New Class Prediction: Necromancer

[Wildberry]

Name 1... ONE FCKING NECROMANCER. Now that you throw me wall of text and being so confident.

Go.

Aren't you that wonderfully intelligent poster claiming UnhDKs are ranged? Lol. What are you looking for, though? "Name 1... ONE FCKING NECROMANCER." What does that mean, because it really shouldn't be terribly hard to give an answer if you'd bother specifying.

to make a necro really different than a dk they need to rely heavily on pets on a level completely different than the usual 20% damage done by the regular standard pets BM, Demo, Unholy DK and Frost mage have; now do you really think they would make a class that go around with 10 permanent pets and could summon even more like the rathma necro we see in d3 and before it d2?

Who says the pets have to be permanent. You can have minion interaction without making them permanent. Either way, what does any of that have to do with making them a Warlock spec, rather than a new class.

Necro is a fantastic class and one of the basic fantasy one but for balance reason is hardly ever implemented into mmos because devs dreads pets, i would love to play one but i fear the final result would be just a reskinned affliction warlock with a strong pet skeleton.

If you're worried about it becoming a reskinned Afflock, just read the thread. There's plenty of completely untouched design space to differentiate things thematically and mechanically. Beyond that, since when has the game been balanced? Would a Necromancer be hard to balance? Sure. Are the braindead devs at Blizzard capable of balancing things anyway? Nope.

[Deleted]

Holy Paladin make sense despite Priests covering the entire theme of holy healing. Warlocks had Metamorphosis and Rogues could wield Warglaives of Azzinoth, but it still made sense to add Demon Hunters.

Unholy DK can also have its mechanics and abilities changed to have a Necro fit. It's not like it's never happened before; Unholy DK was a a completely different beast in Wrath compared to what it looks like today. A Necro can also have more focus on other types of undead that the DK doesn't already cover, similar to how Paladins focus on different elements of Holy magic that a Priest doesn't use (Angels vs generic Spirit Healer).

Necromancers do not need to be undead themselves either, which already differentiates themselves greatly from DK's who originate as champions of the scourge. We'd get a different perspective from playing a character that controls undead from the outside rather than controlling them through innate powers granted by the Lich King. A Necromancer isn't a commander of an army the way a Death Knight is. They're puppetmasters who overwhelm opponents and fight with attrition, similar to Warlocks but with a lot more subtlety.

Saying things like 'it doesn't make sense' only shows that it doesn't make sense for you. The Necromancer archetype has existed in Warcraft since the first game, and has worked in tandem with Death Knights in the exact same way Priests and Paladins existed in the RTS and in WoW; and now the Warlock and Demon Hunter. There's literally no difference in how these classes overlap in themes and mechanics.

Alright, so we are confident enough to throw another person wall of text, desperatly trying to justify reasonings.

"Because the magi's arcane mysteries are necromantic mysteries (the mysteries of life and death), it can be stated that the magi's arcane magic is necromantic: If necromancy is a school of (or from) arcane magic, arcane magic is a magic that relates to necromancy and is therefore necromantic: of, from, or relating to, necromancy (or necromancers)."

"Warlocks, the equivalent to mages,[8] are magical practitioners who seek to understand darker, fel-based magics, including destructive spells.[9] According to the liar known as Justin Parker, warlocks have overlapping abilities with necromancers but pursue a discipline different from them.[10] However, if warlocks have necromantic abilities (the abilities of necromancers) and practice necromancy, they are necromancers (practitioners of necromancy). If (key word: if) warlocks aren't necromancers and pursue a discipline different from necromancers, this "different discipline" has yet to be revealed."

Revealed=The D2/3 necromancer does NOT exist in this universe. And if it would, it would be a Warlock spec.

