[TV/Books] Game of Thrones ***SPOILER Discussion***

[Grimbold21]

So they show her the wight. The mountain hacks it up, and it keeps coming. Jon bops it.

Cersei is genuinely scared, so they all agree to to fight the undead. Jon Dany and whoever else charges off north to get ready, Cersei has agreed to send troops but she delays them, planning to kill everyone after the dead have weakened them, and then kill the dead too. Jamie sees that the troops aren't going anywhere, and is like fuck this, and goes to fight with Jon Dany and the fun gang.

And those are the spoilers ive read. I think.

Big money went on Cersei being on the throne at the end of the series at the bookies.

Question is: What troops? What armies does Cersei would have to send North, if any? Im sure the show is gonna conjure up some magical Lannister army, just like it did after most of the red armies were slaughtered in the WoT5K

[Kathranis]

you talk about REALISM in a world with magic and dragons of a FANTASY show? if you want realism their is reality tv for you....

Game of Thrones is (or was) hard fantasy, not high fantasy. It was about treating magic with a sense of realism, in a world modeled after true medieval history. The realism, in contrast with traditional high fantasy like the works of Tolkien, is precisely why the novels were so widely praised.

There's also something called internal consistency. Even a show with magic and dragons is expectd to follow its own rules.

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I really miss characters like Margaery and those at the Wall, they were irrelevant in the bigger picture but they made the show feel alive and populated. Now it feels like you're either with Jon+Dany or Cersei. There aren't really any neutral people anymore.

This is, to an extent, one of the bigger issues I have with the last couple seasons. Only the A-List characters matter.

They kingdoms and great houses have been boiled down to just the heads of the families, and maybe a sibling or two. They act like Jaime and Cersei are in charge of everything at King's Landing, and like they're the last two Lannisters.

The books, even moreso than the earlier seasons of the show, always filled out the cast with numerous named characters with established personalities, traits, and roles. Each member of the Kingsguard, each member of the Night's Watch, so forth and so on. The closest the show had to that were the Northern Lords, and they all up and vanished (more or less) after Jon left for Dragonstone, leaving Winterfell to be almost exclusively about Sansa, Arya, and Littlefinger.

[TickTickTick]

Why would they even know the Mountain is still 'alive' ?

Anyway, coming to KL to show the proof is still dumb. Tyrion says he trusts Jaimie to hold the Lannister's army. But Cersei has her own, the Kingsguard. It still could end in unpleasant way. But I guess there is no other way if they want all the Westeros to unite against the whitewalkers...

One thing I havent see anyone discussing is the successor after Daenerys. Watching it the second time, I found it interesting that after her talk with Tyrion about the succession, she tells Jon she wont have any children. What if she plans for Jon to be her successor? Or what if she sees him as a better candidate for the throne than she is?
Her suddenly ending the interaction and leaving him to rest was a bit off too. I guess she just got too wet and had to run away or she would totally lose control. The way Kit played that, looked like everything is leading to sex, he was almost anticipating it, and she just cut it.

Anyone notice how Drogon's personality has changed since Danny (or perhaps, my Queen ) let him kill humans (and undead)? Like he fully understand what is his purpose and was getting annoyed by the fact Daenerys was holding him back. Now that he can finally kill, he is completely obiedent to her.
I also expect Jon to mount Rheagal soon, suit him, him being Rhaegar's son.

[Deleted]

Tbh outside of all the speedboating going on (which is understandable considering how many episodes we have left), I really love where the show is going.

The subtle nuances in every episode and the importance of the dialogue in every scene.

The scene with Gilly and Sam, and how Gilly tells the audience about Jon's claim to the throne.

The scene with Dany flying in after kill she deletes the Tarly's and Jon waiting on top of the cliff for me was one of the best scenes of the show. How the dragon recognizes Jon as a Targaryen and allows him to touch him. The CGI was amazing imo, gave the audience the impression of what it would be like to be standing infront of a dragon and how intelligent they really are. The dialogue between Dany and Jon after, and reaction from Dany when Jon refers to the Dragons as "beasts", I thought was amazing. Just shows how vulnerable she really is and she has a trigger.

Love the way Jon has grown and Dany keeps showing us how she is reaching the precipice, whether she will be Mad Queen.

Personally I think it will come down to Everybody except Cersei and Sansa and Tyrion worrying about the White walker threat while those 3 fight over the throne. Eventually imo when everybody learns of who Jon really is i can see Sansa trying to push him to be King for the good of the family, while dany will perhaps use the fact he's been ressed as a way to get the throne herself. Feel like either Jamie or Cersei will kill eachother. Probs Jamie will Cersei, Jamie has shown more and more vulnerability, but I just can't see him letting anyone else kill her off.

[Tommy T]

Dany finally coming to Westeros has done wonders for Emilia.
Her acting this season has been really good. A lot more emotion.

