Tomb of Sargeras Progression Thread

[ryjkur]

lol grave robber. this post was before any guild killed sisters.

Ok then, but why make such comment if no one even pulled it?

[Deleted]

Ok then, but why make such comment if no one even pulled it?

Just read all of the 364 sites, maybe you get what is going on in this topic

[Deleted]

Ok then, but why make such comment if no one even pulled it?

Everyone, including top guilds (read Method/Exorsus interview) expected Desolate Host to be a wall (gorefiend like). But he was simply way too undertuned. No damage requirement (you can have 3 tanks/5 heal it and have 2-3 people dead in P1 and still kill the boss). Lot of mechanics can be ignored (spears with immunities, not forced to kill the bonewardens because they just do nothing, wither debuff that you just heal through etc...) and the list goes on. The realm mechanic is super cool, but you just ignore it... I think in our first kill we had something like 4 or 5 realm swap TOTAL (because not enough immunities/unlucky with spear).
He could have been the hardest bosses of the first 7 if he was tuned right.

[Deleted]

Yeah Desolate Host with "Proper" tuning would be on par with current Mistress difficulty level. I think the boss was way higher tuned on the PTR (missed that test) which lead people to believe it was harder than it turned out to be.

[Demonidze]

Rogue = 1 role, Druid = 4 roles

kek lul whatever

yet they choose druids to fill those roles. not some other class. so yeah, still kek

[willemh]

Explain what system is that, oh wise one. Since I see little in your post but dismissive arguments with little meat to them. Because right now, if I need a piece off say, Harjatan H (like the ring), I can kill him on Heroic and kill him on Mythic for 2 chances at that piece. With a shared lockout, I need to kill him on Mythic first or lose out on my chance at the 930 ring. We do our farm run Tuesday and usually progress on Thursday and Friday.

Explain to me, how a shared lockout doesn't penalize me. Or how it doesn't penalize someone who likes to run LFR or Normal first day of the week then does Heroic runs with friends or guildies later down the line. or any of the other combination of raiders that don't nolife the fuck out of the first month of the tier to get their names on some third-party website.

These issues would be solved by some kind of tournament realm for WF progression, but Blizzard obviously doesn't care about doing that and I can understand why. So in between locking the playerbase to one difficulty level and making those who want to do WFs farm Heroic, I'll take the latter any day of the week. It wasn't a big problem in WOD because Titanforging wasn't out of hand. Fix TF and you fix the issue, no need to take the axe to other gameplay systems.

As I said, it's not only the 'nolife top 10 mythic raiders' that dislike the current sytem. Even I as a simple guildless heroic pugger feel penatalised if I dont run normal ToS each week. I dislike it and it burns me out of the content faster making me go into my break untill the next content patch sooner. And I'm not the only one.

So with the current system I feel I'm being punished if I don't run the same content multiple times each week. And you feel you would be punished if you can't run the same content multiple times each week. Now our difference of opinion is which group is the largest. My group, or your group. And no, my group doesnt only consist of 'nolife top 10 mythic raiders'. I would fucking hate it if I was a very casual player in a normal raiding guild and I would only have 4 hours to play the game each week and I would be gimped by not running LFR during those 4 hours so instead of spending those 4 hours in normal raids I would have to go back and do LFR. Isn't the content thats appropriately difficult for your level of play the most fun and rewarding content anyway? Why would you want to farm braindead easy faceroll shit? I really dont think I'm a small minority that thinks this way.

[Raiju]

As I said, it's not only the 'nolife top 10 mythic raiders' that dislike the current sytem. Even I as a simple guildless heroic pugger feel penatalised if I dont run normal ToS each week. I dislike it and it burns me out of the content faster making me go into my break untill the next content patch sooner. And I'm not the only one.

