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  1. #21
    Yes and no, we just can't actually discern properly.

    For example C'Thun. "Your heart will explode". Obviously back then you'd assume you as the player, but now you could look at it and go... Could Azeroth being something more than just a lump of rock applied then? After all Azeroth is a nascent Titan. She has a wound... the Wound could be on or near her heart that with enough could explode and kill her.

    Now with Yogg'Saron, there's a few things that still can be overlooked. And actually, quite alarmed me... Mostly because:
    SoundFile: http://www.wowhead.com/sound=15761/ur-yoggsaron-death01
    Yogg'Saron said "And all of you, who inhabit this miserable little seedling". Blizzard engineered a nice little bomb that won't be told to players for years. The Old Gods were made out to know also as far back as fucking Wrath of the Lich King... That Azeroth was something more than a lump of rock... and being a "seedling", well easily referring to Azeroth being a fucking Titan. They knew the truth before we did. It may look like a lie but the reality is, we perceive it as a lie even when it could possibly be a truth.

    Yogg'Saron also says mid-fight "Look at the true face of death". And in the puzzle-box "Even death may die". Well he was right on both, Yogg is the God of Death and the interesting thing is is the word "may". Not will. And during the Diamond King quest they can hear Yogg'Saron whispering in Ulduar...
    Even stupid little things like "There is a little lamb lost in dark woods..." could be referring to Tyr dying and living his hammer in Tirisfal. A lamb to them really considering what happened to Tyr and fighting a C'Thraxxi which also happens to be one right before Yogg'Saron.

    If they knew Azeroth was a Titan that Yogg'Saron called a seedling... If they knew Tyr has died in Tirisfal by being a lamb in the dark forest and we didn't even see that big hint. I'm starting to think that actually the Old Gods tell a fuck ton more truths than we give them credit. We just never spot them because we aren't fully seeing the grander picture.
    Last edited by Evangeliste; 2017-08-17 at 11:17 PM.

  2. #22
    The Insane Aquamonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evangeliste View Post
    We just never spot them because we aren't fully seeing the grander picture.
    You give Blizzard too much credit in regards to foresight. They intentionally leave threads open so they can then be capitalized on later. Kosak admitted this in an interview about what's below Tirisfal Glades. They didn't have a plan at all for it. They just left it "wooooh, mysteeeeriouuuus" so that they could add something later.
    Originally Posted by Dave Kosak
    Is there anything below Tirisfal and should we be worried? Is something coming? Or is that a nothing? That has been a rumor since way back in the day.
    For the answer to that, this is the dirty secret. Sometimes there are just hooks that are there that we can do something with later if we have a really good idea for it. I would say that Tirisfal was one of those things that's like, "hmm, there's potential lore explanations for that." But we haven't said what they are yet because maybe we want to do something with that at some point. If we do, then we can totally explain it and do something really awesome gameplay-wise with it. But until then, there's no point in answering it because that may back us into a corner. What if we want to do something really cool there and then we can't because we've said "X". So there's a hook there for potentially awesome, awesome things in the future. But in the case of Tirisfal, there isn't a definitive answer. (Source)

    They didn't even know what order they were going to do WoD and Legion in or even how WoD was going to work. They didn't even have WoD fleshed out by the time BlizzCon happened.

  3. #23
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    They didn't even have WoD fleshed out by the time Legion launched.
    Fixed that for you, no need to thank me.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by Aquamonkey View Post
    You give Blizzard too much credit in regards to foresight. They intentionally leave threads open so they can then be capitalized on later. Kosak admitted this in an interview about what's below Tirisfal Glades. They didn't have a plan at all for it. They just left it "wooooh, mysteeeeriouuuus" so that they could add something later.
    Originally Posted by Dave Kosak
    Is there anything below Tirisfal and should we be worried? Is something coming? Or is that a nothing? That has been a rumor since way back in the day.
    For the answer to that, this is the dirty secret. Sometimes there are just hooks that are there that we can do something with later if we have a really good idea for it. I would say that Tirisfal was one of those things that's like, "hmm, there's potential lore explanations for that." But we haven't said what they are yet because maybe we want to do something with that at some point. If we do, then we can totally explain it and do something really awesome gameplay-wise with it. But until then, there's no point in answering it because that may back us into a corner. What if we want to do something really cool there and then we can't because we've said "X". So there's a hook there for potentially awesome, awesome things in the future. But in the case of Tirisfal, there isn't a definitive answer. (Source)

    They didn't even know what order they were going to do WoD and Legion in or even how WoD was going to work. They didn't even have WoD fleshed out by the time BlizzCon happened.
    Out of all the post you took Tirisfal. Interesting.

