Car ploughs through protesters at Charlottesville Alt-Right rally

[TheRickyB]

That would depend on if those being non violent are advocating for violence or rather death specifically of others they claim should tolerate them and be non violent.

REALLY need to be careful with that, BLM and Antifa Chant death to cops all the time. REALLY may want to watch out what you're ACTUALLY advocating for. . .

[Deleted]

I'll skip~ when someone calls internet trolls "Nazi", I'll be sure to throw some cheap shots too.

And yet, only one group used Nazi symbology the past few days in Charlotteville, the same that used fasces symbols.

[Elba]

There's no defending the driver that killed someone and there's no defending this. You can't have it both ways.

Plowing a car into peaceful protestors, killing 1, injuring dozens, and punching a fascist for being a fascist are not moral equivalent.

[rogueMatthias]

I cannot understand how someone can be offended by removing a statue.

But seriously, would you like to see someone being publicly honored and glorified who fought for the continued enslavement of your people?

"The sins of the past helped forge the present".

I think it's important that history is remembered, publicly and wholly, just contextualised for today. I'm generally against removal of statues but that's partly because, living in Britain, if we removed every statue of a figure that would be "controversial" by todays standards we wouldn't have many statues left.

The best ideas I've seen here is to update all the plaques to say "this is why he was honoured at the time, but this is why he was actually a shit-head and what we've learnt from this" so people can take something real away from these statues. At the very least, they're a reminder of that history and open debate.

IMO the huge difference and the biggest issue here the following -
There was a lot of debate in the UK last year about the removal of a statue of Cecil Rhodes, an ardent imperialist. There was much discussion and many viewpoints... but NONE of these were about whether he was justified in his beliefs, misunderstood, right, or if he was in some way still a hero to a lot of people.

Figures like Lee are still publicly honoured and glorified today in the US, statue or no statue. He still seems to be a national hero to some; where once as a figure of national reconciliation, now he's just used as symbol of a lot of extremist ideas (that even Lee likely wouldn't have agreed with). There's clearly (as evidenced from the protest) a much larger issue here with a radicalised element of the right who are just using things like the removal of the statues to try and justify their own existence.

[Darkeon]

And yet, only one group used Nazi symbology the past few days in Charlotteville, the same that used fasces symbols.

Same can be said about the picture I was commenting about - only one group actually got violent, even though some edgy bearded guy was making a salute and some other dude was flipping the bird on his face.

[Doctor Amadeus]

REALLY need to be careful with that, BLM and Antifa Chant death to cops all the time. REALLY may want to watch out what you're ACTUALLY advocating for. . .

First off I am not BLM or Antifa, and second no they fucking don't I have watched enough of their protest, and never have I seen anything like that except from questionable sources.

And yeah anybody advocating that shit fuck them, but that isn't what Antifa or BLM is about Alt-Right on the other hand it is nothing but.

[Elba]

"The sins of the past helped forge the present".

I think it's important that history is remembered, publicly and wholly, just contextualised for today. I'm generally against removal of statues but that's partly because, living in Britain, if we removed every statue of a figure that would be "controversial" by todays standards we wouldn't have many statues left.

The best ideas I've seen here is to update all the plaques to say "this is why he was honoured at the time, but this is why he was actually a shit-head and what we've learnt from this" so people can take something real away from these statues.

IMO the huge difference and the biggest issue here the following -
As a comparison, there was a lot of debate in the UK last year about the removal of a statue of Cecil Rhodes, an ardent imperialist. There was much discussion and many viewpoints... but NONE of these were about whether he was justified in his beliefs, misunderstood, right, or if he was in some way still a hero to a lot of people.

Figures like Lee are still publicly honoured and glorified today in the US, statue or no statue. He still seems to be a national hero to some; where once as a figure of national reconciliation, now he's just used as symbol of a lot of extremist ideas (that even Lee likely wouldn't have agreed with). There's clearly (as evidenced from the protest) a much larger issue here with a radicalised element of the right who are just using things like the removal of the statues to try and justify their own existence.

