[7.0 Retribution Paladin] Guide and Discussion

[Deleted]

I think the nerf to Crusade's duration is because with Netherlight Crucible we are going to take WotA traits so globally the duration will be the same as on Live now. Without the nerf and the Netherlight Crucible our Crusade will remain like 40 seconds xD

No. Your crusade will be 34 seconds tops now.

Every rank lost 0.5 seconds = 2.5 seconds with 7 ranks.

The crucible does not allow you to have 2 of the same traits on the same relic. It simply makes it easier for you to have a specific one in every one of your 3 relics.
So, crusade will still be 34 seconds, but you will get some extra relic traits like BoJ/DH damage increase traits or DS/TV damage increase traits (or the CS crit i guess).


I am waiting for the theorycrafters to say something, but i would'nt be surprised if cloak and highlord become the best legendaries. Chain got nerfed. The damage increase is now additive instead of multiplicative.

[Reith]

No. Your crusade will be 34 seconds tops now.

Every rank lost 0.5 seconds = 2.5 seconds with 7 ranks.

The crucible does not allow you to have 2 of the same traits on the same relic. It simply makes it easier for you to have a specific one in every one of your 3 relics.
So, crusade will still be 34 seconds, but you will get some extra relic traits like BoJ/DH damage increase traits or DS/TV damage increase traits (or the CS crit i guess).


I am waiting for the theorycrafters to say something, but i would be surprised if cloak and highlord become the best legendaries. Chain got nerfed. The damage increase is now additive instead of multiplicative.

That's so dumb. Obviously they did it because "too many people are using Chain," but they forego the reason. The reason being that T20+T19 is too good not to use Chain. If I get Highlord and a decent tier 20 chest, I'll probably end up using Cloak+Highlord in 7.3. My off-piece shoulders would be better then as well.

[Morally Grey Storm]

They nerfed Chain?..
What in the feth?

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Well, atleast it can't be as severe as storm eye helm and ayala nerfs for warriors.
I hope.

[Deleted]

They nerfed Chain?..
What in the feth?

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Well, atleast it can't be as severe as storm eye helm and ayala nerfs for warriors.
I hope.

Chain will still be a decent legendary, i think. With that said, this is just based on what i heard and saw and no one has posted any hard sims about all this. I dunno... maybe Solsacra is on vacation. :P

[Morally Grey Storm]

"too many people are using" is next to the most dumbest reason to nerf.
When people are using something, one should look for the reason why.
It might well be because other options are shite.
Reminds of crusade nerf.
Huh.

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Take a look at tier 15. Everyone uses Final Verdict. Yet they aren't nerfing it, they are buffing, admittedly pathetically, two other choices.
There seems to be some inconsistentsy with their approach to balancing stuff.
No, ofcourse they are not incompetent. There must be a reason.

[Anardel]

The Crucible does not work that way...

If you have a WoTA trait on a Relic, it will not give you WoTA again in the Crucible...

Oh sorry, I got confused then ^^u

Thanks for clarification.

[Reith]

Take a look at tier 15. Everyone uses Final Verdict. Yet they aren't nerfing it, they are buffing, admittedly pathetically, two other choices.
There seems to be some inconsistentsy with their approach to balancing stuff.
No, ofcourse they are not incompetent. There must be a reason.

Consecration has gotten no buff so far, only Execution Sentence, which is an OK increase. We'll have to see how that one actually plays out, whether it's worth the extra effort to use or not on pure single target fights.

[Ryuji]

Consecration has gotten no buff so far, only Execution Sentence, which is an OK increase. We'll have to see how that one actually plays out, whether it's worth the extra effort to use or not on pure single target fights.

I'm probably still not going to use it. Even if it does more damage, it's too clunky to work. Same with Consecration, though it's even worse since it doesn't interact with HP at all and is an extra button on top of everything else we cast.

[Lumineus]

They nerfed Chain?..
What in the feth?

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Well, atleast it can't be as severe as storm eye helm and ayala nerfs for warriors.
I hope.

Well it's from a 15% buff down to 10, so... not quite as bad as the helmet nerf but pretty close.

[Sigxy]

They nerfed Chain?..
What in the feth?

What...

Why? I can understand they nerf Crusade in hopeful exchange they buff all other stuff, but this thing too? Isn't our dps going to be EVEN LOWER?

Is this a good time for me to skip out on getting that belt and just keep my legendary cloak? I mean I love the 2-set bonus for tier 20 but from what we saw with the tier 19 nerf on the 2-set bonus, I'm expecting that thing to be nerfed too so there's not much of a point to have 4-piece tier 21 and 2-piece tier 20. ;_:

[Deleted]

What...

