Is Disc priest fun for you at 110 with cordondance?

[Deleted]

There are far less Disc parses, so it would be expected that they have a higher parse % even for the same performance; though it's also clear from the HPS that the other healers didn't have much to heal. H KJ isn't demanding at all outside of a few key bursts, which is Disc's specialty. They also 4 healed it for some reason? Not sure why on that.

Nope they 5 healed it and 4 of there healers just played like donkeys. Myb it was a altrun or something and the dps and tanks carried these healers. Normally for this bossfight there is a healing requirement if you not heavily outdps mechanics like adds and so on

I tried this week +11m and i say it like Taliesin would say it:

It was pretty easy to heal, my disc alt plays very good and can handle high dmg fine in +11,

Nope. It was a shitshow obviooooooously.

My main is a resto and guess what? My disc plays like a handicaped druid which needs to do dmg for the hots to tick.

And my Wildgrowth can be casted with no cooldown heals for 90% less and to heal everyone from 50% hp to full only costs 600k mana. So yeah and if you dont have velens you can burie your own grave.

Disc needs a heavy buff for playstyle. Its clunky as shit. If you ever played with 30 ppl on heroic and a holy or resto uses his tranq u will know what i mean

[MendUS]

Nope they 5 healed it and 4 of there healers just played like donkeys. Myb it was a altrun or something and the dps and tanks carried these healers. Normally for this bossfight there is a healing requirement if you not heavily outdps mechanics like adds and so on

I tried this week +11m and i say it like Taliesin would say it:

It was pretty easy to heal, my disc alt plays very good and can handle high dmg fine in +11,

Nope. It was a shitshow obviooooooously.

My main is a resto and guess what? My disc plays like a handicaped druid which needs to do dmg for the hots to tick.

And my Wildgrowth can be casted with no cooldown heals for 90% less and to heal everyone from 50% hp to full only costs 600k mana. So yeah and if you dont have velens you can burie your own grave.

Disc needs a heavy buff for playstyle. Its clunky as shit. If you ever played with 30 ppl on heroic and a holy or resto uses his tranq u will know what i mean

Your post basically tells me you're not that good at Disc and you prefer an easier healer like RDruid.

[Deleted]

Your post basically tells me you're not that good at Disc and you prefer an easier healer like RDruid.

If your Grp gets dmg you need to heal them. If they get more dmg you need to heal them quicker and with more power. So in that case healing is like a race. And i want to have a fast car if i am in a hurry. Maybe you want a smart if that is your playstyle. Fine for me. Drive what you like. For most healers, especially in comparison with other healers disc is a shitshow at the moment on m+, obviously.

But i am open to facts which prove that discs heal equally good as Rdruids in m+. Like i say, i am new to the class, want to learn stuff. I read a lot of Discs telling in forums that Disc is not great right now and from my understanding blizzard has changed a lot and myb not all of it was for the better.

In raids its okay hps. You can play well if you know what you do. But. And this is a huge "but": We do hps but we are very lackluster when things go wrong and we need to spotheal targets without atonement. When 14+ Atonements are rolling on other players and we need to dps to get those juicy hps out which heal all ppl but not the target which needed it the most. Which, yeah, you got it, is again just a handicaped Rdruid-Story. They also hot the whole raid and if they are done hotting, they do what they like, for example safing someones life. While in Discs story, yeah you are fucked and do smite-shit with decent hps numbers and blame other healers for letting the player die.

Until now i never met someone who told me: Yeah play disc its as strong as holy right now and you should play what you like more. You get what i mean. Ofc you do. All told me this: Disc is shit. If you want to heal as priest, play holy. Its easy to understand, will perform very well in every situation and gets very strong numbers out.

Disc is the opposite side: Its extremely hard to execute it 100% right, the results are just okay in some situations and extremely underperforming in other situations. In some cases discs have no chance to even try to play like other healers do (for example RaidCD) or 5 Target heal in m+.

And you know what: I was not listening. I wanted to try it on my own. I wanted to be the hero the makes very strong hps on disc because I am superstar. I am not done yet. I will try even more. But until now its just a shitshow like I said 3 times now. Because disc is not strong enough right now. The smart is not fast enough.

