Could Bolvar's Scourge defeat the Legion on their own?

[Razion]

lol that puny lich and arthas where doomed when dealing with the old kirin tor if not the showing of Archimonde

Well, Death Knight Arthas and Kel'Thuzad were scared of Kil'jaeden early on in their campaign and felt compelled to serve him, but only at the behest of the Lich King. At this point, Kel'Thuzad was acting on his own, and schemed heavily to navigate between the Legion and dupe them while still fully serving the Lich King. Eventually they both double-cross the Legion in full by shattering the Legion's prison over the Lich King. Once Arthas and the Lich King are united, it's heavily implied that they are free of and are no longer controlled by the Legion, and that their combined power now eclipses theirs. ("Now, we are one.")

[derpkitteh]

Aha...AHAHAHA...AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAAHHAHAHAAHHAHAHAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!

No. Fuck no. Fuck to the fuck no. They wouldn't even break through Gul'dan's defenses, let alone Kil'jaeden's. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAA!!!!!

I'm dying rn. The 3 fucking horsemen (Along with Darion/The Player) couldn't even raise TIRION from the fucking grave. And 80% of our guys were gone. Holy land or not, that was a fucking slaughter. Idc if they've grown in power, they're not soloing the fucking Legion.

If the 4 Horsemen, and the DK player ATTACKED Kil'jaeden, then that'd be free dinner for Kil'jaeden. XD

light's hope was a slaughter in favor of the death knights. the paladins were being steamrolled, nazgrim alone was toying with maxwell(i believe that's his name?) in the chapel while we went below.

only the light itself raising up from the holy land expelled us.

i don't for a moment believe the scourge would stand a chance against the legion, far from it. but light's hope was a vicious victory until the light itself intervened.

[nothingsjim]

light's hope was a slaughter in favor of the death knights. the paladins were being steamrolled, nazgrim alone was toying with maxwell(i believe that's his name?) in the chapel while we went below.

only the light itself raising up from the holy land expelled us.

i don't for a moment believe the scourge would stand a chance against the legion, far from it. but light's hope was a vicious victory until the light itself intervened.

To be fair to the Paladin, it's a steamroll because they didn't expect the DKs to betray them. They may not be friends, but they're certainly allies, up until that point.

If my memory is correct, only two named paladins blocked our way, Maxwell himself (Taken care by Darion) and Liadrin (We take care of her) The rest of the Paladin are either out dealing with Legion in Broken Shore (The new Highlord), or dealing with the ghouls that suddenly raised up from the grave behind the Chapel.

[Farrarie]

Well, Death Knight Arthas and Kel'Thuzad were scared of Kil'jaeden early on in their campaign and felt compelled to serve him, but only at the behest of the Lich King. At this point, Kel'Thuzad was acting on his own, and schemed heavily to navigate between the Legion and dupe them while still fully serving the Lich King. Eventually they both double-cross the Legion in full by shattering the Legion's prison over the Lich King. Once Arthas and the Lich King are united, it's heavily implied that they are free of and are no longer controlled by the Legion, and that their combined power now eclipses theirs. ("Now, we are one.")

"eclipse theirs" you make laugh
illidan and the illidari are free from KJ but don't mean they can beat the legion
archimonde alone can easily defeat the lich king and Kel'Thuzad.


if the legion army came the scourge would be destroyed faster than you think.


even icecream citadel will be ruined burying the lich king with it.
and KJ and archimonde not one of them are the big bad of the legion sargeras is

[Nathreim]

The Scourge loses their greatest advantage when facing Legion : Resurrect the fallen into their ranks. Plus, KJ is the guy who created the Lich King afterall. I am willing to bet he knows some secret weakness that not even Lich King himself knows.

So ya, my money is on the Legion.

The Ebon Blade made demon flesh abominations so thats not an issue.


The Scourge unrestrained would have destroyed the world so its likely they could have beat the Legion. Kil'jaeden feared a free Lich King for a reason.

[Twilight Cultist]

It's funny how we're on the brink of defeating an actual god/world soul, yet the next expansion is supposed to offer an even bigger threat that'll prove to be our greatest challenge yet.

How do you exceed god/world soul magnitute of raw strength? I know you'll try and tell me that voidlords and old gods are stronger but they don't lead the most powerful army of destructive creatures known to Azeroth, hence the threat is diminished compared to the Legion.