"How do warlocks know how to raise the dead and do they control the dead? By their very nature, demons are leeches on the living universe—but the demonologist has mastered harnessing the power of these malefic beings on the field of battle. Warlocks harvest the souls of their defeated enemies ; those specialized in the ways of demonology use this life essence to tap into the Void, pulling all manner of abomination from the chaos of the Twisting Nether. While such a practice is often considered by outsiders to be wicked and reckless, the demonologist maintains absolute control over the summoned creatures. These malignant entities are fully beholden to—and empowered by—the will of the warlock, until banished to the realm from whence they came."

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Necromancer

As you can see, the Necromancer will NEVER happend.

Warlocks are OFFICALLY the Necromancers(im not even mentioning the UH DK with thier overlapping abilities).

[Wildberry]

I mean, I can handle this. Gothik the Harvester? Heigan the Unclean? The guy in the DK Order Hall who summons the Ghouls/Geists for you?

Oh, he meant living Necromancer? Yeah, that's easy @Strifeload: Kel'Thuzad before he became a Lich. Duh! I suppose I should've been able to figure it was a question like that considering Strife's the same guy arguing that Unholy Death Knights are actually a ranged spec.

- - - Updated - - -

LOLING OUT LOUD AT NERDS CITING WOWWIKI IN 2017 SMHSMHSMH!!!!

That's literally not an argument, and the fact that you feel triumphant for posting that is just sad really.

[Deleted]

Oh, he meant living Necromancer? Yeah, that's easy @Strifeload: Kel'Thuzad before he became a Lich. Duh! I suppose I should've been able to figure it was a question like that considering Strife's the same guy arguing that Unholy Death Knights are actually a ranged spec.

- - - Updated - - -


That's literally not an argument, and the fact that you feel triumphant for posting that is just sad really.

1)Kel'Thuzad was a Mage before he died.
2)LK summoned him as Lich.

Lich:
A lich is a powerful undead sorcerer who possesses tremendous magical power.

He is literaly cloth version of a Frost DK(you even have the iconic Lich spell that bounces from target to taget as Frost DK).

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Lich

Sit down boy. Read some more.

[Doomchicken]

Still better than tinkers

[Deleted]

I mean, I can handle this. Gothik the Harvester? Heigan the Unclean? The guy in the DK Order Hall who summons the Ghouls/Geists for you?

Any Lich prior to and after their death?

(That would be a really interesting Necromancer talent/ability, to become a Lich temporarily on death)

If wearing cloth over plate makes it a Necromancer, than yes. You are right.

All these could be UH DK, with a twist of NPC characteristics.

[Darkhallows]

If wearing cloth over plate makes it a Necromancer, than yes. You are right.

All these could be UH DK, with a twist of NPC characteristics.

No? Unholy DKs summon the Undead but they are *Knights* by classification. Who fight up-close with melee weapons and strikes. Unholy's main mechanics involve festering wounds, bursting them with other melee skills, and empowering your minion.

All of this can be kept intact while making Necromancers fit their own niche and take everything that was removed from DKs over time. (Dark Pact anyone?) Another central element of Death Knights is rune weaponry and runeforging, another thing Necros don't have any connection to.

Necromancers would do *none* of that.

[Wildberry]

1)Kel'Thuzad was a Mage before he died.
2)LK summoned him as Lich.

Lich:
A lich is a powerful undead sorcerer who possesses tremendous magical power.

He is literaly cloth version of a Frost DK(you even have the iconic Lich spell that bounces from target to taget as Frost DK).

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Lich

Sit down boy. Read some more.

You're still linking to Wowwiki, are you?

Arthas and Jaina refer to a living Kel'Thuzad as a "Necromancer" in WCIII (And Presumably "Arthas: Rise of the Lich King"), "The Road to Damnation" short story shows Kel'Thuzad learning Necromancy whilst alive. The in-game text "Kel'Thuzad and the Forming of the Scourge" shows this as well.

Sit down boy. Read some more.

Sit down boy. Read some more.

Sit down boy. Read some more.