[Deleted]

If your Grp gets dmg you need to heal them. If they get more dmg you need to heal them quicker and with more power. So in that case healing is like a race. And i want to have a fast car if i am in a hurry. Maybe you want a smart if that is your playstyle. Fine for me. Drive what you like. For most healers, especially in comparison with other healers disc is a shitshow at the moment on m+, obviously.

But i am open to facts which prove that discs heal equally good as Rdruids in m+. Like i say, i am new to the class, want to learn stuff. I read a lot of Discs telling in forums that Disc is not great right now and from my understanding blizzard has changed a lot and myb not all of it was for the better.

In raids its okay hps. You can play well if you know what you do. But. And this is a huge "but": We do hps but we are very lackluster when things go wrong and we need to spotheal targets without atonement. When 14+ Atonements are rolling on other players and we need to dps to get those juicy hps out which heal all ppl but not the target which needed it the most. Which, yeah, you got it, is again just a handicaped Rdruid-Story. They also hot the whole raid and if they are done hotting, they do what they like, for example safing someones life. While in Discs story, yeah you are fucked and do smite-shit with decent hps numbers and blame other healers for letting the player die.

Until now i never met someone who told me: Yeah play disc its as strong as holy right now and you should play what you like more. You get what i mean. Ofc you do. All told me this: Disc is shit. If you want to heal as priest, play holy. Its easy to understand, will perform very well in every situation and gets very strong numbers out.

Disc is the opposite side: Its extremely hard to execute it 100% right, the results are just okay in some situations and extremely underperforming in other situations. In some cases discs have no chance to even try to play like other healers do (for example RaidCD) or 5 Target heal in m+.

And you know what: I was not listening. I wanted to try it on my own. I wanted to be the hero the makes very strong hps on disc because I am superstar. I am not done yet. I will try even more. But until now its just a shitshow like I said 3 times now. Because disc is not strong enough right now. The smart is not fast enough.

Why do you talk as if shadow mend doesn't exist ? It's a very powerful spothealing tool and makes for very stong direct heals in dungeon coupled with grace. I'd argue that discipline is actually better than holy for m+ dungeons. If you have a hard time you are probably doing it wrong, be it your talents, gear or plain gameplay. Whatever it is I think the issue comes from you and not the spec as stated by MendUS and here is why.

You can top your group quite easily with radiance > penance (2pc is extremely stong for burst healing) > shadow covenant (buffed by grace ofc otherwise it's not worth it) and can compensate most damage your group will ever take. And we're not even talking about preventing damage here. There are so many mechanics a rdruid can't do much about except heal while disc can actually trivialize some of them. Take Attumen from lower kara for example, the shared suffering mechanic is a pain at higher level keys especially during tyranical week. A resto druid will blanket hot everyone beforhand and top everyone off to the best of its ability. A discipline priest will significantly reduce the threat of that mechanic by using rapture on a shared suffering (don't forget atonement are a flat damage reduction buff as well even if it is small) then heal everyone, use barrier on another shared suffering then heal everyone with even more ease thanks to the 100% atonement healing buff barried provides and eventually just heal the last one (arguably instantly with light's wrath coupled with leg trinket). You can use your cd's any order you want it doens't matter. How is that not extremely strong ? Do you not know disc has such powerful tools as well while being strong hps wise and providing dps ? Need i remind you that we have the strongest external cd in the game with pain sup being a 40% damage reduction and 30% of the remaining damage received by the target will automatically be healed rendering our target almost immortal ?

I've played my fair share of holy and disc in dungeon and i'd rather play disc in most situations and affixes. The only thing we are bad at is group healing while there is nothing to hit which is only problematic during grivious week and you can still use shadow covenant for that if you want (no healing penaly out of combat just like shadow mend), especially if there is also fortified the same week and sanctuary isn't that useful on bosses since they don't do that much damage. I mean we even have choice, need a burst aoe heal then pick shadow covenant with grace, need to help your tank survive while maximizing dps then pick sanctuary and if you have hard hitting mechanics to prevent pick clarity of will and shield your group. And on top of that you have the added benefit of actually providing dps for your group. I never do less than 400k dps (low end of the spectrum for the sake of the argument) and that is pretty substantial.

