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  1. #81
    Stood in the Fire Arvei's Avatar
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    "Use your brain" says the flat-earther. Lots of comedic value in this thread!

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by Hammerfest View Post
    That wasn't his message. Use your brain.
    That was his message. very clearly. See, I'm not interested in bending myself into a pretzel like you have to to make his statements seem normal or benign.

    You should refrain from commenting on brain activity. It's a tough sell for you.

  3. #83
    Banned GennGreymane's Avatar
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  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Sulla View Post
    The point of the comment is that Puerto Rico was a shambling mess that refused to take care of their own problems BEFORE the hurricane hit. They deserve the help they need, but they are also going to have to get their own shit together because this isn't the big bailout they're expecting.
    A shambling mess... created by our government, the fixing of which is only in our government's hands, because Puerto Rico is denied the power to create or change important economic legislation by virtue of their bizarro land status. If anything, Republicans should be putting all of their spin to work to show Puerto Rico as the poster child of what happens when local government is superseded by federal government, but instead, they're too busy using it to back up idiotic things said by Donald Trump.

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Moshots View Post
    Acknowledging the importance of the question of Puerto Rican status, Truman supported a plebiscite in Puerto Rico in 1952 on the new constitution, to determine the status of the island's relationship to the U.S.[45] The people voted by nearly 82% in favor of the new constitution and Free Associated State, or Commonwealth.

    So while Hawai and Alasksa were begging to get in 82% of PR's voted for a self ran government with US control.
    You are grossly misinformed as to what that vote was about, since it sure as hell wasn't to make Puerto Rico a state. Literally all they were doing was voting on whether or not to accept the constitution that Congress had allowed Puerto Rican leaders to draft. The alternative wouldn't have been statehood, it would have been direct US rule without any Puerto Rican constitution at all. Statehood was never even on the table (nor, for the record, was complete independence).

    then 1998

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerto...ferendum,_1998

    still 50% to stay the same....
    That wasn't a binding vote, it was a glorified opinion poll for which there was a sizable movement to vote "none of the above" because they were dissatisfied with the way the options on the ballot were worded.

    Then 2012 a decade or so after clinton cut the tax breaks for companies that put their homes in PR causing mass exodus of companies from PR.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerto...ferendum,_2012 Is the first time they voted for statehood.... As their country was already amassing massive debt and hadn't broken even one year since Clinton's subsidies cut.
    Again, not actually voting for statehood. Glorified opinion poll for which there is little evidence Congress had any intention of really paying much attention to in the first place. Most Puerto Ricans didn't even fill out their ballots, but of those who did just over half wanted to become a state.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by DarkTZeratul View Post
    You are grossly misinformed as to what that vote was about, since it sure as hell wasn't to make Puerto Rico a state. Literally all they were doing was voting on whether or not to accept the constitution that Congress had allowed Puerto Rican leaders to draft. The alternative wouldn't have been statehood, it would have been direct US rule without any Puerto Rican constitution at all. Statehood was never even on the table (nor, for the record, was complete independence).

    That wasn't a binding vote, it was a glorified opinion poll for which there was a sizable movement to vote "none of the above" because they were dissatisfied with the way the options on the ballot were worded.

    Again, not actually voting for statehood. Glorified opinion poll for which there is little evidence Congress had any intention of really paying much attention to in the first place. Most Puerto Ricans didn't even fill out their ballots, but of those who did just over half wanted to become a state.
    It was a Referendum vote IE the same vote as Brexit.. So calling This a glorified popularity contest then what is Brexit??????? It was a vote to push the goverment to have something to show congress.

    However as I stated It doesn't really matter what PR wants because to be fully honest right now it would be dumb for the US to get involved and make PR a state just to have to bail them out of 70 Billion dollars of debt or Have them go bancrupt and hurt the US standing internationally. No way Congress would allow PR to become a state or even touch voting on it... as its political suicide to ask tax payers to pay out 70 billion dollars to add a new state that is financially a disaster to begin with.
    Last edited by Moshots; 2017-10-13 at 09:08 AM.

  7. #87
    The Insane Acidbaron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moshots View Post
    PR had it chance to become a state and they wanted to stay independent and voted for it multiple times over the last 100 years... When we were taking states in the 50's they still voted to stay independent.... until now they are in crippling debt and have had natural disasters and now they want to act like were the bad guys for not making them a state when 2012 is the first time they even asked to become a state and that was only after they had already amassed 60 Billion in debt over the last 10 years since Clinton cut them off and stopped subsidizing business to PR..
    Besides the errors in this post, the best part is how it confirms what i just said. It is not about how much money a part of your land brings you it's about being a strong and proud enough nation to care about all your subjects and act correctly towards them.

    The richest nation in the world making excuses like this to aid others makes you simply come across not so rich and fairly weak.

  8. #88
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    FEMA can't stay in Puerto Rico forever, that's true, but how about FEMA stays in that part of the United States of America until they've helped all the American citizens there to stay alive and continue their lives? That seems like a great time limit.

  9. #89
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sydänyö View Post
    FEMA can't stay in Puerto Rico forever, that's true, but how about FEMA stays in that part of the United States of America until they've helped all the American citizens there to stay alive and continue their lives? That seems like a great time limit.
    Oddly enough, that's what FEMA has said. It's literally only Trump who's suggested this is their fault, that there are obstacles, that it would be unfair for trade, etc. Only Trump has suggested leaving before the job is done, to the point that the White House had to What He Meant Was.

    Problem is, only Trump is in charge of FEMA. Only his opinion matters. And he's laying the groundwork for a premature exit.

  10. #90
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moshots View Post
    It was a Referendum vote IE the same vote as Brexit.. So calling This a glorified popularity contest then what is Brexit???????
    A glorified popularity contest.

