Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst
1
2
3
  1. #41
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Cretaceous Period
    Posts
    22,793
    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    Me pointing out they don't need it isn't making it sound bad for them.
    It's sort of a weird argument in general. Strictly speaking, a lot of companies don't need advertising, in that they're not going to go out of business without it. Advertising isn't usually about literal need, it's about doing something that benefit the company. Advertising does this both in tangible ways like larger profits, higher sales numbers, larger reach and in more abstract or difficult to measure ways by increasing brand loyalty, awareness, community building, fighting competition, etc.

    Advertising continues to benefit Nintendo, whether they literally have a need for it or not, which is the point people are making when they are critical of Nintendo's perspective on creator content.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jester Joe View Post
    I'd have to disagree a bit on the first part, isn't the opposite why people like TotalBiscuit, PewDiePie, and even Markiplier all got so popular? Because they would take games people have no idea about and play them, or at least pretty obscure titles. I'd think more people watch for the streamer/creator themselves over whatever game they're playing. I could be horribly wrong, but the game itself only seems like an entry point to the creator.

    For example, let's say you were super interested in the new Mario, and you happen to find something let's say Markiplier put out for it, and you found him really entertaining. From there, you might start watching the rest of his videos, out of curiosity and because, well you had a good time watching the Mario one! That's what tends to happen more in my experience, I could be horribly wrong though.
    I mean, you're not wrong on those things, but I don't think those two circumstances are mutually exclusive. Yes, watching videos on particular things of interest to you might cause you to find and follow particular creators, but it's also true that watching videos on particular games does also cause those aforementioned benefits.

    It works both ways, and I don't think one being true is an argument against the other being true. I think both of those cases are very much true very often.

    I'm not trying to claim it's not helpful at all, I'm saying that it's not helpful enough for them to care it seems.
    I know you're not. Part of what I am trying to say is that I don't think this is a case of the benefits being so marginal that they are apathetic to the issue, I am saying that I really believe this is an issue where they are genuinely ignorant of the benefits entirely, and are making poor decisions based on that. Some of their past decisions and their ongoing evolution of their approach to creator content seems to indicate they are really just really, really, living under a rock with this stuff.

    Like I said, there is a reason why every other major pub/dev supports YouTube content including others that are arguably in a similar position as Nintendo. Call of Duty doesn't need brand awareness. World of Warcraft doesn't need to reach new audiences. Bioware isn't going under without creator content. But all of these franchises and games and companies have seen a huge value in allowing that content and their respective communities to flourish because ultimately it benefits them as well in a lot of ways. Nintendo not being on that boat isn't because Nintendo is special, it is because Nintendo is being stupid.


    for moderation questions/concerns, please contact a global:

    TzivaRadux SimcaElysiaZaelsinoxskarmaVenara

    | twitch | bsky
    |

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by Poppincaps View Post
    Didn't seem to help them with the Wii U now did it? It sold less than 14 million. That's pathetic. Just because Nintendo is iconic doesn't mean everything they touch is going to turn into gold. In fact Nintendo may be the most well known game company but Sony has crushed them in every single generation since they started with the one exception being the Wii vs PS3 (and the PS3 only lost by 20 million which is nothing when comparing the Gamecube to the PS2).
    You seem to be trying to make a point that has nothing to do with what I said. Did I say Nintendo was incapable of failure? Plus the point you are making is canceled out by what you just said here. The Wii U's failure was preceded by the Wii's huge success. It's almost like that failure has had little impact on their overall success, no?
    Nintendo is certainly the most iconic, but they have never been as successful as Sony outside of the Wii U.
    I'm sure you meant the Wii but you'd still be wrong because Nintendo murders everyone in the handheld market.