Also you say that we have to hit mobs for our "hots" to tick and that is utterly wrong. Our dot IS our hot, you just choose who gets the hot by placing atonements. As disc you dps (smite) when there isn't much to heal and keep penance for burst aoe healing when you know they are coming. If a single person in your group gets hit by a spell and goes down to 30% health of course you will stop dps'ing and spotheal him immediatly with shadow mend. It baffles me you said in your post we would be stuck healing through atonement. That is just so wrong ... You spot heal then finish healing with atonement when your group member is out of danger. Claiming the oposite is just wrong. Consider this, you could dot mobs then spot heal with shadowmend and you would play juste like holy would with it's flash heal spam while also doing a little bit of damage. I just can't aggre with you when you say that disc is a shit show in dungeons, i think it is extremely strong and judging by what you are saying i would tend to question your understanding of the spec or at the very least the way you play it.

I do have to admit tough that rdruids are indeed better than disc in dungeons, or at least in terms of rankings. The same way paladins are better than disc and maybe even rdruids as well in dungeons. When you look at groups who pushed high keys during the Dungeon Invitational Qualifiers, paladins and druids were indeed on top (btw note that there are two disc priests in the top 20 but no holy priest, you actually have to go to rank 37 to see the first holy priest, and keep in mind holy is way more represented). One paladin pushed a +24 key (Meowchan is widely regarded as a complete beast tough) and one druid did the same. Disc was right behind with +22 keys (check out Amanda's youtube, disc priest from Lethal). We also have to take into account that disc is wayyyyy underplayed compared to druids and paladins, who knows what results might have been with the same size sample. Also, if you watch Amanda's videos you can see healing wasn't an issue (and don't you dare tell me it's thanks to the blood dk because top groups for paladins, druids and sham had a dk as well) and provided they had more dps or better luck with key's rng we might have seen a disc priest doing a +23. At this point the issue is almost never the tanking or healing but the insane dps requirements those extremely high level keys have.

With all that said and judging from what you posted i think you are ignorant of what disc priests can really do and how strong they are currently. Disc priests are under-represented, not underperforming and I hope this could help you change your mind on the matter.

[theburned]

If your Grp gets dmg you need to heal them. If they get more dmg you need to heal them quicker and with more power. So in that case healing is like a race. And i want to have a fast car if i am in a hurry. Maybe you want a smart if that is your playstyle. Fine for me. Drive what you like. For most healers, especially in comparison with other healers disc is a shitshow at the moment on m+, obviously.

But i am open to facts which prove that discs heal equally good as Rdruids in m+. Like i say, i am new to the class, want to learn stuff. I read a lot of Discs telling in forums that Disc is not great right now and from my understanding blizzard has changed a lot and myb not all of it was for the better.

In raids its okay hps. You can play well if you know what you do. But. And this is a huge "but": We do hps but we are very lackluster when things go wrong and we need to spotheal targets without atonement. When 14+ Atonements are rolling on other players and we need to dps to get those juicy hps out which heal all ppl but not the target which needed it the most. Which, yeah, you got it, is again just a handicaped Rdruid-Story. They also hot the whole raid and if they are done hotting, they do what they like, for example safing someones life. While in Discs story, yeah you are fucked and do smite-shit with decent hps numbers and blame other healers for letting the player die.

Until now i never met someone who told me: Yeah play disc its as strong as holy right now and you should play what you like more. You get what i mean. Ofc you do. All told me this: Disc is shit. If you want to heal as priest, play holy. Its easy to understand, will perform very well in every situation and gets very strong numbers out.

Disc is the opposite side: Its extremely hard to execute it 100% right, the results are just okay in some situations and extremely underperforming in other situations. In some cases discs have no chance to even try to play like other healers do (for example RaidCD) or 5 Target heal in m+.