Bearing in mind, a lot of the actors and actresses in GoT are young, English, and just come out of drama school, it kind of makes me happy that so many of our own have developed in to what they have become.

[TickTickTick]

There is a great analysis of Daenerys and Jon interactions in this season: https://www.reddit.com/r/freefolk/co...ally_cant_get/

While a bit of fanfic, it is still great and maybe will be able to change the mind of some who say its forced.
While this is fiction, I still feel very attached to their relationship. For me, this episode (leaked one) was especially powerful when it comes to that. Daenerys rushing for help, saving them and the first thing she does is trying to help HIM climb. The way she is while in Eastwatch, realizing she lost not only one of her children,, but also him (after seeing for herself he spoke 100% truth), then seeing he is still alive... And the last scene. They are so close to each other now. Just makes my heart a bit warmer watching them this season.

[Vestig3]

This is how i feel now everyday.

http://imgur.com/a/mcb3P

[Independent voter]

It would be neat if this guy was in communication with the Night King.

[Vestig3]

I read those "so called" season 8 script leaks, and i must conclude that someone put a lot of effort and time into making his or their own fantasy to be in the show lol reading it was like i was reading a few different movies coz it has everything and anything that you have seen before somewhere else lol.

[Azrile]

Is anyone kind of disappointed in where the show is going? I still love it but I personally liked when it was all about politics and scheming, when we'd have brilliant characters around. Aswell as the acting, now it seems very flat and characters lack soul..
(

I was going to say something similar about the fights. It takes away any sense of proportion when you start having huge dragons an undead guy that can throw a javilin a mile, and this huge armada of ships that can insta-kill anything. The humans barely matter.

[Elim Garak]

I was going to say something similar about the fights. It takes away any sense of proportion when you start having huge dragons an undead guy that can throw a javilin a mile, and this huge armada of ships that can insta-kill anything. The humans barely matter.

I though it was obvious from all the killings that humans don't matter...

[Deleted]

Why didn't Danny fry the night king?
How does the dragon know he had to fly away? Somehow she banks and commands the thing without doing anything. But when the fire-breathing starts she always has to say dracaris. Fucking dumb.

[TickTickTick]

Before you again start flaming the current show and D&D, just remember that when they first decided to make a show out of the books, more books were in the making. Who would have known it would take GRRM 6-7 years to still not finish one? As long as there was a source material they adapted the books and all was well. Now? They are no writers, not on the level of GRRM at least, or they would be producing books, not shows.

If anyone is to blame, its GRRM for taking so much time to finish the books. You cant really expect them to develop the story on their own and expect it to be as good as the books, you just cant.

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Why didn't Danny fry the night king?
How does the dragon know he had to fly away? Somehow she banks and commands the thing without doing anything. But when the fire-breathing starts she always has to say dracaris. Fucking dumb.

How could she know which one of them is NK? Or that he is even there? She saw the undead for the first time, she was probably shocked and overwhelmed by the sheer ammount of them. She came for the rescue. When the NK revealed himself by throwing the javelin, there was no time to attempt the attack because of a threat of more dragons being turned.
Its not coincidence that only Targaryens can controll dragons. I suppose there is something in their blood (that why they wanted to keep the bloodline pure) that causes them to communicate with dragons. You know, magic. The dracarys tho? Just for show maybe? Sweet blonde beauty mounts a dragon, says dracarys in badass tone and the dragon breathes fire.

[Swiftshadow]

That was my one complaint with an otherwise enjoyable episode. I particularly like the part where she tells Sansa "Nah, Jon would do that, not me". For Pete's sake, you're able to place yourself in Jon's shoes and acknowledge that he'd understand Sansa was forced to do it. Yet somehow this bitchy sibling rivalry is clouding her judgement........why?

you have to understand, although that scene seemed like the same childish sibling rivalry they had before all they tragedies, Arya is naturally suspicious of everyone. Much less someone who she always had conflicts with even before all the bad happened.

Take into consideration the following :

Arya
1 - Her "dancing" master probably died defending her
2 - Watched her father's beheading
3 - Her closest friend Gendry taken away from her by the Brotherhood without Banners
4 - Kidnapped by the Hound
5 - scavenging like a beggar in the alleys of Bravos
6 - Went blind either as punishment for killing Meryn Trant or part of Faceless Men training
7 - Bullied by the Waif
8 - Saw the play actress who saved her killed by the Waif

Going through all that, its understandable that Arya is overly paranoid and psychotic. At least, now she can defend herself and assassinate her enemies.