  3. #43
    Quote Originally Posted by johnhoftb View Post

    TL;DR: If your channel is wholly apart of the program, you cannot livestream on YouTube anymore.
    I thought the entire Nintendo business model revolved around ignoring streamers for N weeks, let it be popular and get free advertisement - and then out of nowhere send out DMCA takedowns leading fully taking to any revenue of any channel that ever sported a pixel worth of nintendo IP. Total Biscuit had a video on it a few years back.
    Non-discipline 2006-2019, not supporting the company any longer. Also: fails.
    MMO Champion Mafia Games - The outlet for Chronic Backstabbing Disorder. [ Join the Fun | Countdown | Rolecard Builder MkII ]

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by Leyre View Post
    Do people really think nintendo gives a shit about the bad PR? every day/month/year the same damn morons are going to buy every single version of pokemon/mario/zelda, no matter what stupid shit they pull
    They still get GoT though

  5. #45
    Over 9000! Poppincaps's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    Twilight Town
    Posts
    9,498
    Quote Originally Posted by unholytestament View Post
    You seem to be trying to make a point that has nothing to do with what I said. Did I say Nintendo was incapable of failure? Plus the point you are making is canceled out by what you just said here. The Wii U's failure was preceded by the Wii's huge success. It's almost like that failure has had little impact on their overall success, no?

    I'm sure you meant the Wii but you'd still be wrong because Nintendo murders everyone in the handheld market.
    No I am making a point that directly contradicts yours. You said that Nintendo doesn't need the advertising because of how iconic they are. The Wii U is proof that that isn't true. Just because everyone knows who Nintendo is, doesn't mean that they are going to buy their products.

    You wanna know what sells games? People seeing how awesome your games are. There are a plethora of games that I was either on the fence about or didn't even know about like Hollow Knight that I saw someone on Youtube or Twitch playing and then instantly went out and bought it. Word of mouth only gets you so far. If you're providing quality, then allowing people to get a taste of your game through seeing them on a stream will take you the rest of the way. And if there's one thing I and everyone else here knows, it's that Nintendo consistently brings quality content.

  6. #46
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Tziva View Post
    What you're talking about is general brand awareness, which generally isn't a factor for any kind of gaming content on YouTube anyway since people tend to watch content for games they are already familiar with.

    No one is saying that Nintendo content on YouTube benefits Nintendo by making new people aware that Mario is a thing. But it benefits Nintendo because watching that gameplay may inspire people to purchase a game they don't have and are considering. It benefits Nintendo by growing and supporting their fans and the communities built around their games, which encourages brand loyalty among other thing. And it benefits Nintendo because watched and liked videos tend to get shared and it spreads all those other benefits even further.

    There is a reason almost every other developer and/or publisher of video games allows creator content on platforms like Twitch and YouTube. It is because it is beneficial to them. Nintendo might have extremely pervasive brand awareness already but they could absolutely still gain quite a lot from discarding their outdated approach to creator content.
    I think it's more nuanced than to say that streaming always benefits the publisher.

    While its generally true, and Id say almost the case with little known developer's or multiplayer games, it may not necessarily be same for story driven games or platformers.

    A gameplay video on youtube that is interesting has a high chance to lead to a sale, but is it the same for someone who actively follows a streamer and sees him finish a third, half or nearly the complete game? Does he have as much of an urge to buy the game or does he feel no need to because he basically saw someone play a good portionof it already?

    I do agree that it builds the community aspect, but even without streams there is still youtube videos (as mentioned before),reddit, fanboy hype, shitposting and memes and its hard to monetary quantify all these influences.

  7. #47
    Free Food!?!?! Tziva's Avatar
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    Cretaceous Period
    Posts
    22,793
    Quote Originally Posted by Soulslaver View Post
    I think it's more nuanced than to say that streaming always benefits the publisher.

    While its generally true, and Id say almost the case with little known developer's or multiplayer games, it may not necessarily be same for story driven games or platformers.

    A gameplay video on youtube that is interesting has a high chance to lead to a sale, but is it the same for someone who actively follows a streamer and sees him finish a third, half or nearly the complete game? Does he have as much of an urge to buy the game or does he feel no need to because he basically saw someone play a good portionof it already?
    You're totally right that those situations can definitely happen.