    They clearly had plans and though I give Blizzard "too much credit" you can't denounce Yogg'Saron claiming Azeroth to be a seedling as just a passing-by gesture.

    Fact is, we can believe they are lying even though we miss quite astonishing things like that because the fact is, we are very much ignorant until Blizzard releases it.
    Last edited by Evangeliste; 2017-08-18 at 09:19 AM.

  5. #25
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by gioderpington View Post
    Probably, but he has been cut off. Though maybe he was cut off because he served his purpose of destroying a minion on Yaj
    Well it's mentioned in the short story 'the charge of the aspects' that Thrall was able to move his spirit through the earth and he ended up in a cavern where noone could reach/sense him and deathwing was waiting for him there which ended in a struggle between the two. Perhaps Thralls presence there caused him to be exposed to other energies? The same way Deathwing had been corrupted?

  6. #26
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Evangeliste View Post
    Yes and no, we just can't actually discern properly.

    For example C'Thun. "Your heart will explode". Obviously back then you'd assume you as the player, but now you could look at it and go... Could Azeroth being something more than just a lump of rock applied then? After all Azeroth is a nascent Titan. She has a wound... the Wound could be on or near her heart that with enough could explode and kill her.
    Not exploded yet , but it's a crater and they have filled it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Evangeliste View Post
    Yogg'Saron also says mid-fight "Look at the true face of death". And in the puzzle-box "Even death may die". Well he was right on both, Yogg is the God of Death and the interesting thing is is the word "may". Not will. And during the Diamond King quest they can hear Yogg'Saron whispering in Ulduar...
    Even stupid little things like "There is a little lamb lost in dark woods..." could be referring to Tyr dying and living his hammer in Tirisfal. A lamb to them really considering what happened to Tyr and fighting a C'Thraxxi which also happens to be one right before Yogg'Saron.
    Death seems to be quite relevant for these powerfull creatures : even beyond death they way too powerful ... look at what y'zeraaz heart brought millenias later ... or even sp artifact . We fought old gods in a really weak state being imprisoned for millenias and i doubt we are done with them. and i am truly amazed at the opportunity of fighting a fully fledged old god that has vigilantly spread his influence and power on a planet . (and this would be my only desire for a future expansion happening on another planet or an alternative timeline w/e ).

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by Stroggylos View Post
    Not exploded yet , but it's a crater and they have filled it.
    Well yeah that's what I mean. Of course C'Thun is a very early example of Old Gods being just a gameplay mechanic moreso than a fully fledged figure in lore - or that's what we can perceive it as. We don't know how far they planned. Considering from the very beginning Bronze had a time travelling element and it only arrived on a larger scale a decade later... Who knows.
    As for the heart. How big is the bloody thing?! That visit to the chamber with Magni was really interesting, you heard a heart beat all the way through, mostly the loudest in the the last room and the kicker was, the floor lights lit up with the heart thud. Wonder how far it goes down and how it all connects with the sea, landmass and such. If it did explode... Would she simply die or would the planet go with it??

    Quote Originally Posted by Stroggylos
    Death seems to be quite relevant for these powerfull creatures : even beyond death they way too powerful ... look at what y'zeraaz heart brought millenias later ... or even sp artifact . We fought old gods in a really weak state being imprisoned for millenias and i doubt we are done with them. and i am truly amazed at the opportunity of fighting a fully fledged old god that has vigilantly spread his influence and power on a planet . (and this would be my only desire for a future expansion happening on another planet or an alternative timeline w/e ).
    Well Death in the game really feels like a new beginning but also an end. There's a fair few already who've had new beginnings from dying: The Forsaken, the Scourge/Ebon Blade, Sylvanas, probably more I can't think of. The only thing is, although I do like to enjoy what Xal'atath has to say... I take it with a pinch of salt considering the Blade is suggested an Old God. She's neither friend nor foe. It was clearly betrayed to become a Blade and it's ramblings, though not sure by who exactly but at least the Old God camp, and still finds the Titans and Elune revolting like they do. But to be an ally, that's fishy too, I would say the Blade has a mutual relationship going on there... And come the end of expansion, what will actually happen to the Blade since all artifacts go?

