[Balance] Legion Discussion

[Myztikrice]

Yeah T20 has been my favorite tier set in a long while. It will be sad when we have to get rid of it for boring % dmg increases.

[Kyanion]

Yeah T20 has been my favorite tier set in a long while. It will be sad when we have to get rid of it for boring % dmg increases.

No kidding. T20 is an amazing set and I dread when we have to finally replace it.

[Deleted]

At their current state (10-15% filler dmg and 10% DoT damage after AP spender) I would gladly be last in line for the T21 sets.

[Deleted]

There is no way T21 is going to go live in its current state. Worst case they'll only fix the numbers (currently 4p is a ~2% dps increase absolute best case ST, which includes using ED to maximize uptime), best case they will completely redesign it. 2p is extremely boring, basically a rip-off of tier 2p19 and doesn't do anything for AOE. 4p forces you into an ED like playstyle single target where you cast SS every 4-5 seconds, and does the same to AOE, where you now want to cast starfall atleast every 4 sec instead of the usual 8 sec. Also, since dots do about 50% of our AOE dmg and 20% of our ST the 4p is either OP for AOE or UP for ST depending on tuning. Horrible design in my opinion, seems like absolutely zero thought has gone into it.

[Deleted]

How much would they have to tune 4p for starfall to be used in ST for empowerment? Because that's something I wouldn't really want to do.

[huth]

More than they can afford since it would boost AoE by about 5 times as much.

[Deleted]

How much would they have to tune 4p for starfall to be used in ST for empowerment? Because that's something I wouldn't really want to do.

If you're playing Incarnation it shouldn't get anywhere close to SS single target, but if you're playing WoE + SotF it might be relevant if they buff the 4p to the usual value of a 4p (6-8%). However, I still think it's going to change, seeing as buffing it to those numbers would make it absolutely crazy for AOE.

[Myztikrice]

All the T21 are boring, I don't have much faith they'll make it interesting.

[Anrael11]

Dear fellow moonkins, please help me manage my little problem
I've got today Tome of Unraveling Sanity ilvl 950
I've also have Tarnished Sentinel Medalion ilvl 900 and Terror from Below 905
Which 2 of them I should use? Because I don't know is it good to equip 2 usable trinkets (Medalion and Tome)
Thank you!

Couldn't post armory link

[Deleted]

Dear fellow moonkins, please help me manage my little problem
I've got today Tome of Unraveling Sanity ilvl 950
I've also have Tarnished Sentinel Medalion ilvl 900 and Terror from Below 905
Which 2 of them I should use? Because I don't know is it good to equip 2 usable trinkets (Medalion and Tome)
Thank you!

Couldn't post armory link

I'd use tome and Terror.

[huth]

You need more trinkets. Particularly because none of those are any good for AoE.

[Hellshout]

Dear fellow moonkins, please help me manage my little problem
I've got today Tome of Unraveling Sanity ilvl 950
I've also have Tarnished Sentinel Medalion ilvl 900 and Terror from Below 905
Which 2 of them I should use? Because I don't know is it good to equip 2 usable trinkets (Medalion and Tome)
Thank you!

Couldn't post armory link

Tome and Medallion imho. Crit vs Mastery and the owl does give @6% dmg in a fight.

[Polarthief]

Dear fellow moonkins, please help me manage my little problem
I've got today Tome of Unraveling Sanity ilvl 950
I've also have Tarnished Sentinel Medalion ilvl 900 and Terror from Below 905
Which 2 of them I should use? Because I don't know is it good to equip 2 usable trinkets (Medalion and Tome)
Thank you!

Couldn't post armory link

Sentinel Medallion is auto-pick. It's our BiS trinket. As for the other, Tome because Terror is so awkward and your Tome is 950, beating out a 905 Terror.

I'd use tome and Terror.

No, you don't opt out of using Sentinel for anything other than Arcanocrystal or a high TF Whispers or ToS trinket. It's BiS by quite a margin. Because his Tome is 950, it's about as good as his 900 Sentinel (despite being a ridiculous 50 iLvl difference). If Tome wasn't that high then I'd say Sentinel and Terror.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...lview?sle=true

[Deleted]

Sentinel Medallion is auto-pick. It's our BiS trinket. As for the other, Tome because Terror is so awkward and your Tome is 950, beating out a 905 Terror.