[Deleted]

No? Unholy DKs summon the Undead but they are *Knights* by classification. Who fight up-close with melee weapons and strikes. Unholy's main mechanics involve festering wounds, bursting them with other melee skills, and empowering your minion.

All of this can be kept intact while making Necromancers fit their own niche and take everything that was removed from DKs over time. (Dark Pact anyone?) Another central element of Death Knights is rune weaponry and runeforging, another thing Necros don't have any connection to.

Necromancers would do *none* of that.

Forgive me if i come off rude, trying to control myself.

How can you explain a whole army of undead?
Permanent pet?
Empowerment of that pet.
Ranged attacks including the iconic death coil from WC3 used by necrolytes(also the fact they only have 2 abilities that is not ranged - Death Strike and Appocalypse, which is tied to artifact, not spec).
Wraith Walk(taken directly from Diablo universe).
Corpse Explosion(Glyph effect).
A zombie that crashes into your target(another passive skill).
Litteraly spreading plague.
Reaping the soul out of your target.

If you decide to use the curse card, "But they don't have any curses".

No, Warlocks do, which are the offical Necromancers, regardless of above(if we stay true to the lore).

Explain me, IF NOTHING, but how you can create a class, while we have this kind of coverage.

Its stupid as fck.
- - - Updated - - -

You're still linking to Wowwiki, are you?

Arthas and Jaina refer to a living Kel'Thuzad as a "Necromancer" in WCIII (And Presumably "Arthas: Rise of the Lich King"), "The Road to Damnation" short story shows Kel'Thuzad learning Necromancy whilst alive. The in-game text "Kel'Thuzad and the Forming of the Scourge" shows this as well.

I already proved to you, that Necromancers can be a spec of Warlocks/Mages at very best. Its not a class and it does not exist ingame.

Sit down, be humble. Learn instead.

[Wildberry]

I already proved to you, that Necromancers can be a spec of Warlocks/Mages at very best. Its not a class and it does not exist ingame.

Sit down, be humble. Learn instead.

"Necromancers aren't real because I'm misinterpreting a section on an outdated website concerning schools of magic" Okay, Mr. "Living Necromancers Aren't Real," have fun with whatever point you're trying to make. Perhaps you should go back to arguing that UnhDKs are ranged. At least that was humorous.

- - - Updated - - -

Ranged attacks including the iconic death coil from WC3 used by necrolytes

Necrolytes in WC3 were a hostile mob on Sunken Ruins tilesets. They also didn't have Death Coil (Their spellkit was Bloodlust and Chain Lightning. Death Knights used Death Coil in WC3 (And WC2).

(also the fact they only have 2 abilities that is not ranged - Death Strike and Appocalypse, which is tied to artifact, not spec).

Festering Strike isn't ranged, and any Death Knight that doesn't take advantage of standing in D&D/Defile for cleave is a moron. Soul Reaper is also melee, as is Necrotic Strike (PvP). Unholy DK's also have two spells to bring their targets to them.

Sit down, be humble. Learn instead.

Better yet, just go actually learn ONE THING about subjects you're trying speak about before humiliating yourself on MMO.

[Deleted]

"Necromancers aren't real because I'm misinterpreting a section on an outdated website concerning schools of magic" Okay, Mr. "Living Necromancers Aren't Real," have fun with whatever point you're trying to make. Perhaps you should go back to arguing that UnhDKs are ranged. At least that was humorous.

- - - Updated - - -



Necrolytes in WC3 were a hostile mob on Sunken Ruins tilesets. They also didn't have Death Coil (Their spellkit was Bloodlust and Chain Lightning. Death Knights used Death Coil in WC3 (And WC2).



Festering Strike isn't ranged, and any Death Knight that doesn't take advantage of standing in D&D/Defile for cleave is a moron.



Better yet, just go actually learn ONE THING about subjects you're trying speak about before humiliating yourself on MMO.

Alright you got me good there. I was thinking by mistake about some DoTA hero.

Yes, ill be humble now.