As others have pointed out, there is nothing historic about the statue. It was put up decades afterwards in order to whitewash the history. Into the trash it goes.

[Doctor Amadeus]

He was being peaceful. The guy who punched him was not.

The guy running into protesters was not being peaceful.

[Bullettime]

Same can be said about the picture I was commenting about - only one group actually got violent, even though some edgy bearded guy was making a salute and some other dude was flipping the bird on his face.

Yeah one picture.

Ignoring every fucking thing else that happened or what would have led up to it.

[Elba]

He was being peaceful. The guy who punched him was not.

Nothing peaceful about being a Nazi.

[Manabomb]

Someone violently silencing someone whose opinion they do not agree with? Yeah, that's cool in your eyes, I guess

Nazism isn't an opinion. Nazism is a violent ideology that will not be tolerated. Stop conflating Nazism with opinion. It isn't.

[Darkeon]

Yeah one picture.

Ignoring every fucking thing else that happened or what would have led up to it.

Adults are trying to talk here. If you can't discuss other topics, related to the big subject, refrain from engaging in said conversations. Easy peasy, mate.

[TheRickyB]

First off I am not BLM or Antifa, and second no they fucking don't I have watched enough of their protest, and never have I seen anything like that except from questionable sources.

And yeah anybody advocating that shit fuck them, but that isn't what Antifa or BLM is about Alt-Right on the other hand it is nothing but.

"questionable sources" i.e. videos of their rallies, so your boldface lying. but the Point of my post was if you advocate violence against people who want violence against others, it just doesnt apply to people you dont like.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Not condoning violence doesn't mean you're defending the "Nazi" guy.

It is defending the guy if you equate punching a Nazi, to running people over trying to kill them.

[Deleted]

Same can be said about the picture I was commenting about - only one group actually got violent, even though some edgy bearded guy was making a salute and some other dude was flipping the bird on his face.

See me here advocating either side? This isn't black vs. white, there are countless moderates like me (including many on this same thread) that are against both groups.

The thing is the topic of this thread is about one group member using the exact same tactics as a terrorist organization.

[Manabomb]

Not condoning violence doesn't mean you're defending the "Nazi" guy.

Not condoning violence against a violent ideology is exactly how Nazism became powerful.

[Bullettime]

He was being peaceful. The guy who punched him was not.

White nationalists were throwing bricks, rocks, and cups full of piss at people regardless of if they were counter protesters or not, They were grabbing random bystanders on the street and telling them the ways they'd like to kill them. They would have small groups stand outside businesses and yell that the minorities in the shop or shop owners belong in a gas chamber. They bludgeoned and even hospitalized people with torches after getting told to fuck off at UVA on Friday night.

I'm not saying that's what happened in this particular case to warrant the punch, but the white nationalists weren't protesting peacefully.

[Darkeon]

Nazism isn't an opinion. Nazism is a violent ideology that will not be tolerated. Stop conflating Nazism with opinion. It isn't.

A lot of people are doing and tagging along with Nazi symbols because it triggers the rabid regressives.

That bearded edgelord could hate Jews and want them gone. Or he could be one of those I mentioned above. Until he actually commits a violent action, don't attack him. It's that simple to behave accordingly to what you preach.

[Doctor Amadeus]

"questionable sources" i.e. videos of their rallies, so your boldface lying. but the Point of my post was if you advocate violence against people who want violence against others, it just doesnt apply to people you dont like.

No, I am saying you are flat out making shit up, because you know good god damn well there is a huge difference between people who's primary goal is protesting the mistreatment of cops and those who want to shut down a lecture of hate speech at a campus.

And a Facist Neo Nazi White Supremacist, who actively promote hatred and death for those they consider the enemy, meaning war with anybody not white.

[Darkeon]

See me here advocating either side? This isn't black vs. white, there are countless moderates like me (including many on this same thread) that are against both groups.

The thing is the topic of this thread is about one group member using the exact same tactics as a terrorist organization.

And, again, what does that has anything to do with what I commented about Elba's post?