Now it's Bernie Sander's fault that Hillary lost the election.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Cenk with the truth about this whole thing:

Yeah Cenk a Republican who plays Liberal on the side while lining his pockets with Alt-Right money while condemning Clinton for sucking at the teet of corporate America.

This fucking dipshit is basically the left version of Breitbart, with a little bit of Alex Jones sprinkled on top but not enough to lose obvious credibility. Yes he found out the secret formula that if you pump people's heads full of bullshit, they'll empty their wallets. The Young Turks the last name in integrity.

Fine examples of it's nice to say things when you don't have to be responsible or accountable.

[JohnBrown1917]

Well...he was the more likely candidate to beat Trump. That's just undeniable. But I mean, I guess people hate Sanders so much they're happier now that Trump is in power. Go figure.

Liberals like to blame anybody but themselves for not appealing to the left wing groups.

[Low Hanging Fruit]

It is in the past. It isn't changing. If you didn't vote and are unhappy you are part of the problem. If you voted for Donald and don't regret it than good for you. If you voted for Hilary and are acting like a bitch deal with it. If you voted for Donald are are realizing political folks say just about anything to get your vote and don't deliver than what did you think was going to be the case? If you voted for Donald because you mad that Bernie wasn't the democratic candidate than you are dumb as fuck. If you voted for Hilary just because and only because she has a vag than you are dumb as fuck.

Just get over it. No one cares besides people that are living in a past you aren't going to change. Suck up your gut and in 2018 let them know what you think with a vote. Although I get the feeling most people complaining either live in another nation thus cannot or will be to busy posting here to do so. Which again.. is the problem.

[Deleted]

Yeah

So what you're saying is that you can't attack his message because he's 100% right, so you'll attack him instead? Gotcha.

It is in the past.

Just get over it.

Tell that to Hillary. She's the one with the book coming out blaming Sanders again. She's the one not being able to get over it. She's the one refusing to just shut up and fade away quietly and admit she'll never be president, ever.

[Enthusiastic Steward]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Democr...ton_supporters
...25% of her base voted for the Republican in 08.

A better stat though would be a further breakdown of this. What % of this number voted for Clinton because they supported her, and what % were traditional establishment Republicans who simply didn't want Trump? A lot of prominent Republicans didn't vote for their own ticket on this one.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Well...he was the more likely candidate to beat Trump. That's just undeniable. But I mean, I guess people hate Sanders so much they're happier now that Trump is in power. Go figure.

No he wasn't at all, the fact you still think Hillary won, because of some underhanded conspiracy is a fucking laugh. I talked to people that voted Hillary in the Primaries, I talked some of them into voting for Bernie because I believed in him.

The Problem was he had my duped too. I actually thought he cared about the shit he said, I felt pretty impressed by the fact he never ran from an argument or socially uncomfortable situation because he cared how it looked, that was my problem with Hillary.

I legitimate concern not some made up bullshit about E-Mail investigations, Murdered Former Lawyers, or Bill Clinton's perverted bullshit.

But of those I got to go for Bernie out of like 20, I got 6, that's right fucking 6!

These are people who canvassed, donated money, and have been life long Democrats, and it wasn't because they didn't love Bernie, it was because Trump was already gaining traction in part because of a lot of fears by those on the right, who felt that Bernie was a possible contender for the White House.

That is what was behind the GOP coming together the way they eventually did, it was the same as when the Affordable Care Act was passed.


Blue Dogs weren't fucking ever going to go for a god damn Socialist in their eyes period. His only saving grace was his stance on Gun Ownership which is what got him a lot of the vote on the left from gun owners like myself.

But it wouldn't have been enough.

Hillary had to appeal to centrist, which is what Obama did, and put her more to the right than Bernie, but yes SHE FAILED too, because in the end some of those good old boys weren't ever going to vote for a woman, and sure as shit they wouldn't have voted for Hillary.

So the question was whether you like identity Politics or Not, or you believe Socialism isn't evil. They played a factor. People weren't going to fucking vote for Bernie for the nomination, how the hell do you think he would have stacked up against, people on the right who truly were concerned about his rhetoric.

[Mormolyce]

I ascribe it a more insidious purpose. At the end of the day the Neo-Conservative and Neo-Liberal are one contiguous ideological vision, one which IMHO Hillary shared, so too did Obama and Bush. Now we have a President outside of that ideological consensus and thus there is a desire to have that ideological consensus buttressed and defended, so Bush gets a revival.

Not even remotely.

They are only united in their distaste for white nationalism. Though the former was quite happy to benefit from that when it suited them...

[Deleted]

Isn't Hillary running out of people/things to blame for her election loss?
here is a picture

Yeah. At the end of day, the only one actually responsible for Hillary losing was, well, Hillary - as much as she tries to blame other candidates, sexism or whatever for it. She was an awful candidate and realistically probably one of the only ones who could have managed to throw away this election.

The best thing she could do for her party and their voters/supporters is to leave and not lose another one for them.

