Sub or Sin?

[Filippo]

Hi, i play wow since 1 month and i decided to use my legion boost to rogue class.
I now took all the artifact and i am actully playing sub but i dont know if i should continue with the sub or swap and leve” the sin.
Which one is and will be the more performant?
(Sorry for bad english)

[Eazy]

Sub is currently higher on the warcraftlogs, but it depends how you play, what legendaries you have and how well you pray for the gods of RNG.

Sub is probably the best option for TOS, though with the nether crucible sin is getting buffed.

The best answer would be:
Play whatever you like more.

[Filippo]

Sub is currently higher on the warcraftlogs, but it depends how you play, what legendaries you have and how well you pray for the gods of RNG.

Sub is probably the best option for TOS, though with the nether crucible sin is getting buffed.

I have no legendaries, i still have to start lvl 110 raids.
The god of rng hates me so fkin bad should i change spec?

[Deleted]

The playstyles are rather different so try both and see which one you like. Sub is more reliant on legendaries as shoulders are rather mandatory. This isnt the case for assa.

[Varolyn]

The playstyles are rather different so try both and see which one you like. Sub is more reliant on legendaries as shoulders are rather mandatory. This isnt the case for assa.

Playstyle wise there is no mandatory legendary anymore for rogues, except maybe outlaw bracers if still using RtB build. Damage wise, however, the shoulders are mandatory for all three specs, not just sub.

[nocturnus]

Outlaw and SiN are bottom of the dps meter, so if you care about that roll sub.

I personally despise the spec so I stuck with SiN even though everyone and their grandmothers can outdps me if I'm unlucky with PB procs.

[Toogoodman]

Sub is the way to go, it does better and ST and does multiples better on AoE due to second shuriken. Once you really get the hang of it, its pretty damn fun, just a lot of waiting for cools down burst with dances.

[omeomorfismo]

Playstyle wise there is no mandatory legendary anymore for rogues, except maybe outlaw bracers if still using RtB build. Damage wise, however, the shoulders are mandatory for all three specs, not just sub.

i consistently rank purple and even some high orange (without crazy poisonbomb) with bracer+boots+2t194t20+3MAss, sometimes even in goroth meanwhile solo-soaking every single time. actually as assassination you can basically choose what build use if you have bracer, boots, shoulder and helm. nothing is mandatory (maybe it is if you care about maybe 10k dps) unless the kill times are very, very low and hence you can abuse the initial double shoulder's buff (like non-tyrannical bosses)

[Deleted]

since most of the (top) rogues are playing sub, it should be clear that WCL has a lack of very good assa parses. Sub is the strongest spec, but assassination is stronger than WCL is trying to tell us.

[Twix]

i consistently rank purple and even some high orange (without crazy poisonbomb) with bracer+boots+2t194t20+3MAss, sometimes even in goroth meanwhile solo-soaking every single time. actually as assassination you can basically choose what build use if you have bracer, boots, shoulder and helm. nothing is mandatory (maybe it is if you care about maybe 10k dps) unless the kill times are very, very low and hence you can abuse the initial double shoulder's buff (like non-tyrannical bosses)

good job ranking against shitty rogues.. all top rogues play sub

[omeomorfismo]

good job ranking against shitty rogues.. all top rogues play sub

interesting, still leg shoulder arent mandatory for assassination

[Mathris]

interesting, still leg shoulder arent mandatory for assassination

Wait what? How are they not? The entire opening sequence for Assassination relies on you having the shoulders for the right amount of CP generation from Seal Fate. I promise you they're required for Assassination to compete with Subtlety.

[omeomorfismo]

Wait what? How are they not? The entire opening sequence for Assassination relies on you having the shoulders for the right amount of CP generation from Seal Fate. I promise you they're required for Assassination to compete with Subtlety.

bracer+boots+t19/t20+3MAss is fine, both in sims and real fights. at least unless you have super short fight, so when you are in farm mode.
actually even the variance is reduced thanks the less dipendence from shoulder's buff uptime and pb during the buff

[Varolyn]

bracer+boots+t19/t20+3MAss is fine, both in sims and real fights. at least unless you have super short fight, so when you are in farm mode.
actually even the variance is reduced thanks the less dipendence from shoulder's buff uptime and pb during the buff

Yeah but not everyone wants to run NH all the time to get 2 high ilvl pieces of t19 and also trying to get that iron vendetta relic. Two vendetta relics drop from tomb and that is fine for most assassination rogues as long as the iron relic is either Master alchemist or even toxic blade.

Also, I don't get what you are saying in that bracers/boots reduces rng reliance. The bracers buff poison bomb damage so depending on when you get your poison bomb procs if using bracers can effect your dps a good deal. If anything the helm and boots would offer the least amount of dps variance in terms of leggos for sin. Btw, I use boots/shoulders as my leggos as I don't have bracers and I probably wouldn't use them anyway.

[omeomorfismo]

Yeah but not everyone wants to run NH all the time to get 2 high ilvl pieces of t19 and also trying to get that iron vendetta relic. Two vendetta relics drop from tomb and that is fine for most assassination rogues as long as the iron relic is either Master alchemist or even toxic blade.

Also, I don't get what you are saying in that bracers/boots reduces rng reliance. The bracers buff poison bomb damage so depending on when you get your poison bomb procs if using bracers can effect your dps a good deal. If anything the helm and boots would offer the least amount of dps variance in terms of leggos for sin. Btw, I use boots/shoulders as my leggos as I don't have bracers and I probably wouldn't use them anyway.

actually i have cof 890, helm 900+socket, back 905 and iron 905.
and then sure, you can have pb in execute, but the execute fase is longer than the 5 sec window of the shoulders, you have more finisher in that time, it is more "normalized".

[Niisama]

Play whatever you want. It's so easy to get AP now it's not like when the Expansion launched and you were basically locked into a spec. I play Assassination, but I have been playing it for like 5 years now so it's more out of habit. The trade off is if you itemize for Sin or Sub you can kinda swap between them because the stat priority isn't wildly different--it's basically backwards for Outlaw--so I recommend trying those 2 first.

[Nekroman]

I play both. I smash sub on di and avatar. Used to be maiden too but has been falling with more gear it seems. But really I only play on those 2 and maiden and pvp at this point. Might not even play it on maiden this week though we'll see. I fkng hate pb so much but the inc sub tier looks like the rng will be similar there so i will keep my ap up on both sub and assass just in case. As someone above said the stat priority is so similar even gems and enchants are no real issue. You need shoulders to be really competitive for both, all 3 specs tbh, but you can still do damage enough to raid without, just dont expect to be cutting edge. Tbh every week sub goes down the ranks so dont expect to play rogue in cutting edge at all really. We are 4/9m only so i can play what i like. New "balancing" goes out in like 4 hours for me so we will see what happens probably no big change though. Good luck.

[Axaion]

Stop calling it Sin, edgelords, if you call it sin then Subtlety is to be called Lety, Outlaw will be called Law.

Its "ass" or "assa", or spell the full name!

Sheesh

[Feali]

Stop calling it Sin, edgelords, if you call it sin then Subtlety is to be called Lety, Outlaw will be called Law.

Its "ass" or "assa", or spell the full name!

Sheesh

That's a weird thing to get upset about.

[shaunika123]

if youve just started, then just play whatever you enjoy the most
spec strength difference only really matters in high end content