New Class Order Hall Guide?

[sinofasin]

As mentioned, is there a new updated guide?

With probably listed champions and most appropriate champion equips especially with the introduction of the new champion equipment.

I have no idea what to do with the new equipment lol since patched if not, how are yall using the new mission time reduction gears?

[Devilyaki]

it's not really to hard to pick the gear and send people out :\

[sinofasin]

it's not really to hard to pick the gear and send people out :\

to get the most out of your champs, not just randomly dumping them onto your geared followers.

I believe many of our heroes were already decked out before 7.3 came out, my main point is how do we incorporate the new champion equipment into our existing follower's equipment lol.

[Devilyaki]

it does the same thing as the old stuff

[sinofasin]

it does the same thing as the old stuff

so there's no point to changing anything?

[Polarthief]

I've kept a spreadsheet since 7.2 or so for every class. The class rosters on there are preliminary, but I do have Druid ones on there.

We also won't know what's 100% optimal until we unlock 950 missions and know for sure what the Antorus missions will be (might be -100% and you need to 200% it), but so far I've been running base Success item (Bauble, soon to be the epic) + Counter item (whatever item matches the ability of the follower) + Reduction item (Satchel, soon to be the epic).

[Decyde]

I'm probably going to just set up people with 40% +40% +30% on longer than 8 hours until I get a 50% to replace that 30% with.

There's almost no missions sub 8 hours I care to do.

[sinofasin]

I've kept a spreadsheet since 7.2 or so for every class. The class rosters on there are preliminary, but I do have Druid ones on there.

We also won't know what's 100% optimal until we unlock 950 missions and know for sure what the Antorus missions will be (might be -100% and you need to 200% it), but so far I've been running base Success item (Bauble, soon to be the epic) + Counter item (whatever item matches the ability of the follower) + Reduction item (Satchel, soon to be the epic).

did you remove the updated recommended gearing for druids? I'm really just a clueless guy @ class order, I've followed your guide prior to 7.3 (and it helped me immensely, thank you).

[david0925]

The only thing that may shake things up are the fact that you have a lot of 2 character missions, which makes items/bonus that give you success rate with troops less valuable. Besides that, we need to see if missions fundamentally change when you start getting 925/950 missions.

[Polarthief]

did you remove the updated recommended gearing for druids? I'm really just a clueless guy @ class order, I've followed your guide prior to 7.3 (and it helped me immensely, thank you).

If you want a general guide to follow, just give everyone a flat Success item (Sledgehammer/Bauble/Momento), Counter item (match the item to the follower's ability, such as Spell for Remulos or Hazard for Thisalee), and Reduction item (Seerstone/Satchel/Writ). That's my current plan to do. There's plenty of other builds such as replacing the Reduction item with the blue Success/Counter item for more success, but I rather liked having Reduction on every champion back during 7.2. Things may change as we get 950 missions and 7.3.5 stuff as well.

For Meatball and classes with Reduction followers, I'll probably run with a Writ+Satchel and a <8h item.

[cparle87]

If you want a general guide to follow, just give everyone a flat Success item (Sledgehammer/Bauble/Momento), Counter item (match the item to the follower's ability, such as Spell for Remulos or Hazard for Thisalee), and Reduction item (Seerstone/Satchel/Writ). That's my current plan to do. There's plenty of other builds such as replacing the Reduction item with the blue Success/Counter item for more success, but I rather liked having Reduction on every champion back during 7.2. Things may change as we get 950 missions and 7.3.5 stuff as well.

For Meatball and classes with Reduction followers, I'll probably run with a Writ+Satchel and a <8h item.

I was actually thinking of a different strategy. I'm getting a ton of the 40% rare minion/hazard/spell counter items. Why don't I just throw one of each of those on every follower? If a mission was boss/spell/minion for example it would be the boss counter +80% right there with just one follower?

[Polarthief]

I was actually thinking of a different strategy. I'm getting a ton of the 40% rare minion/hazard/spell counter items. Why don't I just throw one of each of those on every follower? If a mission was boss/spell/minion for example it would be the boss counter +80% right there with just one follower?

