Plot Twist: The GOP wants to raise your Taxes!

[Sormine]

Donald Trump's dubious claim that his tax plan won't benefit him



Donald Trump's Pants on Fire claim about the estate tax, small businesses and farms



Once again, Trump is forced to use outright, objective lies to sell his willfully ignorant rabid fanbase on his agenda. He cannot use the truth, either because he knows it won't make his case, or because he's mentally deficient. Pick one. Neither trait is redeeming.

The fact that we even have debates about the estate tax is really indicative of how bad American politics is.

[Gestopft]

Donald Trump's Pants on Fire claim about the estate tax, small businesses and farms

Once again, Trump is forced to use outright, objective lies to sell his willfully ignorant rabid fanbase on his agenda. He cannot use the truth, either because he knows it won't make his case, or because he's mentally deficient. Pick one. Neither trait is redeeming.

"Family farms and small businesses" has been the rallying cry of the GoP for a while when it comes to the estate tax: Trump is just the first to claim "millions" because he's too uninformed to know how minuscule of a number it actually is. Most Republicans (I assume) just leave the "only 80-ish" part out intentionally.

I see that even most of the usual trumpanzees are avoiding this one lol. This tax plan is terrible.

Just like with Trump, policy details are irrelevant; irritating "liberals" is what really matters.

[Nadiru]

I see that even most of the usual trumpanzees are avoiding this one lol. This tax plan is terrible.

How is this tax plan terrible? Removing most itemized deductions alone is a progressive move which primarily impacts the top income quintile. Likewise at the other end, doubling the minimum deduction reduces the tax burden on the poorest households. The marginal tax rate is reduced somewhat even on the highest bracket (unless that "ghost bracket" gets added in committee, in which case it's the most progressive tax plan since Carter) but the ability to deduct from that rate is hampered pretty signficantly.

[Dontrike]

How is this tax plan terrible?

The fact we even have to consider the estate tax at all is dumb. It barely affects anyone except the rich, which can pay for it anyways, and that we need to focus on it in the least bit is part of what makes it stupid. The rest of the stupid comes from the fact it will end up costing us money.

[Tijuana]

Who's the more Neo-Liberal party now?

Now that ACA repeal is dead, at least for the moment, Republicans claim they will move on to tax cuts. I am skeptical. While all Republicans support giving more money to the 1%, the devil is in the details. As we move closer to the midterms, this gets even harder. In any case, Republicans are already trying to sell this plan through their usual tactic of publically saying its tax cuts for all, but privately giving enormous tax cuts to Republican donors, their only actual consistency at this time..
Plus I really enjoy itemizing my deductions, gonna miss that.

Stopped reading after this ridiculous claim. What in the world...

Also, tax cuts factually do not give money to anyone. They let them keep more of what is already theirs.

Meanwhile, EVERY Democrat supports raising all taxes, on all humans. Pick a tax, any tax, and they LOVE it but wish it would be higher. Both Bernie's and Hillary's tax plans raised taxes on the lowest bracket. Despicable.

[Blur4stuff]

It's a fundamental flaw in conservative reasoning. To them taxes of any kind are bad and should be reduced wherever possible. To them this would lead to a better country.

But, they make the same mistake here as they do with healthcare. If what they preach were true then other countries with higher taxes would be worse places to live than the US. We know that isn't true so republicans largely depend on voters staying ignorant and for conservative media to keep pushing lies.

Single payer healthcare might be the best example of this. If "medicare for all" were to pass it would certainly raise taxes. So you'd see conservatives going nuts screaming to everyone that dems are raising your taxes as if it were going to make life a living hell. Meanwhile back in reality the average person and family would have more money each year despite higher taxes because they'd no longer be paying all of the different fees or getting stuck with enormous bills.

[LaserSharkDFB]

Stopped reading after this ridiculous claim. What in the world...

Also, tax cuts factually do not give money to anyone. They let them keep more of what is already theirs.

Meanwhile, EVERY Democrat supports raising all taxes, on all humans. Pick a tax, any tax, and they LOVE it but wish it would be higher. Both Bernie's and Hillary's tax plans raised taxes on the lowest bracket. Despicable.

Stopped reading after this ridiculous claim. What in the world...

[Sky High]

Stopped reading after this ridiculous claim. What in the world...

Realville funnily enough is not in this realm. I mean, you look at the voting record of plenty of Dems in government and his claim could not be more wrong.

[Nadiru]

The fact we even have to consider the estate tax at all is dumb. It barely affects anyone except the rich, which can pay for it anyways, and that we need to focus on it in the least bit is part of what makes it stupid. The rest of the stupid comes from the fact it will end up costing us money.

That's hardly the whole of the plan, though. Why is everybody focusing in on that when he's coming closer than anyone else has to fixing the loopholes that the left has complained about for decades.

[Fugus]

That's hardly the whole of the plan, though. Why is everybody focusing in on that when he's coming closer than anyone else has to fixing the loopholes that the left has complained about for decades.

