Poll: Do you agree?

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  1. #401
    I think you just got bored of it...

  2. #402
    Quote Originally Posted by caervek View Post
    More quests, more dungeons (and reasons to do them) more raids, etc. There was generally just more game, of course you could get to the point where you just log on to raid but it took longer than in WoD/Legion.
    Yeah more raids(1), and for me as well, raiding was better back then. For me. Let me point that out. I was a hardcore raider back then so I had a blast. I also miss those 1 to 2 small raid-dungeons. ToV is close of course to compare it with, but those small ones are cool. But content is more than just raids.

    16 dungeons in TBC, and 12 in Legion. The relevancy for dungeons back then was restricted to badges and rep. Wich for some classes gave raid-relevant gear, and for others not so much. A decent catch-up mechanic. But we had that in WoD too(in the end). Current we have mythic and mythic+ dungeons wich scales with current content all the time. Wich has barely no restrictions at all.

    Quests. Well, quests are quests. Leveling quests etc, its the same in Legion. You were restricted to 25 dailies back then, now you can do as many WQs(dailies) as you want. These days dailies even give gear, wich can forge up and help people who maybe doesn't raid heroic/mythic, or even dungeons. Not more content maybe, but this content is more relevant through the whole expansion and for more players.

    If you compare to actual content comparing TBC/WotLK to Legion gives some similarities, we got more in Legion than TBC/WotLK though. We got Class hall(including all relevant to it, class mounts, wich the questline sucked btw, missions etc) artifact weapon progression(questlines etc). Class campaign and Artifact weapon was actually pretty huge the first 6-8 months of Legion. Now you get all instantly so the content there is pretty much negligible. That's what you get because of people who yell ALT-UNFRIENDLY. Suramar have this whole zone worth of content, a major questline. But you can compare it to the attunements to Black Temple etc. I won't say that is new content. It's new, but we had that kind of relevancy before.

    What I react more to is that you take WoD and Legion into one. Objectively WoD had alot less content than both TBC, WotLK AND Legion. Remember there was no reason to do dungeons in WoD endgame than Challenge mode. Until they added valor points in. Wich was a desperate move to provide some sort of "content".

    I loved TBC, its the best expansion by far, for me. Because I was privileged enough to do the actual endgame raid content. And WoW was still new. And if WoW is ever gonna be ruined, that will be the reason. It's actually pretty old.
    Last edited by Doffen; 2017-10-17 at 01:38 PM.

  3. #403
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Chemii View Post
    I'm not whining, I'm responding to the post about TOC being the first bad part of the game, you seem to be off on a tangent talking about how amazing the story was in wrath.

    Nothing you've said makes any sense, Ulduar was very difficult, yet everyone says it's the best raid ever made. Make your mind up.
    Next time you respond to point about ToC, make sure to respond to a post about ToC. If you go off topic the moment you click 'respond', it's small wonder you end up dazed and confused and go off a tangent. Checking (by, hold your breath... READING) which part of your post was I responding to, might also spare you some tangential babbling and confusion on your part.

  4. #404
    Deleted
    The playerbase.

  5. #405
    Deleted
    WoW will never be good again. Just unsubscribe and get a life.

  6. #406
    Quote Originally Posted by HuxNeva View Post
    You are partly right. As raiding is a team activity, you agree on times just the same as you would for a sports match, or even meeting at the pub. You are also partly wrong. Many N/HC guilds will not 'pressure', have orders and goals, or have your raid spot up for grabs. That is the beauty of flex raids. Don't confuse world first contender raid stories with the casual friends and family guilds. The differences are as great as as they are between the Sunday morning village pub cycling tour and the 'tour the France', or your local's indoor soccer game and the World Cup. Sad thing is that I see so many (justified) complaints here on MMOC about 'community' that are easily solved by joining a nice guild.
    I do agree, and i think flex raiding would have been exactly what the game would have needed to pump up raiding participation rates, before they inroduced LFD and streamlined leveling.

    I just read this post in WoW EU general forums "Why push casuals into raiding?" created by Laforge, which reflects my PoV and also answers the question asked on this thread:

    -----------------

    ""Blizzard figured out that casual players are a majority. And it's like they designed everything in game just to push people into the latest raid, making it as easy as possible to get there, nerfing everything that made WoW a cool game on the way.

    This is the wrong approach. Most casuals players, including me, and all those millions of older vanilla players that do not play anymore, or play with long breaks - are not into raiding, because we don't have time for that. If you don't raid seriously - it's not fun, meaning that creating an easy mode raiding - is pointless. I am not interested in that.