I mean, it's not a horrible strategy for 3-slotter missions but it's a huge waste for 2-slotter and when the threats are matching for 3-slotters.

80% (100% when Epic) looks nice on paper but here's some other stuff to consider:
- A Memento (Epic Success) gives 30% at all times, which is 20% down from a "maybe you'll get this" item (25% all times/-15% if we're talking rares specifically)
- Stacking Reduction is just a godsend on long missions, especially when you need them done quickly (raid mission popping up the day of your raid, or a lot of good missions you want to do all pop up and you know they'll expire soon because Blizzard hates 7.3 missions for some reason).
- It's just not as efficient as stacking the threat the champion counters and giving other items. Hell a better set IMO would be the one they counter + Memento and Bauble. Memento + Bauble = 55%, Epic Counter = 50%. You won't see 3 non-Spec threats on a mission (at least not yet), so the max you could ever get is 100% with 2 epic counters, whereas with this set, you get 55% at all times and another 50% when they counter the threat (which will be almost always since specs can be filled in with Argus troops or Meatball; threats are the main reason to be using your class champions atm, specs secondary).

Now if we ever see Spec + 3 threat missions, then it could be a bit better, but I just don't see it working at the moment. It's just really inefficient to literally always be wasting 1 or 2 of your 3 slots.

[nothingsjim]

I was actually thinking of a different strategy. I'm getting a ton of the 40% rare minion/hazard/spell counter items. Why don't I just throw one of each of those on every follower? If a mission was boss/spell/minion for example it would be the boss counter +80% right there with just one follower?

I usually combine it with what the champion counters. If it's a champion that counters spell, then I give her a spell counter item, if it's one that counters hazard, I give him a hazard counter item. I usually ignore the Champion's ability if it doesn't match its counter (E.g, Hamuul, +15% against Hazard but Counters Minion), unless it's mission time related.

I am still keeping Troop Affinity Equipment on certain champions (Remulos and Forest Ember, for instance), but I think I will change it too later when I get more 7.3 Equipment, since they are just blatantly overpowered compare to our older stuffs.

Oh, also, Sylendra Gladesong is much better in 7.3 simply due to the new Argus troops cost so damn much. Back then her mushroom is equivalent 28 Order Hall Resources, but if you use it on Argus troops it's equal to saving 450 Resources per mission.

[cparle87]

I mean, it's not a horrible strategy for 3-slotter missions but it's a huge waste for 2-slotter and when the threats are matching for 3-slotters.

80% (100% when Epic) looks nice on paper but here's some other stuff to consider:
- A Memento (Epic Success) gives 30% at all times, which is 20% down from a "maybe you'll get this" item (25% all times/-15% if we're talking rares specifically)
- Stacking Reduction is just a godsend on long missions, especially when you need them done quickly (raid mission popping up the day of your raid, or a lot of good missions you want to do all pop up and you know they'll expire soon because Blizzard hates 7.3 missions for some reason).
- It's just not as efficient as stacking the threat the champion counters and giving other items. Hell a better set IMO would be the one they counter + Memento and Bauble. Memento + Bauble = 55%, Epic Counter = 50%. You won't see 3 non-Spec threats on a mission (at least not yet), so the max you could ever get is 100% with 2 epic counters, whereas with this set, you get 55% at all times and another 50% when they counter the threat (which will be almost always since specs can be filled in with Argus troops or Meatball; threats are the main reason to be using your class champions atm, specs secondary).

Now if we ever see Spec + 3 threat missions, then it could be a bit better, but I just don't see it working at the moment. It's just really inefficient to literally always be wasting 1 or 2 of your 3 slots.

I get all of that, but are you assuming you'll just send one champion on a mission, then back him up with two troops to reach 200%?

40% from each counter type on two troops would be virtually guaranteed 200% if I send two followers on the missions, wouldn't it? Say it was boss/spell/hazard. Boss is countered then two 40% spell counters, two 40% hazard counters. That's 160% before boss counter. You could send virtually any two followers on any mission so long as you countered the boss and get 200%. That was my vague idea.