    To be clear, I don't mean that every individual stream or video on demand is beneficial. There are obviously specific cases where it might be harmful and in some cases where it might be undesired from a business standpoint (breaking NDAs, spoiling stories, showcasing shitty gameplay, etc). It is more that policies that allow people to stream and create content (whether lets plays or whatever) are overall beneficial to companies in many ways. That doesn't necessarily mean every individual thing that results from that policy is going to be a positive (it certainly won't) but overall you're better off allowing it than forbidding or restricting it.


    for moderation questions/concerns, please contact a global:

    TzivaRadux SimcaElysiaZaelsinoxskarmaVenara

    | twitch | bsky
    |

  8. #48
    Titan
    10+ Year Old Account
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    America's Hat
    Posts
    14,128
    Quote Originally Posted by Poppincaps View Post
    Didn't seem to help them with the Wii U now did it? It sold less than 14 million. That's pathetic. Just because Nintendo is iconic doesn't mean everything they touch is going to turn into gold. In fact Nintendo may be the most well known game company but Sony has crushed them in every single generation since they started with the one exception being the Wii vs PS3 (and the PS3 only lost by 20 million which is nothing when comparing the Gamecube to the PS2).

    Nintendo is certainly the most iconic, but they have never been as successful as Sony outside of the Wii U.
    Oh please, Sony casualized the industry, but Nintendo for a long ass time had the industry by it's claws. The Gameboy sold over 200 million units back when mobile devices weren't a thing. The GBA didn't do as well, but the DS and 3DS have proven that even with a bigger mobile market, there is tons of room for portable gaming systems. Then they became a bunch of wimps who shot themselves in the foot, didn't want to invest in new technology and thus the Playstation was born. They'd probably still be fine had they not gone with another cartridge system. There was no doubt that the N64 was an amazing system, but the cartridges were it's major limitation. But they will always make money on their portable systems, it's long been their saving grace. I just don't see another one with the Switch out though. The Wii U was a casualty of bad timing and a mediocre system that couldn't compete and had no big launch window titles and zero third party support.

  9. #49
    Quote Originally Posted by Rennadrel View Post
    The Gameboy sold over 200 million units back when mobile devices weren't a thing. The GBA didn't do as well, but the DS and 3DS have proven that even with a bigger mobile market
    Not sure what the hell you're talking about but the gameboy did not sell 200 mil. 118 mil(over multiple revisions and a lifespan of over a decade), which isn't even close to your ass pull figure. On top of that the GBA didn't do well but you hype up the 3DS? The GBA outsold the 3DS while only being the primary Nintendo handheld for 3 years. The GBA sold like 80 mil being the primary Nintendo handheld for 3 years while the GB sold 118 mil being the primary Nintendo handheld for a decade. Perspective helps kiddo.

    If you're going to ass pull some data at least be in the ball park. You're 2 cities away from where the game is being played.
    Last edited by Tech614; 2017-10-02 at 09:36 PM.

  10. #50
    Quote Originally Posted by Poppincaps View Post
    No I am making a point that directly contradicts yours. You said that Nintendo doesn't need the advertising because of how iconic they are. The Wii U is proof that that isn't true. Just because everyone knows who Nintendo is, doesn't mean that they are going to buy their products.
    No, the Wii U is proof of something else: bad advertising. The Wii U was not differentiated enough from the Wii in the eyes of the casual market. That is why it did not sell as well.

  11. #51
    Quote Originally Posted by Soulslaver View Post
    I disliked Nintendo the moment they sold rare to microsoft.
    Just imagine banjo kazooie et al on the WII and future consoles..
    They didn't sell Rare. Rares left. Nintendo never owned Rare to begin with, they were just a second party developer who had a deal to only develop for Nintendo.

    And considering the quality of Rares games after they left....I'd say it's a good thing they did, since their series on the Nintendo consoles remain untainted by the crap they put out afterwards.
    There is a thin line between not knowing and not caring, and I like to think that I walk that line every day.

  12. #52
    Hopefully more companies follow suit and stop this virtual panhandling where people pay to watch their "friend" play a video game.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •