Should Linda Wenzel face execution in Iraq for joining ISIS?

[Slant]

That is really grasping mate,

The punishment should fit the crime, if she spread terror and killed ppl, the iraqis should decide her fate.

As a citizen, I demand from my country that they stick up for me. The second I get the feeling the country's not doing that, I stop paying taxes. This isn't often talked about, but citizenship is a two way deal. And I absolutely can refuse to cooperate in any manner with the state and cause a lot of trouble. And when I'm not alone and can rally other people behind me, we call this revolution.

So no, it's not grasping. It's an ancient principle on which the relationship between ruler and ruled is built. That someone committed a crime doesn't change that relationship. Not in the slightest.

But then, you just want to see blood. You're really no better than IS yourself. Yeah, I said it. Don't get all riled up in your righteous fury. You're bloodthirsty and just want to be extreme. You don't have any investment in this issue. You won't see her getting hanged. Heck, you probably didn't even know who she was until this thread. But going "HANG THAT BITCH!" is what you do, right?

[Elim Garak]

As a citizen, I demand from my country that they stick up for me. The second I get the feeling the country's not doing that, I stop paying taxes. This isn't often talked about, but citizenship is a two way deal. And I absolutely can refuse to cooperate in any manner with the state and cause a lot of trouble. And when I'm not alone and can rally other people behind me, we call this revolution.

So no, it's not grasping. It's an ancient principle on which the relationship between ruler and ruled is built. That someone committed a crime doesn't change that relationship. Not in the slightest.

In that sense it can be argued that she committed treason.

[Noradin]

I appreciate that you defend murders and people who help murderers. It fills my heart.

Surely you can point me to a quote of a post of mine wher I did this?

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Sooooo - still in this universe...no? Or are those countries in different universes? Seems like same planet, same universe, but you seem to know more about this stuff than me.

If you try to argue semantics do it properly.
You stated a generalisation, which was wrong, as those usually are.
The fact that there are local exceptions where it is not wrong does not make the original generalisation right.

[sarahtasher]

Again, I certainly hope that ''tuf guyz'' realize even dimly that if the Irakis engage in a orgy of summary executions like some people are begging them here (rest assured that every one executed will be declared ''a terrorist'), they are going to do like people do in those fabulous regions, and kill random Sunnis.

Unless you absolutely want a new civil war between Sunnis and Shias in 10 years, carrying justice in Irak will require rule of law and likely leniency to some degree (yeah, folks, like the US did in 1865). And it's not a LULZ SJW that make me say that, it's cold hard geopolitics : if the Shias win completely and marginalize the Sunnis, it's either a new round of instability/proxy wars between Iran and the Gulf monarchies or Iran making the rump Irak a puppet.

[Slant]

In that sense it can be argued that she committed treason.

Yes, and we have rules for that. You can't get out of your obligations to your country by simply betraying it. Jeez, where would we be if any traitor could just get away with that? We have a right to pursue our own justice and punish traitors as we see fit. We owe it to everyone else that we seek our form of justice. Now, we don't have a treaty with Iraq, so fuck knows if we ever get to do that. But I think it's totally legit to attempt at getting her back so we can deal with our own black sheep ourselves. If it doesn't pan out, nobody will shed a tear if she's hanged. So this is really a rather academic discussion unless you're a drama queen and just like to talk about executions because it tickles your fancy.

[Noradin]

In that sense it can be argued that she committed treason.

And that would be a case for the courts, which would mean a trial she would have to attend to at home.
The outcome still couldn't be capital punishment.

[Dentelan]

in which universe is the age of 16 an argument for being adult ?

Germany.

No one who was younger than 14 at the time an alleged offence was committed can be held criminally responsible. [Criminal Code, Section 19] Children aged 14 to 18 can be criminally liable where at the time of the offence, he or she was mature enough to see the injustice of the act and to act upon this knowledge. [Jugendgerichtsgesetz (Juvenile Courts Act), Sections 1 and 3]

[lonely zergling]

She should be awarded to one of the iraqi soldiers as a trophy. No sympathy with islamist scum.

[sarahtasher]

She should be awarded to one of the iraqi soldiers as a trophy. No sympathy with islamists.

Remind me again why ISIS is so bad, tuf guyz ?

For the sexual slavery ? You seem a okay with it.

[lonely zergling]

Remind me again why ISIS is so bad, tuf guyz ?

For the sexual slavery ? You seem a okay with it.

I'm ok with it in her case. Innocent people nope. Thats the thing she isnt innocent. Islamists (like ISIS terrorists) should be free for all. Everyone should be allowed to do whatever they want to them without a trial.

[Ravenblade]

In that sense it can be argued that she committed treason.

I think this depends on the criminal acts she is being held responsible for in total. In opposite to countries like the US crimes do not stack up, instead crimes of similar nature may be measured by their weight. The matter of treason is rarely brought up these days, not because it doesn't exist but because it's overshadowed by paragraphs citing much more damning crimes with a much more detailed catalogue of acts such as preparation of terrorist acts. Treason itself is rarely applied to civilians, it's more used against combatants or personnel in direct service of the country. This is because loyalty as an ideal value isn't regarded a constant anymore defining what treason is about, treason these days in Germany defines more about creating a scenario that damages or harms the wellbeing and integrity country or one of each states. Something that a terrorist is at least capable of and punished much harder.

[sarahtasher]

I'm ok with it in her case. Innocent people nope. Thats the thing she isnt innocent. Islamists (like ISIS terrorists) should be free for all. Everyone should be allowed to do whatever they want to them without a trial.

Such edge and virility.

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Yes. The SJW's that are heavily present on this board will say otherwise though.

The ''SJW'' are saying that it's up to the Irakis, not frackers who try to prove how tough they are by calling for murder and torture.