    I don't raid. Why nerf the game and make it easy, and in fact eliminate the fun in the game outside of raids, thinking that easy leveling and easy raiding will somehow keep casuals in the game? It's totally the wrong approach. Casuals are not players not looking for a challenge, just players with less time to play - and players that don't want another schedule to keep(raiding) in their life. Casual content is content that you can do whenever you log in, with no schedule, it's not and should not be "easy content".

    So: stop removing and put back in the game all legendary questlines (without any rewards or achievements), all attunements, and the keyring. It's stuff to do, stories to read why remove them?
    Make leveling hard by adding zones with ranged mobs, patrols, mobs in packs, etc. A good example of a "hard zone": the old Jaedenar in Felwood. Plaguelands, etc.""

    -----------------

    This is - in a nutshell - what ruined WoW for me.

  7. #407
    Quote Originally Posted by Echoherb View Post
    It's not ruined, it just has a bad community since so many play it and there are a lot of shitty whiny people in the world.
    Sorry to break it to you but the community has been shitty for 13 years. Was it less shitty in 2004? Yes little a bit but there was still fuckheads everywhere

  8. #408
    Quote Originally Posted by Chrisxor View Post
    Sorry to break it to you but the community has been shitty for 13 years. Was it less shitty in 2004? Yes little a bit but there was still fuckheads everywhere
    Well yeah, and it's always been a popular game. Any game with millions of people playing is going to inevitably have a shitty community because there's a higher percentage of idiots.

  9. #409
    Blizzard has somehow convinced people that repeating the same raid 3-4 times, the same dungeon 10-15 times and the same world quest 50-100 times is good and that is how things should be...

    Everything about this game screams that Blizzard is trying to cheat the players by artificially inflating play time by repetition, instead of creating original and new things for the players to do. And somehow they have convinced people that they can't release patches or expansions faster, regardless of the fact that they have earned $2.4 billion in revenue in 2016...

  10. #410
    Bloodsail Admiral Chemii's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hambanner View Post
    Next time you respond to point about ToC, make sure to respond to a post about ToC. If you go off topic the moment you click 'respond', it's small wonder you end up dazed and confused and go off a tangent. Checking (by, hold your breath... READING) which part of your post was I responding to, might also spare you some tangential babbling and confusion on your part.
    /facepalm

  11. #411
    Free epics. In Legion everyone have full epic gear.

  12. #412
    Deleted
    Meanwhile OP didnt respond for once...

    80% of people who agreed, are ingame now. Last 20% are people who are here for no reason(mostly lack of IRL content).

    MMO Chernobyl.

  13. #413
    Herald of the Titans Dangg's Avatar
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    'dungeons were hard'

    when were dungeons harder than they are now? there's a lot of stuff wrong with current WoW, why does this guy have to make up lies?

  14. #414
    The Unstoppable Force Super Kami Dende's Avatar
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    Nothing ruined WoW. But the community is trying its fucking hardest these days.

  15. #415
    Quote Originally Posted by deniter View Post
    I do agree, and i think flex raiding would have been exactly what the game would have needed to pump up raiding participation rates, before they inroduced LFD and streamlined leveling.

    I just read this post in WoW EU general forums "Why push casuals into raiding?" created by Laforge, which reflects my PoV and also answers the question asked on this thread:

    -----------------

    snip

    -----------------

    This is - in a nutshell - what ruined WoW for me.
    I hear you. I do believe that Legion is a step in that direction. At-least 'endgame' does no longer mean raid-or-die. As for (non-repeat, call them daily or WQ) questing, unless they start using machine generated content (they will, if not next expansion then the one after for 'side' zones/quests, and later on you will see real 'story-line' quest and zones all written and worked out by machine), you will always consume it faster than they can make it. So either they put in time-gating (ugh!), or it is very finite.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Darth Dracula View Post
    Nothing ruined WoW. But the community is trying its fucking hardest these days.
    'The community' is a product of its environment. Given a 'no consequences anonymous setting', a substantial enough percentage of people turn to assholism, always, not just in WoW, or games, but everywhere. So with CR and open for all queuing, Blizzard created just such a setting. And the only way to escape it is through banding together and ousting the assholes, aka Guilds.

  16. #416
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by HuxNeva View Post
    I hear you. I do believe that Legion is a step in that direction. At-least 'endgame' does no longer mean raid-or-die. As for (non-repeat, call them daily or WQ) questing, unless they start using machine generated content (they will, if not next expansion then the one after for 'side' zones/quests, and later on you will see real 'story-line' quest and zones all written and worked out by machine), you will always consume it faster than they can make it. So either they put in time-gating (ugh!), or it is very finite.