[Deleted]

the fact you still think Hillary won, because of some underhanded conspiracy

Where exactly did I say that? Please, quote me. All I'm saying is that Sanders would have beaten Trump. Hillary would never have, and didn't. No point in repeating it a third time.

[Doctor Amadeus]

So what you're saying is that you can't attack his message because he's 100% right, so you'll attack him instead? Gotcha.

He isn't right and where the message comes from is very much important it's a big reason why people believed a lot of horseshit, and it was everywhere. Spending every five fucking minutes to reassure and hold the fucking hands of people smart enough to figure it out, but didn't want to, that isn't something Hillary or the DNC can fix.

Tell that to Hillary. She's the one with the book coming out blaming Sanders again. She's the one not being able to get over it. She's the one refusing to just shut up and fade away quietly and admit she'll never be president, ever.

She doesn't need to fade away, she kicked ass, all the while half dead according to some of these idiots attacking her. She isn't running the country at least her books aren't costing anything other than for those who buy her book.

While Trumps win well that cost a fuck of a lot more than that. But some of us have money for the bill, until we take our time however long it takes to fix the DNC, however those that can't well, I suppose "I didn't like the bitch" will be of great comfort to the people who will die without health insurance, or an overturn of measures to provide access to contraception.

Or a supreme court nominee willing to overturn right to choose, or the DACA kids that are going to be thrown out of this country, because a few people decided to be sold on a lot of bullshit of "Well I heard things" or "Her E-Mails".

There isn't anything else I can see to lose the Senate and Congress would be nice to get, but it's already too late for some of the worst yet to come. SO I say support those that showed up, reorganize the DNC, tell the fucking idiots that didn't do shit to help in the General Election to take a fucking hike.

And actually make some efforts to not ever commit resources to people too fucking critically stupid they would lap up the same shit Trumpsters did, while pointing their fingers and laughing at Trumpsters who are feeling really stupid about voting for a Reality Game Show host.

- - - Updated - - -

Where exactly did I say that? Please, quote me. All I'm saying is that Sanders would have beaten Trump. Hillary would never have, and didn't. No point in repeating it a third time.

Not attributing that to you, because that seems to be the common theme among those who think Bernie could have won even though he clearly couldn't and I actually donated time and money, and mind to try to convince people to take a chance on him.

But I will be honest some Bernie supporters didn't make that easy.

- - - Updated - - -

Yeah. At the end of day, the only one actually responsible for Hillary losing was, well, Hillary - as much as she tries to blame other candidates, sexism or whatever for it. She was an awful candidate and realistically probably one of the only ones who could have managed to throw away this election.

The best thing she could do for her party and their voters/supporters is to leave and not lose another one for them.

No actually the best thing she could do for the Party's lead, along with those she helped bring together with her message, and help organize the DNC, not just for coming elections but to bring stability and foundation back to the Party.

Because the only other thing I can say was to blame was the lack of clear message other than we weren't Trump which honestly any sane person that would be enough, because the truth is as I said I would have Backed Ted fucking Cruz to prevent this moron from getting in the WH.

I do like the idea of what might be happening in Ohio a lot running a Republican and a Democrat against Trump, and regardless to what happens, that is about the only real concern I would have is supporting those Republicans that came over, or find out what it would take to stay.

Not that the DNC needs to change for whatever that is, but Republican or Democrat as long as they are just outraged by the Orange Nazi in the WH, I think that could be a starting point.

[Enthusiastic Steward]

Hillary would never have, and didn't.

If we really want an honest assessment of the 2016 election we also need to stop with the 'Hillary never could have won'. She very much could have. Trump won three states by less than 1%, and all-important Florida by less than 2%. Had any three of those four gone the other way Clinton would be in the White House. Trump's electoral victory is one of the lowest (bottom 20%). In terms of a US presidential election, Trump's victory was a very narrow one, and it is entirely within the realm of possibility that Clinton could have squeezed this one out.

Note here I'm not making the argument that she was a good candidate, she wasn't, not by a long shot, but I do think we need to move away from the hyperbole that still surrounds how the election actually broke down.

[Doctor Amadeus]

It is in the past. It isn't changing. If you didn't vote and are unhappy you are part of the problem. If you voted for Donald and don't regret it than good for you. If you voted for Hilary and are acting like a bitch deal with it. If you voted for Donald are are realizing political folks say just about anything to get your vote and don't deliver than what did you think was going to be the case? If you voted for Donald because you mad that Bernie wasn't the democratic candidate than you are dumb as fuck. If you voted for Hilary just because and only because she has a vag than you are dumb as fuck.

Just get over it. No one cares besides people that are living in a past you aren't going to change. Suck up your gut and in 2018 let them know what you think with a vote. Although I get the feeling most people complaining either live in another nation thus cannot or will be to busy posting here to do so. Which again.. is the problem.

Dude Nobody voted for fucking Hillary because she had a fucking Vagina!