    Answered your own question there, mate.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  11. #91
    Twitter has the best term for how the Alt-Right thinks of Puerto Rico:

    "Sea Mexicans".


    Replace every instance of "Puerto Ricans" when MMO-OT's Alt Right loser brigade says it with "Sea Mexicans" and their obvious position becomes even more obvious.

  12. #92
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Skroe View Post
    Twitter has the best term for how the Alt-Right thinks of Puerto Rico:

    "Sea Mexicans".


    Replace every instance of "Puerto Ricans" when MMO-OT's Alt Right loser brigade says it with "Sea Mexicans" and their obvious position becomes even more obvious.
    Its also why they hate Trudeau, damn snow mexican.

  13. #93
    Quote Originally Posted by Skroe View Post
    Twitter has the best term for how the Alt-Right thinks of Puerto Rico:

    "Sea Mexicans".


    Replace every instance of "Puerto Ricans" when MMO-OT's Alt Right loser brigade says it with "Sea Mexicans" and their obvious position becomes even more obvious.
    Well they are brown and to the dumb fuck Trump supporters if you are brown you must be Mexican and that in turn makes you Illegals. In fact Trump should pull out FEMA right now and send in his best man Arpaio to arrest all of them.

  14. #94
    Quote Originally Posted by Acidbaron View Post
    Besides the errors in this post, the best part is how it confirms what i just said. It is not about how much money a part of your land brings you it's about being a strong and proud enough nation to care about all your subjects and act correctly towards them.

    The richest nation in the world making excuses like this to aid others makes you simply come across not so rich and fairly weak.
    Its about not hurting the 50 states to add a 51st...... You want to cut funding to the other 50 states to fund a bancrupt 51st state??? Thats how you lose your job as a congressman voting for that... Because i'm not gonna vote for a congressman that is fine with having our school funding and our state medicaid funding and other shit cut because there is now 51 pieces of pie instead of 50... PR is a financial disaster (OF THEIR OWN MAKING) that would hurt the funding of many states that already don't get enough funding... Even democrat congressman would see that and the vote wouldn't even be close.... Sorry but money is how this country works you only have so much and more people get hurt in the process if you just spread it too thin...
    Last edited by Moshots; 2017-10-13 at 05:44 PM.

  15. #95
    Quote Originally Posted by Moshots View Post
    Even the democrats arn't that stupid... Taking on PR right now with their financial crisis just to allow them to go bankrupt would send shockwaves through the international community... Not to mention run up the national debt even more because alot of what they owe is to us.

    Also of note
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puerto...nt-debt_crisis

    Clinton was the one who passed tax laws that basically stopped us covering PR's ass with subsidies in the mid 90's... Following that logic I'd assume the democrats would be just as happy as the republicans to have PR go fully independent and not become a state however PR in the last 20 years has gone from having Majority wanting Independence to having a near unanimous Alebeit contested 2012 vote (97% wanting statehood) after the US stopped paying the bills and PR realized they couldn't pretty much.

    not the mention The way I read it the US would have been fine with PR trying to become a state in the 40's and 50's when we were helping them form their own goverment/ect (REMEMBER Alaska and Hawai became the 49th and 50th state in Jan and August 1959 so Congress was open to adding states at that time).... but they voted against attempting to become a state multiple times and voted for independence which we allowed it in a small way without giving up our place at the table... Now that the shoe is on the other foot and they have realized that once we started to give them more independence they have failed to run their own "country" and now they are basically begging to come back home after maxing out all their credit cards and getting kicked out of their apartment.


    EDIT also to add if you want to get political yes the Republicans would also never allow it in today's current political climate due to the fact that according to what ive read 5 congressional seats and 7 electorial votes would be added given the population size and the odds are given the demographic of PR would mean 5 almost guaranteed Democratic seats in Congress and all but guarantee the presidency to democrats. But even with this said Financially its a shitshow so Its pretty much bipartisan at this point.
    Allow PR to declare bankruptcy before joining and pay pennies on the dollar, you will forgive me for not shedding a tear watching Wall Street vulture capitalists who piled up on the island due to its arcane laws get screwed.

  16. #96
    Void Lord Elegiac's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moshots View Post
    Its about not hurting the 50 states to add a 51st...... You want to cut funding to the other 50 states to fund a bancrupt 51st state??? Thats how you lose your job as a congressman voting for that... Because i'm not gonna vote for a congressman that is fine with having our school funding and our state medicaid funding and other shit cut because there is now 51 pieces of pie instead of 50... PR is a financial disaster (OF THEIR OWN MAKING) that would hurt the funding of many states that already don't get enough funding... Even democrat congressman would see that and the vote wouldn't even be close.... Sorry but money is how this country works you only have so much and more people get hurt in the process if you just spread it too thin...
    Why not? We already fund several bankrupt states. What harm is another one gonna do? Lol.
    Quote Originally Posted by Marjane Satrapi
    The world is not divided between East and West. You are American, I am Iranian, we don't know each other, but we talk and understand each other perfectly. The difference between you and your government is much bigger than the difference between you and me. And the difference between me and my government is much bigger than the difference between me and you. And our governments are very much the same.

  17. #97
    The Undying Breccia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Didactic View Post
    Why not? We already fund several bankrupt states. What harm is another one gonna do? Lol.
    I can't speak for "bankrupt" but there are ten states that owe more money than Puerto Rico.

    These include Texas and Florida. Louisiana owes about half what PR does. And we sent everything we had, with or without concerns with "big water ocean water", immediately, and haven't talked about their debt once until Trump said something stupid about why he wasn't helping his fellow Americans.

    That guy should totally talk to the President of the Virgin Islands. That might straighten things out.

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