I doubt your view is common since for for many heroic / low level mythic guilds it's practically impossible to get people to run normal mode. Noone can be bothered even with it taking 1 hour~

[Gorsameth]

As I said, it's not only the 'nolife top 10 mythic raiders' that dislike the current sytem. Even I as a simple guildless heroic pugger feel penatalised if I dont run normal ToS each week. I dislike it and it burns me out of the content faster making me go into my break untill the next content patch sooner. And I'm not the only one.

So with the current system I feel I'm being punished if I don't run the same content multiple times each week. And you feel you would be punished if you can't run the same content multiple times each week. Now our difference of opinion is which group is the largest. My group, or your group. And no, my group doesnt only consist of 'nolife top 10 mythic raiders'. I would fucking hate it if I was a very casual player in a normal raiding guild and I would only have 4 hours to play the game each week and I would be gimped by not running LFR during those 4 hours so instead of spending those 4 hours in normal raids I would have to go back and do LFR. Isn't the content thats appropriately difficult for your level of play the most fun and rewarding content anyway? Why would you want to farm braindead easy faceroll shit? I really dont think I'm a small minority that thinks this way.

Learn some self control, it really is that simple.

[willemh]

I doubt your view is common since for for many heroic / low level mythic guilds it's practically impossible to get people to run normal mode. Noone can be bothered even with it taking 1 hour~

I dont know. If I feel I need to run it even when I dont have any commitment to any guild I'm sure those in a guild feel even more pressured. The 2 guilds on my server that I know (one 3/9 mythic and another 9/9 heroic) both run a normal raid every week.

But as I said, I dont claim to know which group of players is larger, the one that runs bosses multiple times and burns out of content faster due to it, or the one that enjoys running bosses multiple times and would be mad if that was no longer rewarding. All I know is that the first group surely is a significant part of the playerbase and not only 'nolife top 10 mythic players'.

Learn some self control, it really is that simple.

If I didnt learn self control I wouldnt be casually pugging raids through the groupfinder without any obligations to any guild. However 'Just dont do it if you dont like it' doesnt really apply tho in a game like wow. If blizzard would add a way to get an ensured 955 item by farming 2.000 murlocs in a week. Would you again respond with 'just dont do it if you dont like it'? In an MMORPG like WoW there have always been 'tedius, yet rewarding' tasks that you dont do because you enjoy doing them, but that you do because you enjoy their reward. Skipping any content or task in WoW that you dont trully enjoy is really not always an option. Raiding shoudnt be one of those activities tho, and if players only farm the lower difficulty for its reward and not because they enjoy doing it then the raiding system could be improved.

[Shammyrock]

Not really, say you're really close to clear one difficulty you could extend the lockout, clear the last boss on that difficulty and then continue progressing on the next difficulty. As I said, I want a per-boss lockout, not an instance wide one.

In general however, with this system in place you would obviously never start with an easier level if you are capable of doing a higher level. You would start with the the difficulty thats applicable to your level and then tune down if needed towards the end of the week. This even has the extra benefit of players being able to progress bosses on their intended difficulty instead of racing through normal when your level of play is clearly higher and then being bored by the time they reach these bosses on their intended difficulty because they already killed them multiple times.

Also, you're stating as fact that it's only a minority of people that burn out from content. However I would like to doubt that statement. Everywhere around me I see clear signs of a huge part of the playerbase burning out of content only a few weeks/months after it's released. So I would like to ask you where you got the idea from that only a small minority of the playerbase is burning out from content?

That assumes people/guilds/PUGs know their "level" from the start. Also for every person who gets bored by easy bosses, there'd be a person who gets frustrated/disillusioned etc by hitting a brick wall of difficulty in your method.

I would challenge you on the last part. In this topic I was assuming we were discussing burnout due to repeated running of the same instance on alts/different dificulties, given the section this topic is in. The section of the playerbase that actually do this are tiny relative to the whole population. Making your change to suit that minority would be a bad decision. Lack of content you want to do in general is a different topic (and isnt always burnout).