Why? I can understand they nerf Crusade in hopeful exchange they buff all other stuff, but this thing too? Isn't our dps going to be EVEN LOWER?

Is this a good time for me to skip out on getting that belt and just keep my legendary cloak? I mean I love the 2-set bonus for tier 20 but from what we saw with the tier 19 nerf on the 2-set bonus, I'm expecting that thing to be nerfed too so there's not much of a point to have 4-piece tier 21 and 2-piece tier 20. ;_:

Theres no definitive answers for that yet.

The belt will still be good. Just wether it will still be BiS is in question. The changes in the PTR give TV a damage boost outside crusade (and nerf on crusade duration) and the mastery change benefits it aswell. That is why i think the highlord+cape have a good chance of beeing better as they benefit the most from the changes. But theres the set bonus to consider aswell (20% damage increase on BoJ).

[Reith]

What...

Why? I can understand they nerf Crusade in hopeful exchange they buff all other stuff, but this thing too? Isn't our dps going to be EVEN LOWER?

Is this a good time for me to skip out on getting that belt and just keep my legendary cloak? I mean I love the 2-set bonus for tier 20 but from what we saw with the tier 19 nerf on the 2-set bonus, I'm expecting that thing to be nerfed too so there's not much of a point to have 4-piece tier 21 and 2-piece tier 20. ;_:

As it is, I'm probably going to be using T20 4P for a long while, that's how underwhelming T21 4P is atm.

[Sigxy]

As it is, I'm probably going to be using T20 4P for a long while, that's how underwhelming T21 4P is atm.

I'm seriously considering the same. Having enough haste and get 3 Holy Power from BoJ just made the spec sooooo much smoother. It's too bad it's hard to get into heroic groups via PuGs.. ;_:

[killwithpwr]

Im all for a set slot being a BiS Lego, it will make me less worried that i dont grind previous tier for the 2 set bonus...

[ThePants999]

Source on Chain nerf? I've seen nothing, and it's been (a) additive and (b) 10% for a long time, so nobody's making any sense in here.

[Deleted]

Source on Chain nerf? I've seen nothing, and it's been (a) additive and (b) 10% for a long time, so nobody's making any sense in here.

numbers are BS. But the fact that there will be a nerf remains true. Not a direct one but the nerf to the Wrath of the ashbringer trait will hit it and curtail is potential.

[Deleted]

As it is, I'm probably going to be using T20 4P for a long while, that's how underwhelming T21 4P is atm.

On that note... the 4x t20 makes the spec alot smoother to play aswell.

I won't be happy to be leaving it behind. BoJ should generate 3HP baseline.

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Source on Chain nerf? I've seen nothing, and it's been (a) additive and (b) 10% for a long time, so nobody's making any sense in here.

I might have remembered it wrong. Think i read about it on discord, but it can be just the crusade duration nerf that reduces the contribution. Apologies for the confusion. Things on discord move fast so it is possible that it still happened but i am not 100% sure. What i'm sure of is that it is worse with the patch, as you can see:

[ThePants999]

Hmmm. That maths is saying that Chain was multiplicative, and it's becoming additive. I could have sworn that it was already additive though.

[PointerToAddress]

You can see it now on live that the buff goe s to 59.5%, that means it's multiplicative. On PTR they removed the buff aura and made the spell, and tooltip, changes on the spell itself reaching up to 55%, making it additive. That plus the nerf to WotA traits means less uptime on Chain buff and on Liadrin. It may very well be that Whispers is BiS or tied with Chain for BiS but it will make Highlord higher up and could surpass Liadrin more consistently. All of that could go out of the window if ES becomes so much better on ST compared to FV, making Chain be BiS. There is also the situation of having T19 2pc on ToS, or T20 2pc in Antorus, making Whispers a no-go.

[killwithpwr]

You can see it now on live that the buff goe s to 59.5%, that means it's multiplicative. On PTR they removed the buff aura and made the spell, and tooltip, changes on the spell itself reaching up to 55%, making it additive. That plus the nerf to WotA traits means less uptime on Chain buff and on Liadrin. It may very well be that Whispers is BiS or tied with Chain for BiS but it will make Highlord higher up and could surpass Liadrin more consistently. All of that could go out of the window if ES becomes so much better on ST compared to FV, making Chain be BiS. There is also the situation of having T19 2pc on ToS, or T20 2pc in Antorus, making Whispers a no-go.

If es becomes way better than FV in its current style, im gonna be very sad.

I dont like what they have done with the spell, its very annoying to manage.
I tried using it just for the sake of it, and i cant help but miss WoDs itteration of it.