The Old Gods are strong in their own right but their true strength if their ability to manipulate. The Legion is mostly about destruction with the Dreadlords pulling some string here and there. But the Old Gods are masters at this. They have their hands in everything and plan things out hundreds of years in advance. N'zoth is even using the Legion's invasion to his advantage. I wouldn't sleep on the Old Gods.

Also, we don't know how we are going to defeat Argus' World Soul. It more than likely won't just be us heroes taking him on.

[Farrarie]

9:42
you want to compare that to archimonde lol

[Razion]

"eclipse theirs" you make laugh
illidan and the illidari are free from KJ but don't mean they can beat the legion
archimonde alone can easily defeat the lich king and Kel'Thuzad.
[snip]

if the legion army came the scourge would be destroyed faster than you think.
[snip]
even icecream citadel will be ruined burying the lich king with it.
and KJ and archimonde not one of them are the big bad of the legion sargeras is

Well, in the final raid of Antorous, Illidan fully imprisons Sargeras.
A risen Illidan Stormrage and Velen would be that much more powerful and that much more capable.

As we've seen in our own fights against the Legion, their most powerful lieutenants only seem bothered to use their full power "when they feel like it" or even, when it's far too late. And utilizing such world-rending powers against us has always been beneath them as they see us little more than ants. The Scourge would have the same strengths as us when fighting their own raid encounters against KJ and Sargeras, with the same fights and encounters, and still achieve victory in the same ways.

It's not just a matter of power here, it's a matter of destiny. The Scourge would prevail for the same reasons we have any chance at all -- the Legion's hubris of seeing Azeroth's forces as nothing more than ants gets in the way of them unleashing their full potential against us long enough for us to achieve the victory we need.

[Farrarie]

Well, in the final raid of Antorous, Illidan fully imprisons Sargeras.
A risen Illidan Stormrage and Velen would be that much more powerful and that much more capable.

As we've seen in our own fights against the Legion, their most powerful lieutenants only seem bothered to use their full power "when they feel like it" or even, when it's far too late. And utilizing such world-rending powers against us has always been beneath them as they see us little more than ants. The Scourge would have the same strengths as us when fighting their own raid encounters against KJ and Sargeras, with the same fights and encounters, and still achieve victory in the same ways.

It's not just a matter of power here, it's a matter of destiny. The Scourge would prevail for the same reasons we have any chance at all -- the Legion's hubris of seeing Azeroth's forces as nothing more than ants gets in the way of them unleashing their full potential against us long enough for us to achieve the victory we need.

its not the power of illidan that will imprison sargeras ,but the power of Argus.
secondly we have the artifact like ashbringer. doomhammer , shard of frostmourne etc
its like 20 thrall or 20 tirion and its different than the lore and gameplay. if the lore took over gameplay
people will get bored and will not succeed in defeating the legion without taking many years. second thing some demons control undead as we know KJ magic who created the LK. the legion is a power to destroy worlds while the scourge is for weaken azeroth
1 demon is more powerfull than 10 undead or even more and the demons are more in numbers and have better use in magic
but the only downside to the legion is the source of power to summon them azeroth never had an invasion that had archimond and kj side by side
unlike illidan novel when illidan saw them together in a planet

[Highwhale]

If Scourge under leadership of Ebon Blade death knights and Four Horsemens then my money on Lich King team. Scourge can do anything what A/H could do, but better.

Why people put Archie there? He was dead before Legion Invasion.

[Teri]

It all depends if the Scourge can quickly reanimate demon corpses on the field of battle.

Seems to me that demon souls go back to Antorus/Nether to regenerate.

Now if the scourge can extract demon souls to make an army of spirit demons it'd be different.

If demons cannot be turned into traditional Scourge undead (animated Fel is different), Scourge would need the advantage of a fresh Host world to extract a massive army from.

But then again both Legion and Scourge have their Monstrosity creations of combined souls/corpses that are fused/stitched and usually warped, that usually need preparations beforehand, at least for their biggest/strongest ones.

[Kallisto]

The Scourge unrestrained would have destroyed the world so its likely they could have beat the Legion. Kil'jaeden feared a free Lich King for a reason.

Because a Free Lich King wouldn't behave the way KJ wanted, plust KJ was too far away to do anything about it, plus the fact KJ seemingly is the type who doesn't want to get his hands dirty unless there is no other way..

The Scourge unrestrained would have found their way to the Dreadlords who can easily control the undead, in turn could have likely turned them back onto Bolvar and finish him off.

