Blizzard just give up on LFR

[MrExcelion]

Won't be going away -- Every new wing gets its spotlight on the launcher

LFR KJ is in a pretty good place. Some sense of accountability in there if you wipe

[haxartus]

I'm a PvP'er and I do LFR once per patch to check out the storyline and the design. I really don't care about the difficulty as I don't find it challenging to beat a script someone wrote that follows the exact same rules of combat that it has been following for the past 10 years. If a players was controlling any of these bosses, would you have beaten them ? No, not even with 5 times more people.

Can I play heroic/mythic ? Well, I did raid heroic Icecrown Citadel back then... No, it wasn't interesting, rewarding or fun.

[Vladinator]

Again and again, the same thread remade without end.

Reasons to keep LFR are simple, they cater to a specific type of player, mostly casuals and act like a way to get you interested into raiding/guilds if it happens to be your thing. Either way you have the opportunity to see the content raiders see without being one yourself. There is a huge amount of casual players that by the looks of thing, enjoy LFR and do it actively. Why take away the platform from them?

Often threads talk about going about the whole "see the content" in other ways, the issue is though, it's easier to made a stripped-down version and put it in the LFR queue, than to design a solo type scenario for a raid instance, without it being a literal on-rails experience. It would be too hard to make interesting, and if done right would take too much time to implement. Stripping the normal difficulty down to LFR and having a queue solves the issue quite easily and provides a platform casuals can enjoy the content without having to make a group for it.

[kamuimac]

If LFR is harder, people wont' be able to just afk it, meaning they'll get kicked if they do. So eventually people will know in lfr, they need to do shit.

Whereas atm, people know they can afk and it'll all die.

you are mistaken - its been proven by multiple lfr bosses in past that people do not rise to chalenge and expecting them to is bound to fail - it been proven by garalon its been proven by durumu its been proven by lei shen its been proven by nazgrim its been proven by garosh its been proven by archimond - unless blizzard nerfs the encounters to the ground it will neverbe pleadant experience to anyone.

there may be masochists out there who enjoy wiping 5-7 times on lfr bosses but most of those who claim how they want chalenge in lfr are straight liers - those are not people who do lfr - those are people who do normal and higher and want to screw up people who only do lfr just to troll due to how pathetic and miserable their life is.

just look at KJ - its horrible mess atm - people cant kill it without at least 5 stacks of determination yet blizzard is happy with that ? that just proves how incompetent retard Hazzikostas is and that he should have been fired long time ago.

[Emerald Archer]

you are mistaken - its been proven by multiple lfr bosses in past that people do not rise to chalenge and expecting them to is bound to fail - it been proven by garalon its been proven by durumu its been proven by lei shen its been proven by nazgrim its been proven by garosh its been proven by archimond - unless blizzard nerfs the encounters to the ground it will neverbe pleadant experience to anyone.

there may be masochists out there who enjoy wiping 5-7 times on lfr bosses but most of those who claim how they want chalenge in lfr are straight liers - those are not people who do lfr - those are people who do normal and higher and want to screw up people who only do lfr just to troll due to how pathetic and miserable their life is.

just look at KJ - its horrible mess atm - people cant kill it without at least 5 stacks of determination yet blizzard is happy with that ? that just proves how incompetent retard Hazzikostas is and that he should have been fired long time ago.

What? Fights like Durumu and Lei Shen showed players did rise and improve. Initially you wipe a crap ton yeah, but then after a few weeks, it's 1-3 shots. People learn, and do the fights correctly.

Week 1 of an lfr opening damn right there should be wipes. week 2 aswell. Too many lazy players expect to have everything handed to them.

[Swiftshadow]

i had thought lfr people would have matured by now and at least do the ONE mechanic that wipes the raid.

lfr Kiljaden proved just how naive I was.

Did it on all my alts just to clear the quest from my log.

No way am I doing that again.