And you know what: I was not listening. I wanted to try it on my own. I wanted to be the hero the makes very strong hps on disc because I am superstar. I am not done yet. I will try even more. But until now its just a shitshow like I said 3 times now. Because disc is not strong enough right now. The smart is not fast enough.

I mean you already have enough issues understanding how resto druids work, so it's quite understandable that disc priest which is quite a bit more complex will be hard for you to grasp.

Disc priest in m+ is really strong, you just dont know how to play it, you have one of the strongest spot healing spells, only 2nd to hpalas, while also having some really solid hots, damage reduction and shields. Barrier is probs one of the strongest 5 man cds (paladins have better stuff I guess). While also bringing some really solid dps to a dungeon, which you might have guessed 4-500k dps out of 5m is a lot more than 350k dps out of 20m.

Also assuming it was today, grievious + bursting is a combo where you actually need to know how your spec works, and also which talents to pick, if you didnt pick shadow covenant you are doing something wrong. Common mistakes that you can see in bad disc priests is they apply way too few attonements through actual spells, rather than just waiting for damage and then PW:R, thats a good way to completely fuck yourself over, you will be behind before the bursting even comes out and then you spend half the dot duration just applying PW:R. Then you have communication, if you dont let your team know you need mana breaks, you wont get any, scov is very mana dependant, but very storng in return, while on a druid you can always be the first to the new pack and drink, as a priest you could skip drinking and still have issues keeping up. People need to know this, and holy isnt any better at this, far worse in my experience, while they also require your team to stack up enough for sanct to hit people. Cd usage, people dont seem to understand how strong rapture is, and also tend to use it before its too late (this obviously requires some experience with the pulls, to know where you need extra healing.)

Not once this tier have I thought, wow holy is so much better than disc, its less mobile, its roughly same throughput, no good burst windows and more importantly no dps, most wipes are due to either too low dps, too little healing during bursts, bad spot healing or just simply fucking up mechanics. These are aspects where disc flat out dumpsters holy priests, apart from spot healing (in raids), but they still outshine rdruids when it comes to quickly saving a person. The times you wipe to just flat out not enough sustained healing (which is very very rare if you have a shaman/hpala/rdruid in the raid) pre world first kill fallen avatar p2, and KJ p3 pretuning, were about the only times this happened this tier, and on both fights the dps disc brought was very important aswell.

[Toroc]

It amazes me how many people are in denial about their ability to play Disc. Now I'm not saying it couldn't use a few changes but a lot of things mentioned here are either learn to play issues or comp issues.

I chuckle inside when I hear people trying to trash a spec with the biggest healing potential.

[Deleted]

It amazes me how many people are in denial about their ability to play Disc. Now I'm not saying it couldn't use a few changes but a lot of things mentioned here are either learn to play issues or comp issues.

I chuckle inside when I hear people trying to trash a spec with the biggest healing potential.

Exactly. Seeing him talk as if we can't spot heal compared to rdruid when we are way better at it baffles me. It's like some people don't even understand they have to use some of their spells to actually be good at their spec or something. But hey, it's a bit harder to play than holy so that means it's worse right ? Right ? ....

The fact he says disc plays like a rdruid makes me think he uses Evangelism in dungeon ... and we all know how bad this is.

[Deleted]

Interessting. So first things first: the dot heals for very little. Not enough on its own. I need to penance and smite 5 times to heal like 30% of players health with dot running. On the +11 arcus run this week there was way more dmg coming in. Shadow covenant is the greatest shit right now on the disc toolkit. Nontheless its a must for m+ coupled with grace. But its such low healing. Its a shame. I needed to drink after every trash grp. It was so low healing that some of the aoe mechanics still simply killed the party. In some cases you want to cast penance as dps to heal the grp because shadow covenant is so low healing compared to penance and the absorb backfires so hard. But also you want to penance as a single heal because its way better then shadow ment and also shadow ment backfires too. I remember how the grp just died after i used all what you just discribed: Barrier, Painsup, PW:R shadow covenant. But from your triggering i guess there is hope for me with better gear and better legendarys that it will work some day. This week on m+ i refuse to heal with my disc :-)

[Deleted]

What gear do you have ? What are your actual stats ? Do you have any set piece at all ? There is no way you only heal 30% of someone's health with penance and smite spam. Absolutely no way. There must be something very wrong with either your character or your gameplay. I'm usually bored out of my mind in +10/11 and i find there is not much to heal but i do admit i'm kind of overgeared for this level of keys.