No, you don't opt out of using Sentinel for anything other than Arcanocrystal or a high TF Whispers or ToS trinket. It's BiS by quite a margin. Because his Tome is 950, it's about as good as his 900 Sentinel (despite being a ridiculous 50 iLvl difference). If Tome wasn't that high then I'd say Sentinel and Terror.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets...lview?sle=true

Sorry but my sims disagree and I'm a slave to Simcraft /shrug

[Polarthief]

Sorry but my sims disagree and I'm a slave to Simcraft /shrug

Your sims say a 905 Terror is better than a 900 Sentinel? Unless it's strictly for heavy AoE fights, I find that extremely hard to believe (if AoE then I can believe that because Sentinel is bad for AoE).

Sentinel (Arcane damage, +10% from Moonkin Form) stacked with an Incarnation (IFE makes the CD of Inc/CA about 2 minutes, give or take 10-15s), plus Sentinel giving a massive amount of Mastery (our 1st/2nd best stat) over Terror giving Crit (our 3rd stat). Without even simming, I just can't fathom how Sentinel could be worse. Did Terror get stealth-buffed or something?

Edit: Just simmed it myself using ST (Patchwerk). Accidentally left on SOTF and LATC, was about a 10-15k difference in Sentinel's favor. Put on Inc and IFE, difference is now 20k. This was using a 920 Terror and 915 Sentinel (because I have a 915), so either Sentinel got nerfed and/or Terror got buffed, but Terror is still weaker, even at +5 iLvls, and I'm a boomkin with VERY little crit (I have like 12-13%). Really no clue how your sims are saying Terror is better, unless you're talking like 15+ iLvls over Medallion. Anrael's is only +5.

[Kyanion]

Your sims say a 905 Terror is better than a 900 Sentinel? Unless it's strictly for heavy AoE fights, I find that extremely hard to believe (if AoE then I can believe that because Sentinel is bad for AoE).

Sentinel (Arcane damage, +10% from Moonkin Form) stacked with an Incarnation (IFE makes the CD of Inc/CA about 2 minutes, give or take 10-15s), plus Sentinel giving a massive amount of Mastery (our 1st/2nd best stat) over Terror giving Crit (our 3rd stat). Without even simming, I just can't fathom how Sentinel could be worse. Did Terror get stealth-buffed or something?

Edit: Just simmed it myself using ST (Patchwerk). Accidentally left on SOTF and LATC, was about a 10-15k difference in Sentinel's favor. Put on Inc and IFE, difference is now 20k. This was using a 920 Terror and 915 Sentinel (because I have a 915), so either Sentinel got nerfed and/or Terror got buffed, but Terror is still weaker, even at +5 iLvls, and I'm a boomkin with VERY little crit (I have like 12-13%). Really no clue how your sims are saying Terror is better, unless you're talking like 15+ iLvls over Medallion. Anrael's is only +5.

I believe Terror's nature damage scales in a similar fashion to Sentinel at least. From what I've understood from talking in the discord is that Sent/Terror are great ST trinkets and for AoE you'd want Arcano Crystal/Whispers. This is assuming decent ilevel on the trinkets (well not the Arcano since it defaults 860).

[Polarthief]

I believe Terror's nature damage

Y'know, I never even bothered to know what Terror's damage type is, rip me.

If it's Nature, then yes, it too scales.

From what I've understood from talking in the discord is that Sent/Terror are great ST trinkets and for AoE you'd want Arcano Crystal/Whispers. This is assuming decent ilevel on the trinkets (well not the Arcano since it defaults 860).

Terror is still weaker than Sentinel though, even when Terror is +5 iLvls ahead. Now 10 or more iLvls, that's a different story.

[Kyanion]

Y'know, I never even bothered to know what Terror's damage type is, rip me.

If it's Nature, then yes, it too scales.



Terror is still weaker than Sentinel though, even when Terror is +5 iLvls ahead. Now 10 or more iLvls, that's a different story.

Yeah, terror is indeed nature damage so the scaling is quite nice. Agreed that terror is weaker than Sentinel. I use a 915 sent and 940 terror for ST.

I was told that Terror is not a great option for AoE and I should use Arcano Crystal/Whispers for those types of fights.

[huth]

Yeah, terror is indeed nature damage so the scaling is quite nice. Agreed that terror is weaker than Sentinel. I use a 915 sent and 940 terror for ST.

I was told that Terror is not a great option for AoE and I should use Arcano Crystal/Whispers for those types of fights.

Terror always does the same total damage split amongst all targets and you(not a typo) within ~8y of the primary target. So don't use it on very cramped fights, either.

[Lahis]

Terror always does the same total damage split amongst all targets and you(not a typo) within ~8y of the primary target. So don't use it on very cramped fights, either.

"Why you died?"

"Stood on my trinket...."