If Blizz expects 5 or more pugs to somewhat co-operate in lfr. They clearly have no idea what is LFR to the majority of the people participating in it.

[Rotted]

People care because a large number of people still run LFR just for the legendary chance/to build back luck protection. You can get a legendary a week if you clear every raid on LFR, normal, and heroic, and you do the nether disruptor every day it's up. As a supposed mythic raider you should be aware of this more than anybody, since legendaries are more important to you than everyone else. Perhaps you're lucky enough to already have every legendary for every spec of your main, or maybe you're just lying, i have no idea, but either way you should be less oblivious to this.

His point remains, mind your own dammed business and focus on what you need / want

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i had thought lfr people would have matured by now and at least do the ONE mechanic that wipes the raid.

lfr Kiljaden proved just how naive I was.

Did it on all my alts just to clear the quest from my log.

No way am I doing that again.

If Blizz expects 5 or more pugs to somewhat co-operate in lfr. They clearly have no idea what is LFR to the majority of the people participating in it.

In a week or two they will know that mechanic, it literally happens every time we get a new wing, regardless what raid it is. People ignore shit / dont read up and get a bucket of wipes. They get tired of it and learn it in the 2nd or 3rd week. It's not exclusive to KJ...

[Deleted]

So far my favourite KJ LFR runs were the two super troll cases:
- someone spamclicking the map far from actual location of Illidan
- a trio of two tanks and a healer dragging an LFR group through 5 intentional wipes around 1am, with intermissions consisting of swapblaster kills by sending folks on mounts off the platform.

I loved them for the value of presenting the perfect, clear and understandable image of Trv Raidorz to the LFR plebs.

[Taeldorian]

Other way round mate - it started off OK when it was launched but as it got easier and easier I lost interest. If they're adding some difficulty back in that sounds great. Maybe I was unlucky with pugging but I hit so many groups that wanted super high ilvl and the cheev of already having beaten the encounter within days of it being released. Just a pain I didn't need.

Oh my bad man. Misunderstood you I guess. Post still stands for anyone that is upset it's getting a bit more challenging, but I agree with you.

Most normal pugs from what I've seen ask for 900-915. That's not bad at all but it's up to you. The most they usually want is decievers fall and 900 Ilvl which aren't hard requirements to hit.

[Deleted]

My post was never about getting rid of lfr. I just meant in the face of blizzards current goal and upcoming changes I don't see the point. If lfr is just easy mode leave it as is but blizzard themselves said they want to makr it harder so people have to do tactics. My point was that making it harder will not make people do tactics.

If blizzard wants people to learn tactics and progress to normal or heroic in its current form lfr is not the right place I think.


I made this thread as my thoughts and feedback as ok still like to think blizzard appreciates constructive feedback and actually the vast majority of replies have been interesting, well thought out and contain good feedback from both sides of the fence.

So thank you to all who replied off my thread.

[grandgato]

This is my favorite argument. I know people who have had cancer longer than that hadn't had it. I don't hear them saying "Well this is just a part of me now." No fuck that, they say "Well shit if I could fucking get rid of it then I would." Difference is that it's a lot easier to cut out LFR than it is to cut out cancer regardless of the fact that they're one in the same.

That has to be one of the the shittiest analogy i have ever seen used to defend logic in a video game argument.

My post was never about getting rid of lfr. I just meant in the face of blizzards current goal and upcoming changes I don't see the point. If lfr is just easy mode leave it as is but blizzard themselves said they want to makr it harder so people have to do tactics. My point was that making it harder will not make people do tactics.

It can be easier then normal but still have enough bite to warrant participation and awareness. They took the nerf meter way too far with WoD, and the first portion of Legion IMO.

[Accendor]

I agree. The death of LFR as a reasonable challenge was the nail in the coffin of me staying on as a super casual. I know loads of folk will say 'pug normal' but this takes time I don't have.