[Razion]

its not the power of illidan that will imprison sargeras ,but the power of Argus.
secondly we have the artifact like ashbringer. doomhammer , shard of frostmourne etc
its like 20 thrall or 20 tirion and its different than the lore and gameplay. if the lore took over gameplay
people will get bored and will not succeed in defeating the legion without taking many years. second thing some demons control undead as we know KJ magic who created the LK. the legion is a power to destroy worlds while the scourge is for weaken azeroth
1 demon is more powerfull than 10 undead or even more and the demons are more in numbers and have better use in magic
but the only downside to the legion is the source of power to summon them azeroth never had an invasion that had archimond and kj side by side
unlike illidan novel when illidan saw them together in a planet

But he still used that power and still imprisoned Sargeras. His power or not, it was done against the Legion and was successful - and the Scourge are more capable of doing so. The Scourge as well would have the Artifacts. It already has possession of the Death Knights of Acherus with three of the existing artifacts and has demonstrated in the campaign a strength capable of contesting the other Order Halls - killing any unit at any of these Order Halls would serve to strengthen their numbers against any assault on any other Order Hall. The thing about KJ having some undead magic potency is that he never once ever used it -- ever. Acherus sat at the edge of the Broken Shore the entire expansion, and if KJ had been more powerful than the Lich King at controlling undead, he would have exerted his power there and he wouldn't have needed to imprison the Lich King in the first place. No one can trump the Lich King in undead control -- it's the entire point the Lich King exists at all. As for "more than 10 undead" -- but how many? The endless tide of all dead on Azeroth enough to kill one demon? But forget that, because Death Knights are far more powerful than common imps anyway. The second one demon dies, they can be raised. We saw in Hellfire Citadel that demons like Mannoroth can be raised with necromancy. So once one demon dies, and is empowered by the Lich King further, one Risen Demon fighting for the Scourge can slay another, normal demon. And then the Scourge has two demons. Repeat infinitely until the entire Legion is serving the Scourge. Checkmate, right? Even with magic, mana is a limited resource to the individual, which can be exhausted and overwhelmed by an endless sea of undead constantly throwing themselves at them - forcing them to expend it - until that one weak little imp runs out of mana and then, well, one imp kills another imp... raises the other imp... then two imps kill two more imps... you get the picture.

[Kagthul]

It's funny how we're on the brink of defeating an actual god/world soul, yet the next expansion is supposed to offer an even bigger threat that'll prove to be our greatest challenge yet.

How do you exceed god/world soul magnitute of raw strength? I know you'll try and tell me that voidlords and old gods are stronger but they don't lead the most powerful army of destructive creatures known to Azeroth, hence the threat is diminished compared to the Legion.

This is a purely military-like view of the situation.

N'zoth is a LOT more dangerous because he can literally corrupt anything that isn't the Scourge.

You could be leading the charge against the Naga forces only to get cut down from behind by people you thought were on your side but have been subborned by N'zoth.

There's more than one kind of power.

- - - Updated - - -

Also, i view this as "could the Scourge prevent the Legion from taking Azeroth", not "can the Scourge defeat the Legion everywhere".

The answer to that is most likely no, as they simply wouldnt have the bodies to do so, even if they raised every sentient currently living on Azeroth.

[Terongor]

But he still used that power and still imprisoned Sargeras. His power or not, it was done against the Legion and was successful - and the Scourge are more capable of doing so. The Scourge as well would have the Artifacts. It already has possession of the Death Knights of Acherus with three of the existing artifacts and has demonstrated in the campaign a strength capable of contesting the other Order Halls - killing any unit at any of these Order Halls would serve to strengthen their numbers against any assault on any other Order Hall. The thing about KJ having some undead magic potency is that he never once ever used it -- ever. Acherus sat at the edge of the Broken Shore the entire expansion, and if KJ had been more powerful than the Lich King at controlling undead, he would have exerted his power there and he wouldn't have needed to imprison the Lich King in the first place. No one can trump the Lich King in undead control -- it's the entire point the Lich King exists at all. As for "more than 10 undead" -- but how many? The endless tide of all dead on Azeroth enough to kill one demon? But forget that, because Death Knights are far more powerful than common imps anyway. The second one demon dies, they can be raised. We saw in Hellfire Citadel that demons like Mannoroth can be raised with necromancy. So once one demon dies, and is empowered by the Lich King further, one Risen Demon fighting for the Scourge can slay another, normal demon. And then the Scourge has two demons. Repeat infinitely until the entire Legion is serving the Scourge. Checkmate, right? Even with magic, mana is a limited resource to the individual, which can be exhausted and overwhelmed by an endless sea of undead constantly throwing themselves at them - forcing them to expend it - until that one weak little imp runs out of mana and then, well, one imp kills another imp... raises the other imp... then two imps kill two more imps... you get the picture.

