love and rhetoric without the blood. Blood is compulsory. They're all blood, you see." ― Tom Stoppard, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern are Dead

  3. #123
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    Except Calia's pre-Legion story was her sitting around doing nothing and the only role she has played was that of a walking vagina to be married off for political gains.
    That's what I also don't understand. Calia was as a plot device for Lord Prestor's dealings with the Lordaeron Kingdoms and had no personality at all, just a walking dowry. Then she reappears after more than a decade, still with no personality except "I'm a priest handmaid, I reject my past". This is the leader everyone wants to rule Lordaeron?

    Fuck, just let Sky Admiral Catherine Rogers get some forces, let her declare the Kingdom of Southshore and expand into Forsaken lands. That would make more military and political sense than "Queen Calia Cardboard of Nothingville".

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    But even with all of that, the OP is just weird. Making a story focused on not just faction conflict, but PvP specifically would probably not work (especially if they involved the dumpster fire that is the PvP team). Faction conflict is already a bit overplayed and stale and there already was a huge story-arc dedicated to it so it'd just be redundant and lazy storytelling (admittedly, Blizzard's forte, but that'd exactly be the problem). And the idea that war against other forces isn't war and as such it doesn't fit Warcraft is just bizarre.
    The playerbase is as much as responsible for the crappy faction conflict stories that Blizzard produce. I mean, a war is about winning and losing, but some faction fanboys (either side) can't stand nothing but winning, like the only good story is for the Alliance to carpet role the Horde or viceversa.

    Thankfully, Blizzard learned with Cataclysm and MoP and moved on from it.

  4. #124
    Quote Originally Posted by Mojo03 View Post
    Overwatch, actually seems to be an exception and is compelling for what it is.
    You're fucking kidding right?

  5. #125
    Quote Originally Posted by Flurryfang View Post
    One would believe, that after nearly 20 years of Warcraft, that Blizzard would have enough background lore to make amazing stories with alot of characters and surprising twists.
    After over 12 years of WoW which required more frequent story updates it became obvious that Blizzard is incapable of developing more than 5 characters at a time and that when it comes to specific races, when they do get the spotlight, the amount of characters getting development is 3 tops. Regardless of all the background. And their stories have been retcon bonanzas even before WoW. So I'm not sure what would lead anyone to believe that Blizzard writers would suddenly change and create stories like you outlined.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  6. #126
    Scarab Lord Manabomb's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Probably laying somewhere frozen and cold.
    Posts
    4,106
    I think they have just written themselves into a corner. They tried so hard pushing certain themes (Orcs with WoD, Pandaren/Asian with MoP, Demonic/demons with Legion) that the progression of the story became over-saturated with the theme Blizzard was pushing.

    If they were to focus on a more balanced expansion, one with varied final enemies and more interesting characters while also involving the rest of the world (huge problem with WoW story telling, for me, is that we rarely, if at all, go back to the places we've been to try and gain allies or look for artifacts of power, ect.). It's this sort of theme-heavy story telling that has shifted WoW away from being an interesting narrative with varied themes that takes you on an epic journey across the planet/universe, to a theme-park where each "ride" is themed as an expansion.
    There are no worse scum in this world than fascists, rebels and political hypocrites.
    Donald Trump is only like Hitler because of the fact he's losing this war on all fronts.
    Apparently condemning a fascist ideology is the same as being fascist. And who the fuck are you to say I can't be fascist against fascist ideologies?
    If merit was the only dividing factor in the human race, then everyone on Earth would be pretty damn equal.

  7. #127
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    People say the story is a mess usually translates to people too stupid to comprehend the story aspects and all the threads in Warcraft that have had logical paths and conclusions.
    All the retcons are particularly logical. And the category of people who can't comprehend all the story aspects and threads is led by Blizzard's writers themselves, given how they tend to forget things.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  8. #128
    ...WAAAAAAAAAHHHH.

    Be silent, Child.
    Originally Posted by Tradewind
    Well yeah, did you see the daughter? 0/10, would not bang.

