What Was the Hardest Raid Boss in WoW History?

[Deleted]

Fun to read you statement considering even full T2 raids had struggling with putting enough DPS/HPS to kill him. How they gonna do it with full blue gear? Jeez mate you delusional...

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Its wasn't broken as people says. The only problem were random spawns of big tentacles in second phase.

And portals always bugging? We had those problems back then

[Queen of Hamsters]

Don't cherry picking. I said in Vanilla's environment - its means old design of specs / combat / importance of consumables and its grind / rare purples / gear wasn't enough to beat bosses etc.

And the mentality of raiders today would still overcome it just fine.

Like I said, back then: stumbling in a dark room. Now: Driven as fuck.

Hardcore modern raiders frequent Classic servers and raid there as a form of vacation.

[Ericdaroude]

you are comparing 2 different games. raiding is the same activity as it used to be , yes, however the logistical circumstances are completely different. there is a reason that nobody was enlightened about things that are natural for us now. this is a fucking retarded discussion.

[Dangg]

I cleared naxx in vanilla. The 4 horsemen (lvl60) is the hardest boss Blizzard ever made, and ever will make by far.
(arguably KT, since he required you to kill 4H aswell.)

4H "required" 8 tanks for most raids - where all prot warrs needed the T3 4set.

*The micro management, having 40 players move correctly, and individually, rotating around the debuffs and/or safe zone, while having tanks,heals and sufficient dps (interrupts and soakers) at the right places for whole duration of the fight.

Not 1 fight later has ever been close the aspect of just organizing how to crack this fight, even if you know the mechanics.

Remember none who killed this in vanilla had any guide or similar, it was a logistical puzzle on "another level" compared to pretty much any other fight.
(KT, Gothik, Lethon, Ouro, Visc and Cthun - was like the only other bosses with such logistical puzzle elements, but all of them far easier than 4H)

There were a lot of bosses which had harsher requirments compwise (spine, Blackhand, KJ) and don't get me started on the flawless execution needed from every player.

[Al Gorefiend]

C'thun or Yogg+0. Yogg+2 broke my guild, can't imagine how anyone managed +0 in current tier

[Nuba]

I honestly really wanted to say Lich King Heroic like many people here because WOTLK was my favorite expansion, but I actually ended up beating him on a pug (A PUG!!) Bailamos made back then at KelThuzad during WOTLK.
I don't think Mythic KJ will ever be beaten by a pug, not at least while Legion lasts, so I'll handle the cake. But design-wise Legion raids (all of them) have been pretty shit so that could have something to do with it.

Also, PvE players weren't really good at handling their toons before maybe wod and legion after massive prunning, so what felt hard for PvE players most of the times was probably because even high end raiders back at TBC/WoTLK didn't even know what half of their spells were used for.

[Netherling]

Everyone keeps saying Vanilla players were bad. The best players in the top guilds (which is pretty much who we're discussing in this thread) were very good players. We (players) didn't have the same tools that are available now. Some things about classes were more basic but others were complicated. Looking back at old videos of players makes them look worse because of the state of the game rather than the state of the players. However, bad players were REALLY bad back then. They could have completely the wrong specs and choose to do completely the wrong spells - you can't really do that these days. Most raiding guilds had those really bad players because there were 40 people. To say that Vanilla raiders are 'Bart Simpson with a slingshot' 'stumbling around the in dark' is not fair. Some definitely were, but the top raiders? No.

[Dsc]

for me, firefighter. ( mimeron hard mode) but that I don't think was the hardest.

I'll tip my hat to 4H C'thun, and latter Lady Vash, I think she was the boss before Kael, after 4H that made a raid team work together to levels not seen.

[McNeil]

I haven't experienced all the bosses myself so I'm just left with baseless assumptions. From what I've fought, heroic Lich King and Ragnaros 25-man were the hardest fights till I stopped raiding after MoP. I've heard from some friends who raided Naxx40 back in classic how hard the original Four Horsemen were, and that they lacked frost resistance gear for Sapphiron so its gotten quite tough. With how most mythic bosses are just filled with a lot of extra random abilities, I wouldn't be surprised if any of them would be the hardest.

[Khallid]

getting critted for 100s of times of your max hp is unthinkable in modern wow.

What are you talking about? Mistress sharks crit for over 500 million damage, which is around 100 times my max HP.

[TheWorkingTitle]

And the mentality of raiders today would still overcome it just fine.

Like I said, back then: stumbling in a dark room. Now: Driven as fuck.

Hardcore modern raiders frequent Classic servers and raid there as a form of vacation.

One of the most ignorant statements I've ever seen on this forum. The amount of consumable farming and buff stacking (read: time investment) that was required of us to kill the hardest bosses during progression in AQ40/Naxx 40 rival, if not surpass, anything done today.