    I too believe our intervention to kill C'Thun and Yogg'Saron wasn't necessarily an all out kill either, considering it took a Titan to physically pull out and leave only a heart behind for Y'Sharrj, how do the PC compare to that? I guess ee are imbued with Spirit thanks to Azeroth but how far does that really go? It's been quite mixed where we've managed to kill individuals/bosses/evil lore characters with ease then on the other side, we have help with killing some individuals/bosses/evil lore characters, like Lich King and Tirion, Archimonde and wisps, Thrall and Dragonflight for Deathwing,technically the Titanic Keepers with Yogg'Saron I'd say not as much as we hope for. Even Illidan was just defeated - it still took Akama and Maiev to be there.

    I agree with you I'd love to be able to start seeing things like a completely corrupted World Soul by the Voids, or planets or something that connects to the outer space theme really.
    Last edited by Evangeliste; 2017-08-18 at 01:53 PM.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by Evangeliste View Post
    Yogg'Saron also says mid-fight "Look at the true face of death". And in the puzzle-box "Even death may die". Well he was right on both, Yogg is the God of Death and the interesting thing is is the word "may". Not will. And during the Diamond King quest they can hear Yogg'Saron whispering in Ulduar...
    Was just an echo like the faceless monsters you fight. Things that are powerful and dead can still in some ways communicate. Much like Skull of Gul'dan did to Illidan

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by Kallisto View Post
    Was just an echo like the faceless monsters you fight. Things that are powerful and dead can still in some ways communicate. Much like Skull of Gul'dan did to Illidan
    Yes I know that. Hence the enhancement on "may die" quote. Yogg said the true face of death during his fight, and even death may die is in his puzzle box. He also is heard back in Ulduar. Pretty evident also after Y'Sharrj being acknowledged as dead still caused a lot of crap MU and AU really.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by iFool View Post
    Fixed that for you, no need to thank me.
    I seriously laughed out loud at this one

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    Quote Originally Posted by Evangeliste View Post
    Yes I know that. Hence the enhancement on "may die" quote. Yogg said the true face of death during his fight, and even death may die is in his puzzle box. He also is heard back in Ulduar. Pretty evident also after Y'Sharrj being acknowledged as dead still caused a lot of crap MU and AU really.
    Ya know, I swear somewhere it states that the Old Gods are ginormous. Yaj, was so large that when it was pulled out of Azeroth it nearly killer her. So when people asked about Yogg, someone has stated that he is actually the entire size of northrend almost. If the twilight hammer has resurrected commanders of the old gods before, it stands to reason that the old gods could easily be resurrected if they manage to dig through a non-titan area and find a portion of their "corpse". Death could mean little to the old gods as long as they have followers.

  11. #31
    The Insane Aquamonkey's Avatar
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    "They do not die; they do not live. They are outside the cycle."
    "...I bear allegiance to powers untouched by time, unmoved by fate. No force on this world or beyond harbors the strength to bend our knee... not even the mighty Legion!"

  12. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by gioderpington View Post
    I seriously laughed out loud at this one

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    Ya know, I swear somewhere it states that the Old Gods are ginormous. Yaj, was so large that when it was pulled out of Azeroth it nearly killer her. So when people asked about Yogg, someone has stated that he is actually the entire size of northrend almost. If the twilight hammer has resurrected commanders of the old gods before, it stands to reason that the old gods could easily be resurrected if they manage to dig through a non-titan area and find a portion of their "corpse". Death could mean little to the old gods as long as they have followers.
    I have to say being the size of Northrend for Yogg'Saron makes sense. Considering Arthas was making his empire in Icecrown and had plenty of Saronite from the earth there, it would make sense. I'm not sure you're aware that Saronite is basically Yogg'Saron's poo that litters Northrend haha. Also with Yogg'Saron his head is in a pool of liquid Saronite... (makes me feel like he's basically swimming in a pool of diarrhoea... anyway!), that pool could go far down as well. Think C'Thun was the same too sitting in a bed of sand in his raid encounter actually.
    Considering Soggoth in Darkshore is quite large and from being unearthed only seems to have up to a perhaps torso, gosh knows how big they are. I still await a decent story behind that fellow really, unless I totally missed the memo on it.

  13. #33
    What if we had zero lights ending of Yogg saron and we have been pawns of him since?

  14. #34
    They are probably just telling their own point of view.

    And for creatures that don't truly die or age, their point of view can be really strange to mortals.

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