You have to the account that on Argus we have the demon hunters which are specialized in fighting against demons as we read from illidan novel and their raid to nathreza. Legions weakness huge amount of extremely strong individuals and scourge have none of that their strongest would be KT, Darion or the player DK. Also when the archerus dk's tried to ressurect Tirion light wiped them out but light couldn't do nothing against Gul'dan and on that raid they had their strongest characters also we couldn't do nothing in Antorus if all of legion's masses where on argus and it would they the whole scourge more time to go to Argus than the whole legion. The imprisoment of Sargeras is done Arguses power, all of Pantheon remaining power, Illidan and probably all of our artifacts. Also Aewqyn said that if even a slighter of Sargeras spirit was infused on his avatar she doesn't know if any on azeroth has power to stand against him including the whole scourge. Mannoroth was yes ressurected(Also on that spell it was used alot of fell energy and LK doesn't know how to use fell) but he held his own will and any demons will is alot stronger than normal forsaken and LK couldn't even control them so he would only resupply legion with more power and Nathrezims could steal undeads from LK easily(Nathrezims stole alot of scourge forces during Frozen throne and that is gameplay reasons why) Also if legion wanted to they could send alot of shivaras and nathrezim to assasinate LK they could easily pass scourge forces in icecrown without being netected and they could summon fast someone like Aggramar infront of the LK and he could spill the ice and LK with one blow.

[ryanmahaffe]

It's funny how we're on the brink of defeating an actual god/world soul, yet the next expansion is supposed to offer an even bigger threat that'll prove to be our greatest challenge yet.

How do you exceed god/world soul magnitute of raw strength? I know you'll try and tell me that voidlords and old gods are stronger but they don't lead the most powerful army of destructive creatures known to Azeroth, hence the threat is diminished compared to the Legion.

It isn't as strong as one though, Argus is going to be NOWHERE near the actual strength or raw power of a Titan, it will probably be an extremely early forced awakening from Sargeras.

@OP people underestimate the Scourage big time, could they defeat the Legion all out? Hell fucking no. Could they have taken the Broken Shore? Hell yes but they would eventually be overrun from reinforcements from KJ and whatnot.

[Terongor]

It isn't as strong as one though, Argus is going to be NOWHERE near the actual strength or raw power of a Titan, it will probably be an extremely early forced awakening from Sargeras.

@OP people underestimate the Scourage big time, could they defeat the Legion all out? Hell fucking no. Could they have taken the Broken Shore? Hell yes but they would eventually be overrun from reinforcements from KJ and whatnot.

How Scourge could have countered the Legion Spaceship navy from the trailer of 7.2? I doubt they have enough frostwyrms nor strong enough of them remaining

[Farrarie]

How Scourge could have countered the Legion Spaceship navy from the trailer of 7.2? I doubt they have enough frostwyrms nor strong enough of them remaining

he think the power of the legion is the one ingame maybe he didn't read the novels or understand the true power of the legion
and funny he think that illidan have the power to jail sargeras he forgot that with the help of the pantheon he used Argus last power to jail sargeras
and Argus have weird power to resurrect the dead demons so maybe that power is used to jail sargeras
but comparing the scourge with the legion is absurd
he don't know that now the dk player is the strongest of the scourge after bolvar lol
and all the other players are the leader of their classes may very less weaker or have the same or surpass the other heroes of warcraft

[Leyre]

we have airships. why we just didn't bomb the fuck out of the scourge overwhelming icecrown is asinine to say the least.

There must always be a lich king. no no there really mustnt. the lich king had only existed for less then TEN YEARS bolvar "cant" command scourge that are beyond northrend yet plaugelands was cleared realatively well. Now without the lich kings and you know an Actual cult of the Damned mopping up the undead from airships would of been childs play.

>what are these things

[anaxie]

[QUOTE=Leyre;47249201]>what are these things

Oh no gargoyles how will we deal woth them when we already fought them in northrend and the third war.

..... and blue dragons in the nexus war

And black dragons. And twolight sragons and deathwing

And the legions infinite felbats and golems that rain from the sky.

But G-g-g-gargoyles!!