I assume Blizz has metrics that tell them the easier LFR gets the more people play - I'm just not sure who. I can only think it's the under 12 crowd.

Pugging normal takes less time than a full LFR run.

[kamuimac]

Pugging normal takes less time than a full LFR run.

if you have AoTC and 920 itlv - if not you wont get into any groups - so you point is kinda moot because lfr audience dont have neither

[Lochton]

Nope, current LFR is okay, maybe a little harder could be better, else, fine. People just whine because they have to do things.

[Hctaz]

That has to be one of the the shittiest analogy i have ever seen used to defend logic in a video game argument..

LFR is literally cancer. I know many Azerothian heroes who were slain by it's existence.

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You sound like a politician. It's not difficult to cut out things that don't work. That is progress. Yeah they unsub and play overwatch or hearthstone. People have anyway. Plenty of people have found league of legends to be their wow killer. Removing something idiotic from the game isn't going to make the game worse.

It definitely is hard to cut out things that don't work lol. Were you not around for the WoD flying fiasco? They took it out and WERE NEVER GOING TO PUT IT BACK IN THE GAME EVER. They said "WoD is not going to have flying and we're not going to make future content with flying." People raged so hard that they immediately retracted their statement and thought up of ways to put flying in WoD without just making it on a vendor. It's obviously extremely hard to cut out things that aren't working because the masses with rage.

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My post was never about getting rid of lfr. I just meant in the face of blizzards current goal and upcoming changes I don't see the point. If lfr is just easy mode leave it as is but blizzard themselves said they want to makr it harder so people have to do tactics. My point was that making it harder will not make people do tactics.

If blizzard wants people to learn tactics and progress to normal or heroic in its current form lfr is not the right place I think.


I made this thread as my thoughts and feedback as ok still like to think blizzard appreciates constructive feedback and actually the vast majority of replies have been interesting, well thought out and contain good feedback from both sides of the fence.

So thank you to all who replied off my thread.

I'm laughing at the number of people who didn't read your post fucking at all. This is retarded. How do we show them all that they need to read and stop making posts assuming things? xD

[netherflame]

Nope LFR is geared more toward the player that has no time for raiding. They have to juggle taking care of their children or a full time job or both. So besides letting those people quit the game and focus on being a parent or their job. Blizzard instead keeps them around for the 15 usd per month by at least giving them something to do by letting them see the content and get gear for free.

Youtube has the same content but executed by people much better, that argument you gave continues to be really poor and I don't understand why people keep bringing it up. There are tons of other activities for players like the ones that would fit the mold you described above.

[kaid]

I am pretty on board with them going back to Pandaria LFR level of challenge. It still was very doable for randoms but there were mechanics you had to do and if you did not do them you got killed. They dumbed it down to far in WOD and legion has been better but still probably a bit more dumbed down than necessary.

Kil'jaden is a pretty good target difficulty wise. If you just ignore the mechanics you are going to just keep wiping. But the mechanics are not that bad and I have one or two shotted him on LFR with people who had seen the fight so its very doable but you have to actually pay attention and do the fight correctly.

[Eli85]

What I would like to see has been echoed on this thread, but I will say it again: remove LFR and make normal queueable. One less difficulty (there are too many) and you have a relatively easy difficulty that is not tourist mode.

[lockedout]

What I would like to see has been echoed on this thread, but I will say it again: remove LFR and make normal queueable. One less difficulty (there are too many) and you have a relatively easy difficulty that is not tourist mode.

LFR is already to hard for some people imagine normal.

[Eli85]

LFR is already to hard for some people imagine normal.

Tourist mode will be gone, likely by next expansion. So the change is happening. There will be two scenarios: i) players will adapt after a steep, harsh learning curve; or ii) players who cannot deal with the increased difficulty will stop queuing. Of course we know the consequences of ii if the vast majority of LFR players elect it, which is something I'm sure Blizzard is acutely aware of.