At least no more than voted for Trump because he had a Penis or her was white, which is Ironic coming from people who bitched so much about Identity politics, to try to undermine Hillary voters as voting for her vagina.

As to the past, people who care about the future care about learning from the past, and the lesson here is stop wasting resources on people whose intelligence is too low to more than one idea at a time without being confused about.

"Is Hillary really a Lizard man who eats Children" No not as a joke or an insult, no there are people that really believe this shit! And there are really a few intelligent people who believed them.

- - - Updated - - -

Not even remotely.

They are only united in their distaste for white nationalism. Though the former was quite happy to benefit from that when it suited them...

Pretty much hit the nail on the head. Unless we have another purity test to be a liberal, or a democrat we are going to have to contend dealing with the cards we have to win.

You need money to fund a campaign, you need Corporations willing and banks that are willing to be fair, but we also have to understand it isn't an all or nothing deal, if business and banks back Trump, then that works against moving forward.

The only silver lining is Republicans or Democrats in business or banks see Trump for the complete and utter fucking idiot he is. And when Trumps stupid shit finally catches up to all Promises he never intended to keep he's fucked.

There is a reason he is making drastic changes now.

Guess what Trumps true believers aren't going to like what is to come.


Trump has no idea what the fuck he is doing, and he has never been a 1/10th of the shit he sold everybody he was.

Boys and Girls this is what happens when you buy your way in and out of situations, and you don't actually know the answers.

[Deleted]

If we really want an honest assessment of the 2016 election we also need to stop with the 'Hillary never could have won'. She very much could have.

Well yeah, you're right. She could've won if she wasn't who she was, and instead was a better human being and a better politician, and a better candidate for president. But I mean, I was just assuming that could never have happened.

[Rennadrel]

More like it's Hillary's fault she lost the election.

[Fugus]

@Mall Security

My god you sniveling entitled child. You keep crying and complaining that I didn't vote for Clinton yet you refuse to actually cast the blame where it belong.

I showed up, I voted, just because I refused to vote for whom you wanted doesn't mean I stayed home. Maybe she should have been a candidate worth voting for instead of running the voters off.

Everything you keep saying is to place blame at the voters she ran off instead of her for running them off. Whatever man, lie to yourself, cry to yourself, blame everyone else but those responsible. That is all you are doing and that won't accomplish anything because you aren't blaming those responsible nor are you holding the responsible party to task for their actions.

Hopefully the next time the DNC actually puts up an adult next time rather than an entitled child themselves who think they are entitled to the presidency and they don't have to try and that the voters will just fall in line because the guy on the other side.

The politician needs to give people a reason to come out and vote for them, just giving them a bigger bad on the other side to vote against isn't enough.

Potential infraction coming for this post, but worth it for the crap you are spewing.

- - - Updated - - -

Hillary had to appeal to centrist, which is what Obama did, and put her more to the right than Bernie, but yes SHE FAILED too, because in the end some of those good old boys weren't ever going to vote for a woman, and sure as shit they wouldn't have voted for Hillary.

Please, if it had Elizabeth Warren, those "sexist" Bernie voters would have been falling over themselves to cast that ballot.

[Enthusiastic Steward]

Well yeah, you're right. She could've won if she wasn't who she was, and instead was a better human being and a better politician, and a better candidate for president. But I mean, I was just assuming that could never have happened.

But even basically being the worst candidate the Democrats could dredge up she did almost win, so she wouldn't even really have had to have been that different or changed in any meaningful way.

This is in a way my biggest concern for the 2020 election. As Trump's support continues to erode the Democrats could very well do nothing and bumble their way into a victory without making any effective changes or learning a single damn lesson.

[Fugus]

But even basically being the worst candidate the Democrats could dredge up she did almost win, so she wouldn't even really have had to have been that different or changed in any meaningful way.

This is in a way my biggest concern for the 2020 election. As Trump's support continues to erode the Democrats could very well do nothing and bumble their way into a victory without making any effective changes or learning a single damn lesson.

That seems to be their plan so far, they refuse to accept any responsibility or make any changes. They seem to be just trying to ride in on the "We're not Trump" wave like they did in the election. Might work this time but honestly that will still only work for so long.

[Travis B]

That seems to be their plan so far, they refuse to accept any responsibility or make any changes.

Yup, when you consider the fact that Debbie Wasserman Schultz is still welcomed with open arms by the Democratic Party, it's obvious they haven't learned a single fucking thing.

[Mormolyce]

More like it's Hillary's fault she lost the election.

If only she'd gotten more votes than Trump!

[Deleted]

Here's some more Cenk truth about this whole thing:



You can't claim to live in a democracy and in the same breath tell people that they shouldn't vote for candidate X because of whatever reasons they come up with. If you have a true democracy, then everyone is free to vote whomever the fuck they goddamn want to, regardless of the consequences, because that is the only true democracy that exists. Any other version of it is corrupt to the core.

If only she'd gotten more electoral votes than Trump!

I fixed that for you, because unfortunately only electoral votes matter. Time to fix the system?