Sansa
1 - Despite being the older sister, she failed to recognize the Lannisters as dangerous in the beginning
2 - Got her own dire wolf killed, by foolishly siding with a cruel Lannister boy than with her own sister, and a harmless Stark servant boy
3 - Even after bad things started to snowball towards the Starks, she still naively thought Joffrey would pardon her father, and wrote a letter to Robb that ultimately achieved nothing to help her family
4 - Probably got repeatedly raped by Ramsey Bolton. Imo this is perhaps the only suffering Sansa went through that is not entirely her own fault

To me, Sansa's only saving grace is that she rallied the Eyrie forces and helped Jon win the Battle of the Bastards. Although if she had done that earlier, Ramsey would see the total army of Jon and not be over-confident; hence Rickon might still be kept alive as a hostage to save his own skin. Instead, Ramsey used Rickon as a taunt and nothing more.

Sansa's is only useful now as a Stark lady to keep the north loyal to the Starks. Which is perhaps not really necessary because the North now follows Jon because they understand he is a strong and good leader. Also, Arya is technically a Stark "lady" too. Perhaps Sansa can also be valuable by marrying someone powerful, or in other words, spreading her legs for the right man.

So yeah, imo Arya > Sansa a thousand times over.

[Deleted]

Before you again start flaming the current show and D&D, just remember that when they first decided to make a show out of the books, more books were in the making. Who would have known it would take GRRM 6-7 years to still not finish one? As long as there was a source material they adapted the books and all was well. Now? They are no writers, not on the level of GRRM at least, or they would be producing books, not shows.

If anyone is to blame, its GRRM for taking so much time to finish the books. You cant really expect them to develop the story on their own and expect it to be as good as the books, you just can't.

Actually both of them are writers, at least they have writing credits for a number of other tv shows and films.

I don't think anyone was expecting them to flawlessly replicate the style of GRRM, not at least because that's now how adapting books for tv works, but having worked on this show with GERM for so long, for all the conversations they apparently have with him about the plot the latest season, to me anyway, doesn't feel like Game of Thrones and in many places is just badly written and directed regardless of that.

It's not just that this season has had serious trouble with it's geography, it's time frames, its bizarre narrative decisions that don't seem to fit with characters as well as a number of characters who have seemingly been totally forgotten about or left to rot in the middle distance, it's actually just bad, not as a GoT adaption, just bad.

[Gallahadd]

Why didn't Danny fry the night king?
How does the dragon know he had to fly away? Somehow she banks and commands the thing without doing anything. But when the fire-breathing starts she always has to say dracaris. Fucking dumb.

1: Because... Plot.
2: The dragon knew it had to fly away, because it's an intelligent creature with the basics of survival instinct?
3: the Dracarys thing is because she's trained the dragons to only attack when she commands. Also, it's of her "Catchphrases" like Blathering on about the Wheel, or shouting "FIRE AND BLOOD" at people (which she thankfully hasn't done in a while)

Before you again start flaming the current show and D&D, just remember that when they first decided to make a show out of the books, more books were in the making. Who would have known it would take GRRM 6-7 years to still not finish one?

Anyone who had looked into GRRM . The first three books came out a couple of years apart, fairly solid... But then the third took five years and the forth took six, and came out at the same time as the first season...

so after 3/4 season, when the next book showed no signs of coming any time soon, I'm sure they realised the mistake XD

[TickTickTick]

Anyone who had looked into GRRM . The first three books came out a couple of years apart, fairly solid... But then the third took five years and the forth took six, and came out at the same time as the first season...

so after 3/4 season, when the next book showed no signs of coming any time soon, I'm sure they realised the mistake XD

Yeah you'd think the fact that there is a show based on your books would pressure Martin to do it faster. Anyway, D&D are nowhere near the level of GRRM, so noone should expect the show to remain the same after the source material has been drained. Ofc, there were many cut plotlines and obviously it was mistake, but whats done is done. I still appreciate the show for what it is.

[Deleted]

Yeah you'd think the fact that there is a show based on your books would pressure Martin to do it faster. Anyway, D&D are nowhere near the level of GRRM, so noone should expect the show to remain the same after the source material has been drained. Ofc, there were many cut plotlines and obviously it was mistake, but whats done is done. I still appreciate the show for what it is.

If you're only good at translating material to screen instead of writing material yourself, you might as well not work for television.

Simply because GRRM takes long to publish material doesn't mean it's okay for the showrunners to run around like headless chickens and get away with this laughable attempt at doing the source material justice.

[TickTickTick]

If you're only good at translating material to screen instead of writing material yourself, you might as well not work for television.

Simply because GRRM takes long to publish material doesn't mean it's okay for the showrunners to run around like headless chickens and get away with this laughable attempt at doing the source material justice.

Its your personal (and biased) opinion. Milions of people (with each season getting more and more viewers) think otherwise, else they wouldnt watch it, right? What sane person would watch a show they dont enjoy?

[Jastall]

I'm mostly watching to see an end to this story. Since it seems quite evident to me that Martin has simply lost interest in writing the last two books, so the show is probably the only end we're ever going to get got A Song of Ice and Fire. Which is really a shame, it is how it is.