The Dragon Aspects never should have been made

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

The Emerald Dream existed because of Ysera, and if the Emerald Dream wouldn't have existed then the Nightmare wouldn't have existed. In the end Ysera was corrupted easily by the Nightmare, a result of her own realm and existance, and then killed off like a rabid dog. Would have been better if she never existed.

The Emerald Dream existed before Ysera was even born, she was charged with watching over it only once she became a aspect. She kept it safe for thousands of years, only time it was really threaten was when she was forced out, Awakened.

And I really wouldn't call a corrupted Pillar of Creation thrown into one's heart "corrupted easily". If she was never there the Nightmare would have spread a lot sooner with a far worse fate.

[JustRob]

But it was easy, wasn't it? All it took was for Xavius to chuck it into her chest, and boom. Corrupted.

[Wildmoon]

It's even hinted that the dream existed in some form before the titans even arrived(the dream of Azeroth herself.). This has nothing to do with Ysera. The nightmare would be far more likely without her guarding it. lul

[Glormon]

Regardless, the Emerald Nightmare might not have existed if Ysera hadn't been empowered. And even if it had, it would have been a lot less effective with no green dragons to corrupt. In the end, the Old Gods claimed two of the five Aspects as their slaves, and that alone is reason enough for their creation to be a mistake.

Untrue, look at the corruption thats happening in Val right now. Thats the entire world without the dragons as well as a number of wild gods.

[Miatog]

Ysera led to the Emerald Nightmare.

No she didn't. Ysera had nothing to do with the Emerald Nightmare.

As for your main point, I actually have to agree. Titan visions are BS. We have two big examples I know of and both of them were self fulfilling. The Dragon Aspects were made to reward the protodrakes that helped Tyr, and to help stop the Hour of Twilight, which ended up happening because of Deathwing. Then there's the vision Wraithion got from the booster shot of Titan power we gave him, and he ended up bringing the Legion to Azeroth while trying to build an army to fight them.

The Titan's are powerful and full of good intentions, but they aren't always the brightest or the wisest.

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

But it was easy, wasn't it? All it took was for Xavius to chuck it into her chest, and boom. Corrupted.

Compare everything else that has been corrupted by the Emerald Nightmare. Wasn't all of them easily corrupted? Just whispers or mind filled with fear turns good people to their side.
Now think of the Tears of Elune. A Pillar of Creation named after Elune herself, so much power contained in that artifact. Now what happens when you corrupt an artifact? It becomes twisted, warped, and more powerful than before.
So you're gonna tell me after Ysera protected the Dream for thousands of years without corruption even getting inside her, being shot in the heart with corrupt powers of a titan, is easy?

[Shelly]

Hindsight is a beautiful thing. If we don't do anything simply because something we did might go wrong...well, I don't have to explain how well that will go.

As for Odyn's action, pardon me if I am mistaken, what's the difference between his Golden Army and the Forsaken? They are both risen from the dead, with the Vrykul actively seeking it due to religious belief preached by Odyn himself (You can call it brainwashing if you want to). One has golden metal body while the other has decaying corpse body.

What else are their difference really?

The difference is one is aspirational and the other is a curse.

Which is actually why the Northrend Vrykul were so easily corrupted. Odyn set up a death cult with himself as the head and when he went away and the Northredn Vrykul were woken from stasis they fell under the sway of the Lich King who basically offered them the same thing - immortality with a new body.

More or less there are two really huge and tragic races in WoW lore. The Vrykul and the Mogu.

They were the two races closest to their makers, built with specific divine purpose and then abandoned. They both became Xenophobic and controlling without the steadying hand of their Titan-construct masters. Northrend Vrykul going into stasis probably in hopes that when they woke up there would be a cure for the Curse of Flesh, southern Vrykul just following Odyn around but eventually splitting into multiple warlike tribes that subjugated the Earthen. (Look up the Prot Paladin artifact quest.)

Meanwhile the Mogu slowly succumbed to the curse of flesh while their keeper was locked away overcoming his injuries. Then finally one sought him out and literally stole the power of Ra for his own use.

Anyway, Odyn offers a new Stormforged body for fallen warriors that will relieve them of the curse of flesh. A benefit only given to the most worthy and passed in a culture that remembers what it once was to be an immortal servant of the closest thing Azeroth has to a god.

The Curse of Undeath however is an insidious infection that takes all and only the strong survive with their minds intact and even then can never be trusted as they have fallen so deeply into shadow that their basic decency and "humanity" no longer exist. (Not sure if they are still there but back prior to Cataclysm you could go to the Undercity and find them keeping uninfected humans as mind controlled slaves.)

[Lochton]

Hmm, the aspects themselves weren't the mistake, the choices of the Titans was.

THOUGH

Odyn's choices were quite flawed too.

[Volardelis]

The Emerald Nightmare was not the fault of Ysera at all. It was all the Old Gods' fault and their minions. She did everything she could do to help.

It was Fandrals fault for having a tree fetish, and thinking that trees could prevent an outbreak of saronite

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Odyn hasn't done anything wrong, comparing loken and odyn is ridiculous.

He has made my warrior do an infinite amount of trials to see if I am "worthy"

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Compare everything else that has been corrupted by the Emerald Nightmare. Wasn't all of them easily corrupted? Just whispers or mind filled with fear turns good people to their side.
Now think of the Tears of Elune. A Pillar of Creation named after Elune herself, so much power contained in that artifact. Now what happens when you corrupt an artifact? It becomes twisted, warped, and more powerful than before.
So you're gonna tell me after Ysera protected the Dream for thousands of years without corruption even getting inside her, being shot in the heart with corrupt powers of a titan, is easy?