  9. #129
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    No but Warlocks won't have a immortal servant anymore.
    Something something the story aspects and all the threads in Warcraft something something. There's no indication that demons will stop being immortal. It was their trait before Sargeras stopped the Legion. Illidari demons are also being reborn. All the implications from the 7.3 spoilers is that Sargeras used Argus to greatly hasten the rebirth process. And then there's the part where even that is Turalyon's assumption.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  10. #130
    Immortal Flurryfang's Avatar
    7+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2015
    Location
    Empire of Man
    Posts
    7,073
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post
    After over 12 years of WoW which required more frequent story updates it became obvious that Blizzard is incapable of developing more than 5 characters at a time and that when it comes to specific races, when they do get the spotlight, the amount of characters getting development is 3 tops. Regardless of all the background. And their stories have been retcon bonanzas even before WoW. So I'm not sure what would lead anyone to believe that Blizzard writers would suddenly change and create stories like you outlined.
    Personally, i think people just compare the way lore was told in the Warcraft days and compare it today, and find it lacking. Blizzard can improve their lore, i have fun improving it and now then by writing fan-fiction, but the old days are gone. WoW as a MMO can not tell stories as good as Warcraft could. Warcraft had entire hour long campaigns to explore specific characters and fill their character sheet out and WoW simply can't do that.
    May the lore be great and the stories interesting. A game without a story, is a game without a soul. Value the lore and it will reward you with fun!

    Don't let yourself be satisfied with what you expect and what you seem as obvious. Ask for something good, surprising and better. Your own standards ends up being other peoples standard.

  11. #131
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    discuss these plotholes so I can plug the holes with things explained you are very likely ignorant too.
    OK. Lich King is hit with a spell and his throne starts to melt -> Forsaken break free. Lich King gets hit with a Light-infused sword -> Acherus breaks free. Lich King dies -> no one breaks free and, despite the main guy who could resurrect them ad nauseum, most other mass-ressurrectors also being gone and the power structure being in shambles, Scourge becomes an even greater threat.

    Or, keeping to the topic of the Lich King - Arthas kills his humanity. His humanity pops up in Icecrown near his heart (thanks to the awesome cooperation between quest devs and people responsible for the Arthas book). His humanity is never seen again after Tirion destroys Arthas' heart. 3.3 arrives and suddenly it turns out it was Arthas' humanity that held the Scourge back. Even though it was destroyed by Arthas, then reappeared because reasons outside of Arthas, then disappeared again.

    Sargeras doesn't use his Avatar to just kill Aegwynn, establish a foothold before a new Guardian is appointed and open up portals for the Legion. Instead he goes on an utterly convoluted plan that only ever paid off because Kil'jaeden's obsession with Draenei led him to discover the Orcs years later.

    Kerrilldank-heika easily opens up an immense portal between Azeroth and Argus with the Sargerite Keystone. The Legion never uses it for those purposes despite most of their strategies orienting around opening up a huge-ass portal so that Sargeras can enter.

    Deathwing knows more than anyone else of what the Dragon Soul is capable of, achieved more than anyone else with it and was obsessed about it. He also knows it's the one thing that can unmake him. He knows Thrall is going to escort it with little help. He sends Benedictus to retrieve it instead of doing it himself. The cunning plotter from W2 era right there.

    Shamanism, rooted in gaining the favor of the Elementals, is somehow the same thing as Titan gift of Aspect powers and allows Thrall to make the Dragon Soul work against Deathwing.

    Deathwing also somehow knows that the Aspects and the team will go after the Focusing Iris next even though Kalec came up with it on the spot in the middle of the raid. And even then, he doesn't steal or destroy the Iris to prevent them from fulfilling their goals and instead sends a random mook to spring a trap.

    Deathwing doesn't help Ultraxion at all even though he's right there. He doesn't even obliterate the Aspects and Thrall himself the moment Ultraxion died and instead gives Thrall all the time he needs to aim the Dragon Soul. He also has the plan to kill the Aspects with a powerful dragon from his new dragonflights. Never bothers to retrieve Chromatus, properly power him up and give him some time to develop.

    The Titans showed Nozdormu the vision of his death as they empowered him. That vision being of corrupted Nozdormu working for the Old Gods. They knew at least Nozdormu would fall and yet they didn't reconsider the plan of making the Aspects the task force against the Hour of Twilight.

    There is no demon Velen despite Legion corrupting countless versions of Argus and the WoW multiverse being a "don't count the blades of grass" type.

    There is only one Legion, but there is no one Sargeras. Even if it wasn't the alternate version of Sargeras that corrupted alternate versions of Argus, that still leaves alternate versions of Argus the World Soul and the issue it presents. We know that alternate versions of the same planet carrying a World Soul in the MU can also have World Souls since AU versions of Azeroth had Wells of Eternity. So there should also be other corrupted Arguses the Unmakers, given the corruption of other Arguses in general. Somehow getting rid of just the MU one gets rid of the problem.