Do you by any chance struggle with the concept of working for your heals ? I know a few healers friends who tried disc for a while but were put off by having to do shit to actually heal instead of using your healing spell then wait for more damage to come. Keep in mind that half our job is to prevent damage and even with that we still have excellent healing throutput when the damage taken is substantial. I don't envy any other class on that front, i even think disc might be a bit too strong in the game currently but that is another discussion.

[Deleted]

What gear do you have ? What are your actual stats ? Do you have any set piece at all ? There is no way you only heal 30% of someone's health with penance and smite spam. Absolutely no way. There must be something very wrong with either your character or your gameplay. I'm usually bored out of my mind in +10/11 and i find there is not much to heal but i do admit i'm kind of overgeared for this level of keys.

Do you by any chance struggle with the concept of working for your heals ? I know a few healers friends who tried disc for a while but were put off by having to do shit to actually heal instead of using your healing spell then wait for more damage to come. Keep in mind that half our job is to prevent damage and even with that we still have excellent healing throutput when the damage taken is substantial. I don't envy any other class on that front, i even think disc might be a bit too strong in the game currently but that is another discussion.

Thank you for your kindfull words: I really try to improve on my gameplay. My Char has some hc raid logs from this week in which i got my 4 piece set. https://www.warcraftlogs.com/charact...ra/whiteflare#

But i do not have any logs from my m+ runs, sadly.

I have a question also: What is Rapture all about? I tried it in Raids in different ways. Sometimes only spam some shields to not totally destruct my mana. Sometimes i used the whole duration to shield the raid before the dmg comes in. In second case i was to fast oom and in both scenarios my hps gain from Rapture was so little, it was depressing. I tried it with the Shield Regen talent ofc. In m+ i deleted the Rapture WeakAura because it does not change a thing and it was better to heal the grp then shield it, because the shields vanish so fast, its very frustating. I can also cast Rapture on nearly CD on the tank, because the shield breaks so fast. So what is it about with this CD? What is the right way to use it especially in Raids. Thank you :-)

[theburned]

I have a question also: What is Rapture all about? I tried it in Raids in different ways. Sometimes only spam some shields to not totally destruct my mana. Sometimes i used the whole duration to shield the raid before the dmg comes in. In second case i was to fast oom and in both scenarios my hps gain from Rapture was so little, it was depressing. I tried it with the Shield Regen talent ofc. In m+ i deleted the Rapture WeakAura because it does not change a thing and it was better to heal the grp then shield it, because the shields vanish so fast, its very frustating. I can also cast Rapture on nearly CD on the tank, because the shield breaks so fast. So what is it about with this CD? What is the right way to use it especially in Raids. Thank you :-)

In m+ its pretty simple you use it before you take damage, to be sure that you are one step ahead of it and have attonement on everyone, can also be used to spam on tank with penance inbetween, if possible with 4p procs, if he takes a lot of damage.

In raids the cd is a lot stronger with shield discipline as it means you spend 11k less mana pr cast. You would want to use it slightly before damage, if necessary during damage (if there is enough damage to warrant it you should penance during it). The cd is a lot weaker without SD because its mostly about getting shields out that heals for 1m each vs pleas that heal for 2-300k + the attonement ofc, so there will have to come some damage you need to heal up.

[Deleted]

In raids, Rapture (with Shield Discipline) is an extremely powerful cooldown though. Yes, the shield disappear, but that's the same as saying that people lose life... It's... Completely normal? It's just a different way of healing. And you can use Rapture in conjonction with something like Mindbender, or a damage trinket, because when you are in Mythic+.

But really, Rapture is a REALLY cheap way of applying a ton of Atonements while maintaining very high HPS (my shields are on average 1M/gcd) to prepare for a burst.

Honestly, if you use DMC:P and go OOM, it's more of a casting pattern problem than a spec problem.