[Jastall]

As I said, it's not only the 'nolife top 10 mythic raiders' that dislike the current sytem. Even I as a simple guildless heroic pugger feel penatalised if I dont run normal ToS each week. I dislike it and it burns me out of the content faster making me go into my break untill the next content patch sooner. And I'm not the only one.

So with the current system I feel I'm being punished if I don't run the same content multiple times each week. And you feel you would be punished if you can't run the same content multiple times each week. Now our difference of opinion is which group is the largest. My group, or your group. And no, my group doesnt only consist of 'nolife top 10 mythic raiders'. I would fucking hate it if I was a very casual player in a normal raiding guild and I would only have 4 hours to play the game each week and I would be gimped by not running LFR during those 4 hours so instead of spending those 4 hours in normal raids I would have to go back and do LFR. Isn't the content thats appropriately difficult for your level of play the most fun and rewarding content anyway? Why would you want to farm braindead easy faceroll shit? I really dont think I'm a small minority that thinks this way.

As others said, that's on you. That there are advantages in running the content on 2 different difficulties doesn't mean you're forced to do so. Nobody who raids is ''forced'' to do all that much unless you're pushing for world firsts which comprises 1% of 1% of the playerbase. Albeit, as I said, I'm OK with scaling back Titanforging so that running Normal cannot give you gear better than Heroic and so forth. This should lower the impetus to farm for gear beyond the usual fare of getting trinkets and tier sets.

You (and others) feel penalized by separate lockouts? OK, but the majority of raiders actually are penalized by shared lockouts, not too many raiders stick to one difficulty alone per toon. And I doubt having several difficulties open contributes to burnout significantly; an overly long tier or overly demanding farming outside of the raid (like the AP situation pre-Concordance) burns out people far more than smashing through Normal on an off day once they've done Heroic.

[PointerToAddress]

I think people are getting confused on non-shared lockouts and split runs. Even if there were shared lockouts there will be split runs. You will need to lock people out of the bosses per account to really eliminate split runs, but if you do that there is no reason to progress on alts. Split runs do a lot more damage to the game than non-shared lockouts and it's something that may never be resolved without punishing severely a huge amount of the population.

[Gorsameth]

I think people are getting confused on non-shared lockouts and split runs. Even if there were shared lockouts there will be split runs. You will need to lock people out of the bosses per account to really eliminate split runs, but if you do that there is no reason to progress on alts. Split runs do a lot more damage to the game than non-shared lockouts and it's something that may never be resolved without punishing severely a huge amount of the population.

Account locks don't work either because then you move all your characters to different accounts.

The easiest way to kill split runs is to make everything Personal Loot.

(tho as others have said, killing split runs is not a worthwhile goal, the number of players affected is tiny.)

[Deleted]

The easiest way to kill split runs is to make everything Personal Loot.

If they ever announch that, many, many maaaaany people will applauding while saying "Good Job, now you"ve killed even the last thing on raiding"

[Gorsameth]

If they ever announch that, many, many maaaaany people will applauding while saying "Good Job, now you"ve killed even the last thing on raiding"

I never said it was good for the game ^^
Tho it doesn't even solve the issue.... Instead of 5 alts you run 5 of the same class and pick the one who gets the best loot to progress with.

[durrtygoodz]

Scrubbusters with "World First double DK no goblin 17 year old american raider playing handicap class no day time raiding"

[Chiasmus]

Congratulations Miniaug on US first Mythic Kil'jaeden.

[sjuk]

Will na even finish top 10? Will this thread be löcked before we see representation from na?


Oh, see yall on argus #LimitRising

[Simmias]

Will na even finish top 10? Will this thread be löcked before we see representation from na?


Oh, see yall on argus #LimitRising

oceanic kill very close, poor americans always struggling.

[durrtygoodz]

oceanic kill very close, poor americans always struggling.

How close, give us the gossip girlfriend