I also get what you're saying about Blizz hating the 7.3 missions. For some reason, unlike in WoD, the Legion missions never tell you how long they have before they expire. Say I have a mission I can send my troops out on right now, and another I'd have to wait say 2 hours for another mission to end to get the right team. I have no way of knowing whether either of the ones I want to do might be expired before then. I had a mission despawn right in front of me after I'd assigned my team but the instant before I could click the 'send troops out' button. Took me a moment to realize what happened.

Ah, one last edit.

So your current suggestion is (flat success chance, success chance against whatever they counter, and duration reduction)?

[Polarthief]

I get all of that, but are you assuming you'll just send one champion on a mission, then back him up with two troops to reach 200%?

If it's a 2-slotter, it's usually 1 champ 1 troop. If it's a 3-slotter, it ranges a bit more. Sometimes it's 1 champ 2 troops.

40% from each counter type on two troops would be virtually guaranteed 200% if I send two followers on the missions, wouldn't it? Say it was boss/spell/hazard. Boss is countered then two 40% spell counters, two 40% hazard counters. That's 160% before boss counter. You could send virtually any two followers on any mission so long as you countered the boss and get 200%. That was my vague idea.

Assuming it's a 3-slotter mission, otherwise your champions will be quite ineffective against 2-slotters. Also with no Reduction or base success to add to it, all you get is 50% (40% for rares) from gear. Good luck getting those missions that start at -25 or even -50%.

So your current suggestion is (flat success chance, success chance against whatever they counter, and duration reduction)?

That's the basic build I'm doing for most champions, though some others can use 2 Reduction items and a <8h item, or hell maybe even running Counter + Reduction + <8h would be ideal too. It's up to interpretation but running 3 counter items only gets you so far with SOME missions. I'm planning builds that are effective for virtually any mission (which is why I'm also skeptical of <8h as well without 2 Reduction items).

I personally like guaranteed things instead of "yeah you're guaranteed to 200% this type of mission, but all these other kinds, you're just SOL", and I don't see putting Counter items on every champion getting you far in every 2-slotter. Even at epic, you'd get 100% for 2 of the items matching. Assuming it's not an AE mission and the other threat isn't Powerful, you'd be at ~185% or so, and again this is all assuming no AE (~25% chance of AE) and not Powerful for the other threat (~20% chance of rolling Powerful), and it's a 2-slotter. You also get no Reduction whatsoever so all your missions will be quite lengthy.

[Myztikrice]

What is Bauble?

[Polarthief]

What is Bauble?

Wakener's Bauble, rare "+Success", giving a flat 25% at all times.

[cparle87]

snip

By some followers do you mean Meatball like we have now? Him having epic duration reduction, rare duration reduction, and epic global success chance. And the others being epic global success chance, epic success to what they counter, and epic duration reduction? As a perfect ideal, that is?

[Polarthief]

By some followers do you mean Meatball like we have now? Him having epic duration reduction, rare duration reduction, and epic global success chance. And the others being epic global success chance, epic success to what they counter, and epic duration reduction? As a perfect ideal, that is?

Meatball I've actually swapped his third item for a <8h item since he almost always makes missions that low. It might even be worth doing on anyone with a Writ of Holy Orders (epic reduction) but I didn't go that far yet.

Everyone else I've been doing Success, Counter, and Reduction, yeah. Things may change and it can be up to personal preference though. These items aren't nearly as simple as pre-7.3 was where everything was "success or T2".

[cparle87]

Meatball I've actually swapped his third item for a <8h item since he almost always makes missions that low. It might even be worth doing on anyone with a Writ of Holy Orders (epic reduction) but I didn't go that far yet.

Everyone else I've been doing Success, Counter, and Reduction, yeah. Things may change and it can be up to personal preference though. These items aren't nearly as simple as pre-7.3 was where everything was "success or T2".

Yeah, I miss those days. One more thing. What about Sylendra? Currently she's double mission reduction and success chance cause she needs all the help she can get, to bring in mushrooms. I didn't even notice she counters spells until I looked at her a little while ago while thinking about all this.