[lonely zergling]

Such edge and virility.

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I dont really care what happens to her as long as she cant return to Germany everything is ok for me. Its up to the Iraqi's to decide what happens.

[Noradin]

Germany.

No one who was younger than 14 at the time an alleged offence was committed can be held criminally responsible. [Criminal Code, Section 19] Children aged 14 to 18 can be criminally liable where at the time of the offence, he or she was mature enough to see the injustice of the act and to act upon this knowledge. [Jugendgerichtsgesetz (Juvenile Courts Act), Sections 1 and 3]

Did you spot that part?
Do you know what "Juvenile Courts" are?
Hint: They are for "juveniles", people who are not yet "adults".

[Deleted]

As a citizen, I demand from my country that they stick up for me. The second I get the feeling the country's not doing that, I stop paying taxes. This isn't often talked about, but citizenship is a two way deal. And I absolutely can refuse to cooperate in any manner with the state and cause a lot of trouble. And when I'm not alone and can rally other people behind me, we call this revolution.

So no, it's not grasping. It's an ancient principle on which the relationship between ruler and ruled is built. That someone committed a crime doesn't change that relationship. Not in the slightest.

But then, you just want to see blood. You're really no better than IS yourself. Yeah, I said it. Don't get all riled up in your righteous fury. You're bloodthirsty and just want to be extreme. You don't have any investment in this issue. You won't see her getting hanged. Heck, you probably didn't even know who she was until this thread. But going "HANG THAT BITCH!" is what you do, right?

I really dont wanna se blood, but if the iraqis want blood, then its up to them.
And in this case it should be up to your country.
She shouldent be extratied home to germany were she can cry herself in to a slap on the wrist.

You and she can demand what you want, this isent about you smuggeling dope, or diving a car or spiting gumm in the streets.
She joined ISIS, when you join them, you and your goverment demands can go to hell. If she in any shape or form helped spreading their terror then again all your demands can go hell.

But apperently im just like ISIS, i want to throw homosexualls of roofs raping children and selling them. And if want genocide to!

You said you werent grasping?

[sarahtasher]

I really dont wanna se blood, but if the iraqis want blood, then its up to them.
And in this case it should be up to your country.
She shouldent be extratied home to germany were she can cry herself in to a slap on the wrist.

You and she can demand what you want, this isent about you smuggeling dope, or diving a car or spiting gumm in the streets.
She joined ISIS, when you join them, you and your goverment demands can go to hell. If she in any shape or form helped spreading their terror then again all your demands can go hell.

But apperently im just like ISIS, i want to throw homosexualls of roofs raping children and selling them. And if want genocide to!

You said you werent grasping?

20 September 2020, as there are still sectarian strife in Irak because the Sunnis got back at the Shias who got back at them in 2017 for the 2014 uprising that was revenge for the Shia takeover of 2006...

''Uh, why those are so agressive '' ?

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I really dont wanna se blood, but if the iraqis want blood, then its up to them.
And in this case it should be up to your country.
She shouldent be extratied home to germany were she can cry herself in to a slap on the wrist.

You and she can demand what you want, this isent about you smuggeling dope, or diving a car or spiting gumm in the streets.
She joined ISIS, when you join them, you and your goverment demands can go to hell. If she in any shape or form helped spreading their terror then again all your demands can go hell.

But apperently im just like ISIS, i want to throw homosexualls of roofs raping children and selling them. And if want genocide to!

You said you werent grasping?

A ''tuf guyz'' suggested giving her a sex reward to an Iraqi soldier (rest assured, paragon of virility : Iraqis are not awaiting your permission)

[Deleted]

20 September 2020, as there are still sectarian strife in Irak because the Sunnis got back at the Shias who got back at them in 2017 for the 2014 uprising that was revenge for the Shia takeover of 2006...

''Uh, why those are so agressive '' ?

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A ''tuf guyz'' suggested giving her a sex reward to an Iraqi soldier (rest assured, paragon of virility : Iraqis are not awaiting your permission)

So your calling what ISIS is doing a mere uprising?

[Seranthor]

Again, I certainly hope that ''tuf guyz'' realize even dimly that if the Irakis engage in a orgy of summary executions like some people are begging them here (rest assured that every one executed will be declared ''a terrorist'), they are going to do like people do in those fabulous regions, and kill random Sunnis.

Unless you absolutely want a new civil war between Sunnis and Shias in 10 years, carrying justice in Irak will require rule of law and likely leniency to some degree (yeah, folks, like the US did in 1865). And it's not a LULZ SJW that make me say that, it's cold hard geopolitics : if the Shias win completely and marginalize the Sunnis, it's either a new round of instability/proxy wars between Iran and the Gulf monarchies or Iran making the rump Irak a puppet.

Psst... this is 2017, not 1865. Come back to the present miss... Are you suggesting that this young woman wont get a fair trial?

[Deleted]

20 September 2020, as there are still sectarian strife in Irak because the Sunnis got back at the Shias who got back at them in 2017 for the 2014 uprising that was revenge for the Shia takeover of 2006...

''Uh, why those are so agressive '' ?

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A ''tuf guyz'' suggested giving her a sex reward to an Iraqi soldier (rest assured, paragon of virility : Iraqis are not awaiting your permission)

Are you saying they should give her as a sexreward? DAFUQ?

[Deleted]

Germany.

No one who was younger than 14 at the time an alleged offence was committed can be held criminally responsible. [Criminal Code, Section 19] Children aged 14 to 18 can be criminally liable where at the time of the offence, he or she was mature enough to see the injustice of the act and to act upon this knowledge. [Jugendgerichtsgesetz (Juvenile Courts Act), Sections 1 and 3]

And most other european countries