    - - - Updated - - -



    'The community' is a product of its environment. Given a 'no consequences anonymous setting', a substantial enough percentage of people turn to assholism, always, not just in WoW, or games, but everywhere. So with CR and open for all queuing, Blizzard created just such a setting. And the only way to escape it is through banding together and ousting the assholes, aka Guilds.
    Blizz mistake:
    They give a microphone to every single incompetent idiot out there.

    I swear to god, if i had the power, I would had banned these imbeciles, who are obviously whining, just for the sake of it. Worst of it, they are most likely still ingame. They are contributing with nothing but negativity.

    Correct, the enviourment is there. Every toxic thread, creates another. We don't see contructive threads anymore.
    Last edited by mmocd6fe3ee806; 2017-10-17 at 02:22 PM.

  17. #417
    Deleted
    Legion ruined WoW! Imo atleast

  18. #418
    Oh look a thread posted by someone who clearly hates WoW but is too much of a jaded shrill that they have to post about how much they hate WoW and how much it sucks compared to "insert past expansion here."

    Honestly Legion is great. Few flaws, lots of engaging content, all the specs feel unique to one another, plenty of new story elements, what else do you want?

    I WANT WOW TO BE HARD LIKE VANILLA.

    Vanilla wasn't hard mechanically, it was hard because you had to grind PvP nonstop to be relevant, framerates in 40m raids were dogshit and the game was so min/max that if you did anything other than the optimal strat for a fight you got punished. "Let's farm mats to raid Naxx and get destroyed because there's no gear drops that remotely prepare you for how insanely overtuned Naxx is compared to BWL. That'll be fun" -said noone ever.

    WoW is great. Best it's been in years. Sure it's different, I'm glad it's not the same game it was a decade ago. It's much more friendly to people with busy schedules and still rewarding for people who grind all day. What more do you want?

  19. #419
    The Unstoppable Force Ielenia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ron Burgundy View Post
    dungeons were hard
    Dungeons can be hard. High-level mythic+ dungeons are hard. However, if by 'hard' you mean 'stop every trash mob for the healer to drink mana and coordinate crowd-control, inevitably making the dungeon last much longer than it should', then... that's not really hard. Just time-consuming. "Yeah, but if you rushed them without CC or waiting for mana, it was very hard!" Well, welcome to Mythic+.

    leveling was part of the experience (and not a 3 day chore to endgame)
    In my 10+ years playing the game I haven't met a single person that has ever considered 'leveling' to be a 'part of the experience' after going through it once or twice. After you level your first couple characters ever (to go through all routes), then it becomes just a chore, that thankfully was made shorter and shorter as time went on.

    The way I see this, it's is like having your friends live on the top of a tall apartment building, and the stairs are decorated with every interesting pictures. It's interesting to go through it the first time to see the pictures, but after the first time, I'd much rather take the elevator to get to my friends at the top of the building.

    community was king
    Was it? I'm pretty sure this is rose-tinted glasses speaking. And as much people hate to feel their opinions being dismissed by 'nostalgia', it doesn't change the fact that people tend to remember the good times, sometimes even unconsciously exaggerating said memories, while at the same downplay, and some times even forget, the bad times.

    and inconvenience just lead to good memories.
    As far as I can tell, inconvenience only led to inconvenience. However, if the argument is that, by sharing your inconveniences with other people, you bonded with them, then... that's kind of a meaningless argument, as you can still bond with other people in the game. Seems to me the poster just lacks the motivation to do it on their own, instead of having it being forced on them.

    The sad state of MMORPGS really. I cross my fingers that we see what Dark Souls did to to the action adventure genre in MMO land. Bring back the difficulty, remove the hand holding, and let you experience the world again instead of chase after mindless quest markers doing piss easy content."
    "Dark Souls" is a niche game. MMOs, on the other hand, have to appeal to as many people as possible to be able to stay afloat, as they require a much more constant maintenance than single-player games like Dark Souls.

    Do you agree?
    Nope.
    "Torturing someone is not an evil thing to do if it is done for good reasons" by Varodoc
    "You sit in OG/SW waiting on a Mythic+ queue" by Altmer <- Oh, the pearls in this forum...
    "They sort of did this Dragonriding, which ushered in the Dracthyr race." by Teriz <- the BS some people reach for their narratives...

  20. #420
    Deleted
    time ruined wow..

    more expansions wow has, the more disconnected and confusing it becomes....

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