[Deleted]

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/charact...ra/whiteflare#

If I'm not mistaken isn't haste far less important to stack for disc since the changes, its decent up to about 25 - 30% hell you could manage quite well with just over 20 except item wise it's hard to push haste down, crit, mastery, and even verse give more value to disc once you are over 22% ish after all haste effectively gives us nothing beyond lowered cast times and gcd.

[Deleted]

If I'm not mistaken isn't haste far less important to stack for disc since the changes, its decent up to about 25 - 30% hell you could manage quite well with just over 20 except item wise it's hard to push haste down, crit, mastery, and even verse give more value to disc once you are over 22% ish after all haste effectively gives us nothing beyond lowered cast times and gcd.

Oh I didnt know that. I just read the Disc Guide on Focused Will and there was a stat priority with haste first. I was thinking that I need to stack haste then. So if you go with say 25% haste. What is with the other stats? Crit around 20% and the rest into mastery or what did you recommend?

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

Cordondance lol. I like disc but it's really just outpaced by holy. Other healers can do more damage too, they just have to sacrifice globals to do so.

[Deleted]

Oh I didnt know that. I just read the Disc Guide on Focused Will and there was a stat priority with haste first. I was thinking that I need to stack haste then. So if you go with say 25% haste. What is with the other stats? Crit around 20% and the rest into mastery or what did you recommend?

I'm not personally one to fallow guides and in all honesty my own characters stats are not built with stats in mind they are simply the only items I have to fit around the set and legendaries so don't look over my character and think it's any sort of guide. With all that said I think you could lower your haste to around 30% and redistribute it between crit and mastery, since you are likely used to high haste and you run in a large raid setting I wouldn't suggest ditching all your haste until you get used to it.

I would actually like to know Mend and a few of the other peoples opinions on the stats I could be completely wrong although I doubt it since disc's abilities and style aren't at all haste focused.

[Nurasu]

Cordondance lol. I like disc but it's really just outpaced by holy. Other healers can do more damage too, they just have to sacrifice globals to do so.

Holy is outpaced by Disc on quite a few fights, and LOL, other healers can do more damage, they just can't damage. Wtf?

[MendUS]

I'm not personally one to fallow guides and in all honesty my own characters stats are not built with stats in mind they are simply the only items I have to fit around the set and legendaries so don't look over my character and think it's any sort of guide. With all that said I think you could lower your haste to around 30% and redistribute it between crit and mastery, since you are likely used to high haste and you run in a large raid setting I wouldn't suggest ditching all your haste until you get used to it.

I would actually like to know Mend and a few of the other peoples opinions on the stats I could be completely wrong although I doubt it since disc's abilities and style aren't at all haste focused.

Haste is a bit hard to value and stats in general are all fairly equal but Haste still takes the cake since it affects so many more aspects of our toolkit.

Best rule of thumb for gearing is to wear your highest item level pieces except for tier and trinkets (they are valued differently based on the effects they provide) while targeting haste if you can help it. It's almost always worth wearing the higher item level piece due to higher the higher stat budget. If you end up with less than 20% haste you should probably drop some ilvl's to get it higher. Most people are between 25% and 35% right now. My current stats are ~30% Haste | ~18% Crit | ~50% Mastery | ~10% Vers | ~7% Leech.

Tier 20 Value
2pc: Approximately 5-7% of a throughput increase.
4pc: Harder to calculate, potentially worth dropping 3-4 equipped item levels to equip.

Trinkets
Velens + Promises or Owl.

We've got some folks working on a new Disc spreadsheet so we can get proper stat weights, relic values, trinket rankings etc so that'll be coming in the next month or two (before Antorus is released).

[Deleted]

How would you rate the Owl trinket over The Deceiver's Grand Design.

[Nurasu]

How would you rate the Owl trinket over The Deceiver's Grand Design.

Higher burst; we already have sustained target healing in the form of atonement. You'll get more actual HPS from the owl when you have all your atonements out than you will from the trickle heal from Design. Not that Design is worthless at all, which I'm sure their spreadsheet will show.