While I will admit I don't know the full ins and outs of his tax plan (No one does yet) I think much of it has to do with the fact that even if his plan does fix some loopholes (not clear sign that it won't open up more) even under ideal conditions, it will still cause far more damage than the loopholes do and will be far harder to correct because it is harder to raise taxes than it is to cut taxes from a voter standpoint.

Many people are focusing on the Estate Tax because repealing it is literally nothing but a handout to the rich as it only effects them and actually helps to combat dynasty building to an extent and slow it down. Repealing it is virtually nothing but negatives across the board to give a bunch of rich people more money that they never earned themselves and makes it easier for rich families wealth to explode even faster as they can leave all of it to their kids.

The proper way to fix things would be, if they are wanting to cut taxes, would be to first leave the taxes untouched and deal with the loopholes, then when the loopholes are fixed and you see what your actual revenue is, then adjust the rate accordingly. Maybe you find out that you can cut it more than you thought safely, maybe you find out that you still aren't able to cut it any without damage, but to do both at the same time is foolish unless all you are looking for is giving the rich more money and fuck the consequences as long as you can kick the can down the road and blame someone else.

[Breccia]

This is a GOP tax plan? Possibly 30% of middle class gets a tax hike? I hope the final details are better than this.

-- Rand Paul

I will continue to say that the current plan, what little there is, won't be able to pass. It's not good enough for some of the middle class to get a small increase. 52 is a dangerous number. How the numbers get massaged is the important part, not the skeletal framework we have.

[Mafic]

The fact we even have to consider the estate tax at all is dumb. It barely affects anyone except the rich, which can pay for it anyways, and that we need to focus on it in the least bit is part of what makes it stupid. The rest of the stupid comes from the fact it will end up costing us money.

I am not a fan of the estate tax. If the government wants to address income inequality through taxation then raise taxes on the very rich.

The assumption that only the very rich are subject to estate tax is misleading.

- - - Updated - - -

This is a GOP tax plan? Possibly 30% of middle class gets a tax hike? I hope the final details are better than this.

-- Rand Paul

I will continue to say that the current plan, what little there is, won't be able to pass. It's not good enough for some of the middle class to get a small increase. 52 is a dangerous number. How the numbers get massaged is the important part, not the skeletal framework we have.

Middle class always will be bear the burden on Republican tax plans. This isn't surprising.

[Breccia]

Middle class always will be bear the burden on Republican tax plans. This isn't surprising.

Normally, yes. But this time, they're pressing HARD for the sell that it's a middle-class tax cut. Right now, that's horribly inaccurate. Most is going to the rich and corporations. That's old news. But, some in the middle class get nothing, others get a tax hike. That's a combined lie not even the GOP can sell -- look at town halls after health care. They have zero choice: they must increase the amount the middle class gets this time, based purely on how badly they need a win.

And Rand Paul's vote.

[Kujako]

Normally, yes. But this time, they're pressing HARD for the sell that it's a middle-class tax cut.

Like the last time. And the time before that. And the time before that. The only shocker is that people keep believing it.

[Mafic]

Like the last time. And the time before that. And the time before that. The only shocker is that people keep believing it.

Well the Republicans would be more respected if they were raising taxes to be fiscally disciplined. Except what they are doing is massive tax breaks for the rich ala Bush that simply doesn't change the paradigm for the country.

Republicans haven't been fiscally conservative in decades.

[PC2]

Well the Republicans would be more respected if they were raising taxes to be fiscally disciplined. Except what they are doing is massive tax breaks for the rich ala Bush that simply doesn't change the paradigm for the country.

Republicans haven't been fiscally conservative in decades.

Why would Republicans want to change the paradigm of the country? The US has one of the most prosperous economies in the world.

[Mafic]

Why would Republicans want to change the paradigm of the country? The US has one of the most prosperous economies in the world.

Not according to many Republicans and Democrats. If that was the case there would not be any talk of reforming the tax code from the Republican side or income inequality from the Democratic party side.

Right now GDP growth for a MDC like US is good but we do not know if this is sustainable. Maybe you are right that if nothing else happens and the government has a hands off approach maybe the country can recover on its own without Republican or Democratic intervention.

[Rasulis]

Why would Republicans want to change the paradigm of the country? The US has one of the most prosperous economies in the world.

To be exact, certain (like a handful of) regions of the US have the most prosperous economies in the world.

[Ripster42]

I am not a fan of the estate tax. If the government wants to address income inequality through taxation then raise taxes on the very rich.

The assumption that only the very rich are subject to estate tax is misleading.

- - - Updated - - -



Middle class always will be bear the burden on Republican tax plans. This isn't surprising.

The exemption is $5mil. It's not just the very rich, but it is the rich. Most small business and farms can largely get around it.

[PC2]

To be exact, certain (like a handful of) regions of the US have the most prosperous economies in the world.

I'm not sure how this is relevant. As long as the aggregate grows then the prosperity still benefits all the regions. Citizens also have freedom of movement, anybody can move to a more prosperous part of the country if they want.