It's always Wrath babies or later that comment retarded shit like this lol.

OT: 4 Horseman, Viscidus as Alliance, Loatheb, KT, Muru, and 25m H LK are the hardest raid bosses ever.

[epLe]

There are so many factors that add up to making the vanilla bosses harder than later.

40man raids, consumables (ony/hakkar buffs), Gearing processes, Coins, catch-up gear, WF/TF, loot pr kills, AddOns, public guides, sims, just how hard it is to play a character sufficiently... This goes on and on...

I'd like to see someone who actually did raid aswell back then, argue how the whole package can be "harder" to achieve nowadays.

There were a lot of bosses which had harsher requirments compwise (spine, Blackhand, KJ) and don't get me started on the flawless execution needed from every player.

Well 4h was all about execution and composition, doing that with 40 people is way harder than 20. You make absolutely no sense.

And the mentality of raiders today would still overcome it just fine.

Like I said, back then: stumbling in a dark room. Now: Driven as fuck.

I know you're just trolling but...
General mentality of raiders today = "I need to see someone do it on youtube before I understand a shait" and "I deserve BiS and legendaries now."
Their mentality is exactly the reason we have RNG legendaries and "welfare epics" making "raiding" an incredibly easy thing to do.

[Dangg]

There are so many factors that add up to making the vanilla bosses harder than later.

40man raids, consumables (ony/hakkar buffs), Gearing processes, Coins, catch-up gear, WF/TF, loot pr kills, AddOns, public guides, sims, just how hard it is to play a character sufficiently... This goes on and on...

I'd like to see someone who actually did raid aswell back then, argue how the whole package can be "harder" to achieve nowadays.


Well 4h was all about execution and composition, doing that with 40 people is way harder than 20. You make absolutely no sense.




I know you're just trolling but...
General mentality of raiders today = "I need to see someone do it on youtube before I understand a shait" and "I deserve BiS and legendaries now."
Their mentality is exactly the reason we have RNG legendaries and "welfare epics" making "raiding" an incredibly easy thing to do.

Do you even know watch a post BC bossfight looks like? Watch KJ, Archimonde, Ragnaros. You can't serious have that opinion than 4HM required better execution.

[Alvarado]

That's easy, Naxx 40man Kel'thuzad or 4 horsemen.

[Toogoodman]

Fun to read you statement considering even full T2 raids had struggling with putting enough DPS/HPS to kill him. How they gonna do it with full blue gear? Jeez mate you delusional...

Fun fact for you, but most classes, besides warrior tanks, could actually parse better numbers in blues and dungeon gear due to how shitty T1 & T2 were. No hit, mostly white stats, and his statement is actually fairly true. Rogues, locks, mages, and fury warriors could get a far better set of gear with 80% dungeon gear going into AQ, the biggest exception being weapons, and BWL trinkets, and the occasional piece of decent tier gear, like T2 rogue chest.

[Icedcoffeee]

Probably not the hardest, but I'll throw Paragons of the Klaxxi (25H) out there anyways. I'm pretty sure that fight had the most mechanics of any fight ever in the game, and most were punishing if screwed up. Required our whole raid to be in a zen trance to do it right.

Or, Garalon LFR. Because you could never keep everyone out from under the boss.

[Jastall]

One of the most ignorant statements I've ever seen on this forum. The amount of consumable farming and buff stacking (read: time investment) that was required of us to kill the hardest bosses during progression in AQ40/Naxx 40 rival, if not surpass, anything done today.

It's always Wrath babies or later that comment retarded shit like this lol.

OT: 4 Horseman, Viscidus as Alliance, Loatheb, KT, Muru, and 25m H LK are the hardest raid bosses ever.

I don't consider buff and consumable farming difficulty, just like I don't consider AP farming or maintaining 4-5 raid ready alts (for top players) difficulty. It's just tedious maintenance that you have to do. Difficulty begins on the pull and ends when the fight ends, with the exception of the ever present roster boss perhaps.

There's a reason the raiding paradigm has changed. It's much more fun and involving for most players to focus on performance and mechanics than on farming resist gear and getting 2 measly pieces of loot per boss.

On topic, I'm pretty sure Method said Mythic KJ was the hardest boss they ever did (with the wipe counter supporting their claim and then some) so I'll take them at their word. They're much greater experts on the subject than anyone here.

[Deleted]

Mythic KJ, by far.

[Puupi]

Hardest bosses I have killed when they were relevant (like world top 100 speed) have been Twins in Sunwell, M'uru in Sunwell and Sha of Fear 10man in Terrace.

[Xjev]

For me personally KT (Tempest Keep), I did not do any serious high-end cutting edge content after though.