Some green dragons were corrupted by the nightmare by having Hakkar's blood pumped inside them.

[Destinas]

Odyn didn't do anything objectively wrong, sure he did some morally fucked shit, but in the end he was right.

He had a hissy fit about dragons being empowered so he folded his arms into his golden throne, making his section of Ulduar fly away. Then he started having Storm Dragons in the Halls of Valor, at the very least making him a total hypocrite. Don't forget that we players have to stop the Tideskorn from corrupting these very dragons several times in Stormheim and the invasion scenario - some do wind up corrupted as well, while others are enslaved by the vrykul of Hrydshal in the service of the Tideskorn anyway.

His actions also led to the corruption of Loken and the partial corruption of the other Keepers. His actions also led to many vrykul spirits being imprisoned within the Halls of Valor because of Helya, while other spirits were damned and tormented for thousands of years in Helheim - which wouldn't have been created if he hadn't been an absolutely horrid father figure to Helya.

Not to mention that he tried to have Sigryn and Torvald killed because they were Skovald's children - had he succeeded then the Tideskorn would have have no claim to the throne, and all of Stormheim would have gone to the Legion. Had Odyn tried to protect them, or at least not sent assassins, then their mother (a devoted shieldmaiden of Eyir, mind you) would still be alive. Torvald wouldn't have succumbed to fel energy and died, and Sigryn wouldn't have had to unleash that corruption as well. The Bonespeakers also may not have worked for Helya, bolstering her forces in the process, if Sigryn had been allowed to confront him sooner. Odyn even allowed Skovald to get his hands on the Aegis of Aggramar in the dungeon (by force), even though the God-King cheated or bruted his way incorrectly through every trial in Stormheim, and besieged the Halls of Valor moments before we went in ourselves.

Almost every decision Odyn has made has been not only morally questionable (at best), but the outright most incorrect decision. All of this could have been avoided if he hadn't been as stubborn and arrogant.

[Deleted]

Odyn was right, the Aspects were a mistake, and one of the biggest flaws in the scheme of the Titans. Alextrasza was subjugated during the Second War, resulting in countless deaths. Nozdormu led to the Infinite Dragonflight. Malygos led to the Nexus War. Ysera led to the Emerald Nightmare. And Neltharion ofcourse led to Deathwing, the most powerful servant of the Old Gods and the reason of many tragedies that otherwise wouldn't have occured.

Only two of them are left, we already know Nozdormu eventually turns into Murozond and we kill him, and Alextrasza will probably become an obstacle we need to kill eventually as well.

The world of Azeroth would have been far better off without them.

As if his valorous idea of using Helya to control soul traffic in shadowlands has not created problems.
Basic problem is that the Keepers were lazy as fuck and tried to do their work with minimal effort.

[Deleted]

Odyn hasn't done anything wrong

You really like to ignore what doesnt fit your narrative. whats next? Garrosh did nothing wrong?.....

[Soulwind]

Odyn did nothing wrong in the same way Sargeras did nothing wrong.

They're technically correct in their strategies, but they're willing to make absolutely everyone else pay the price. Sargeras thinks that destroying everything will prevent the corruption of anything. Odyn thinks that enslaving and cursing his army will make it harder to corrupt.

Odyn and Sargeras are actually so similar, that I was expecting him to join the Legion and sport a green lava beard by the end of this expansion. They both think themselves smarter and more justified than anyone else, they're both willing to sacrifice his kin (but not themselves) and they're both blind to their failures.

The val'kyr aiding the Scourge and the kvaldir raiding the shores of Northrend are a direct result of his actions, but he probably sees those as minor side effects. The Shadowlands probably have some connection with the Void and the Old Gods, and many vrykul of Stormheim are joining the Legion, so he's indirectly helping his enemies, just like the Shattering, caused by the actions of Sargeras, probably helped the Old Gods get closer to corrupting Azeroth.

[Nyel]

The Emerald Nightmare was not the fault of Ysera at all. It was all the Old Gods' fault and their minions. She did everything she could do to help.

Did she? I always felt Ysera is absolutely useless. I really like her character and all of her "surroundings" but I always had the impression that she's weak and useless. And then her horrible story development in Valsharah...

[Skoll Shorties]

They did both good and evil. Without the Dragon Aspects the Well of Eternity would've been vulnerable to the Legion without the protective World Tree in place. Plus the Dragons did more for Azeroth than the Titan Keepers did when we needed them the most during the War of the Ancients. And while it is true they fell to corruption, many good characters to be swayed into evil its the whole thing of World of Warcraft. So no, the Aspects were not a mistake.

[Felfaadaern Darkterror]

None of the races should have been made, for all have sinned and fallen short of the glory.

[Soulwind]

If the Aspects were never made, Odyn would never have left Ulduar and Loken would have had a far harder time getting rid of him, let alone the rest of the Keepers.

If the Void Lords hadn't existed, Sargeras wouldn't have started his burning crusade. It's their fault he chose to kill the Titans, free the demons and start destroying the universe!

[Charge me Doctor]

Tell me one thing Odyn has done objectively wrong that isn't a morally "wrong" thing in the mind of dumb mortals.

he left his brothers when they needed him, dooming the against yogg, to create a pointless army (by royally fucking over shadowlands and life/death equilibrium) that never actually fight. Here, three things

[Pebrocks The Warlock]

Did she? I always felt Ysera is absolutely useless. I really like her character and all of her "surroundings" but I always had the impression that she's weak and useless. And then her horrible story development in Valsharah...

She was called "The Dreamer" because of how long she slept, basically living her entire life in the Emerald Dream. She wasn't useless.

[Raetary]

Ysera led to the nightmare?
What?