    Infinite Azeroths, some that fell to the Legion, yet Archimonde never drained the Well of Eternity and never became a god like he planned. Also, no AU corrupted Titan Azeroths.
    Quote Originally Posted by Kangodo View Post
    Does the CIA pay you for your bullshit or are you just bootlicking in your free time?
    Quote Originally Posted by Mirishka View Post
    I'm quite tired of people who dislike something/disagree with something while attacking/insulting anyone that disagrees. Its as if at some point, people forgot how opinions work.

  12. #132
    Quote Originally Posted by Mehrunes View Post

    What was locked by playing Horde again?
    Worgen lore probably the biggest sin

  13. #133
    I am Murloc! Seefer's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jan 2011
    Location
    A little south of sanity
    Posts
    5,252
    Quote Originally Posted by anaxie View Post
    We are sealing a Sargeras the Dark TITAN away at the SEAT OF THE PANTHEON

    There is your perfect excuse

    - - - Updated - - -



    he holds off a battalion in a suicide run so they don't overwhelm the valley and destroy the Frostwolf Clan.

    Thats the literally story. did jump into an army did you even fucking do it?

    Thats not 10 orcs

    its a fucking army marching with Cannons and Gronn. All it takes is the first line of skirmishers Ga'nar stalled to go fuck with Drek'Thar and the pass would not be collapsed meaning the Frostwolf Clan is slaughtered.




    Perhaps reading material like this is more your speed
    I like you lol
    History will have to record that the greatest tragedy of this period of social transition was not the strident clamor of the bad people, but the appalling silence of the good people - Martin Luther King, Jr.

  14. #134
    All Blizzard stories are a joke.

    D3 and SC2 were abominations as well.

  15. #135
    The Unstoppable Force
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Where Thrall and the Horde needs me to be
    Posts
    23,561
    Quote Originally Posted by Myrok View Post
    The Sons of Lothar were the greatest heroes of the Alliance.

    World of Warcraft
    "Surprise, muddafookers! We're all neutral heroes!"

    Alliance fans of the RTS
    *Facepalm*

    P.S. An obligatory shout-out to the elves of Quel'Thalas being shoehorned into the Horde.
    .... Where as the Horde heroes of Warcraft 2 all got killed in WoW. Some even twice. ... Yay?

    Amazing sig, done by mighty Lokann

  16. #136
    The Undying Lochton's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    FEEL THE WRATH OF MY SPANNER!!
    Posts
    37,509
    Sounds more like the OP isn't able to handle that story has to take a developing turn for something to progress.
    FOMO: "Fear Of Missing Out", also commonly known as people with a mental issue of managing time and activities, many expecting others to fit into their schedule so they don't miss out on things to come. If FOMO becomes a problem for you, do seek help, it can be a very unhealthy lifestyle..

  17. #137
    Not working together to stop the biggest push the Legion has ever tried would be a lore killing story line. Deciding to stop the world destroying threat first makes more sense to me then fighting over something that will not be around if the Legion had their way.

  18. #138
    Dreadlord Molvonos's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Everywhere, Nowhere, Anywhere
    Posts
    909
    Quote Originally Posted by Barrages View Post
    It's been dead since WOTLK. The devs even said they never really even intended for WoW to last as long as it has. The lore ended where the lore in the RTS ended. They've just been pulling stuff (and worse quality stuff as it goes on) out of their asses to keep the cash cow going ever since.
    Source please.
    Personal Preference and Opinions ≠ Facts, Truth, or Logic

  19. #139
    Herald of the Titans Ratyrel's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    Location
    Germany
    Posts
    2,620
    Quote Originally Posted by Ilyiana View Post
    Am I the only one who still likes this game's lore? Legion WAS my favorite lore expansion to date. Suramar was new and completely exquisite top to bottom. Zones were good, pacing is great, 7.3 looks beyond phenomenal. I don't think it's dead by any means.
    I agree really. Legion and the Chronicle volumes have done more for lore recently than all the RTS games at this point imo. The lore is way more than just Red vs. Blue and has been for a very, very long time, basically since Warcraft III.

  20. #140
    Dreadlord Molvonos's Avatar
    15+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Everywhere, Nowhere, Anywhere
    Posts
    909
    Quote Originally Posted by Ilyiana View Post
    Am I the only one who still likes this game's lore? Legion WAS my favorite lore expansion to date. Suramar was new and completely exquisite top to bottom. Zones were good, pacing is great, 7.3 looks beyond phenomenal. I don't think it's dead by any means.
    Nah, you're not alone. I love the lore. Warcraft is its own thing. Not just humans and orcs, not just medieval fantasy. Too many people who hate it, have raging hardons for their RTS nostalgia and cant get the fuck over it, to enjoy whats there instead of pining over the past.
    Personal Preference and Opinions ≠ Facts, Truth, or Logic

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •