KJ Heroic and Armageddon

[Sonnillon]

I haven't found (or maybe I am dumb and blind), any place the info how many armageddon small swirlies per number of people are there? Are there any specific "break points" for group sizes? Specially for larger groups of 20/25+?

And I still assume that 1 armageddon in phase 1 shows that there is enough DPS to kill the boss or are there any other specific metrics to look at? Beside the 800k+ minimum what has been tossed out with DPSers not lower the 125% of highest tank DPS.

[Kochanski]

There is a extra small pool when you go from 14 (2/3/9 setup) to 15, and also going from 19>20 seems to give another.

Generally if you can get him to first transmission (within afew %) by time first singularity comes then dps is fine.

[Sonnillon]

Someone noted some place that this is how armageddon spawn based on number and anything between 5 increase has a chance to get an extra or not (those afaik incl the big one).
30: 8
25: 7
20: 6
15: 5
10: 4

Are the numbers correct?

[Deleted]

In my experience it is similar to the number of loot pieces you get with master loot. So each player adds 20% chance to get another swirly. I dont know the numbers you get a guaranteed third though.

[Deleted]

Just check wclogs for that kind of info

[Saverem]

Someone noted some place that this is how armageddon spawn based on number and anything between 5 increase has a chance to get an extra or not (those afaik incl the big one).
30: 8
25: 7
20: 6
15: 5
10: 4

Are the numbers correct?

So I'm guessing the sweet spots would be 14, 19, 24, or 29 players.

[xcess]

Also you want to try and not get 2nd tank add and skip that bad bit. Also want a clean transition to the dark phase.

[Vaerys]

So I'm guessing the sweet spots would be 14, 19, 24, or 29 players.

Depends on whether you prefer an 80% chance of an armageddon with 1 less person, or 100% chance with 1 more person.
RNG can screw you with 14,19,24,29, but will be consistent with multiples of 5.

[Sonnillon]

Also you want to try and not get 2nd tank add and skip that bad bit. Also want a clean transition to the dark phase.

That is also a good point, to get just one tanking add in phase 2, having 2 benchmarks is good, thank you.

Clean transition most probably to the dark phase means that people have lost their debuff from soaking as well as anything extra killed, which could mean in holding off on the DPS if all else has lined up properly as well?

As for the number of Armageddons is some what known now, we can experiment with assigning certain amount of people to rotate small one soaking as well as to try out other ways in handling it.

[Soluna]

There is another dps check later down the fight. From what I've seen, groups that lack a bit of dps usually have 2nd tank soul add spawn right as deceiver's veil is about to be cast, screwing up the whole 2nd intermission a lot. If you can get him to cast deceiver's veil before 2nd tank add then your dps is definitely fine. I've seen a pug who also stopped dpsing at like 44% or something, and waited for add, killed it and then got the kill, so there is that. More dps just makes it so much easier at that point in order to avoid the most shitty arma/singularity combos.

[Vagabond]

I haven't found (or maybe I am dumb and blind), any place the info how many armageddon small swirlies per number of people are there? Are there any specific "break points" for group sizes? Specially for larger groups of 20/25+?

And I still assume that 1 armageddon in phase 1 shows that there is enough DPS to kill the boss or are there any other specific metrics to look at? Beside the 800k+ minimum what has been tossed out with DPSers not lower the 125% of highest tank DPS.

You can load a KJ Heroic fight into wipefest.net to check how many got armageddon debuff

[Noodleface]

The best way we've been able to gauge DPS is by the transition into the first intermission. If you only get 1 Armageddon before the transition you're doing fine. If you get 2 it's still salvageable but it could get tight before the dark phase.