Edit: Oh wait:

"By channeling the necromantic powers of the underworld through his ghoulish form, the Death Knight creates a field of dark energy that drains the life-force from any who come in contact with it."

https://wow.gamepedia.com/Death_Coil

And point being is that the DK is the most ranged class out melees, giving them ranged power.

Sit down please.

[bufferunderrun]

Who says the pets have to be permanent. You can have minion interaction without making them permanent. Either way, what does any of that have to do with making them a Warlock spec, rather than a new class.



If you're worried about it becoming a reskinned Afflock, just read the thread. There's plenty of completely untouched design space to differentiate things thematically and mechanically. Beyond that, since when has the game been balanced? Would a Necromancer be hard to balance? Sure. Are the braindead devs at Blizzard capable of balancing things anyway? Nope.

without permanent pets it's just a demo lock, a spam class who need to resummon a skeleton every 10s, what really make a completely different thing from other currently available class is the ability to go around with a small army of permanent pets, and summon stronger one by using the remains of the enemy.

summon base skeletons, skeleton archers, skeleton mages, golems, death knights and doom knights, focusing the battle on raising the pets, buff them, keep them alive, summon stronger one i wonder is something like that doable in a mmo? Seeing what we have around when we talk about necro i doubt it.

It would end up in a boring curse class with a sorta of army of the dead on a 10min cd.

[Wildberry]

Alright you got me good there. I was thinking by mistake about some DoTA hero.

So what's your excuse for bungling the bit about Unholy having "only two melee spells?"

Edit: Oh wait:
"By channeling the necromantic powers of the underworld through his ghoulish form, the Death Knight creates a field of dark energy that drains the life-force from any who come in contact with it."

Nice try, but I never claimed anything that the above would have been contradicting. Learn to read; alternatively:

Sit down please.

[Deleted]

without permanent pets it's just a demo lock, a spam class who need to resummon a skeleton every 10s, what really make a completely different thing from other currently available class is the ability to go around with a small army of permanent pets, and summon stronger one by using the remains of the enemy.

summon base skeletons, skeleton archers, skeleton mages, golems, death knights and doom knights, focusing the battle on raising the pets, buff them, keep them alive, summon stronger one i wonder is something like that doable in a mmo? Seeing what we have around when we talk about necro i doubt it.

It would end up in a boring curse class with a sorta of army of the dead on a 10min cd.

Have you tryed Demolock?

Its EXACTLY what you describe, they are just demons.

My whole point was... If you try so fcking hard, it also have to make sense. You can't fit a Necromancer, into a pirate themed expansion either. And there are so much that overlaps.

Otherwise join my thread, where we can talk about the new class: THE NINJA.

[Wildberry]

without permanent pets it's just a demo lock, a spam class who need to resummon a skeleton every 10s, what really make a completely different thing from other currently available class is the ability to go around with a small army of permanent pets, and summon stronger one by using the remains of the enemy.

summon base skeletons, skeleton archers, skeleton mages, golems, death knights and doom knights, focusing the battle on raising the pets, buff them, keep them alive, summon stronger one i wonder is something like that doable in a mmo? Seeing what we have around when we talk about necro i doubt it.

It would end up in a boring curse class with a sorta of army of the dead on a 10min cd.

You're completely overlooking the Alchemist/Professor Putricide Angle, you're completely discounting healing, etc. I'd recommend looking at the Google Doc Hitei linked for a fleshed out look at what a Necromancer could hypothetically be.

[Deleted]

OMFG.

Im out of this thread, people are braindead.

[Wildberry]

OMFG.

Im out of this thread, people are braindead.

You got blown out on every single point you made. You've tried falling back on discussing magic schools and pulling points from the Warcraft II game manual to debunk claims that people haven't made.

Have fun in fantasyland where UnhDKs are ranged, there's no room for Necromancers, and Death Coil was an iconic Necrolyte spell in WCIII!

[Deleted]

You got blown out on every single point you made. You've tried falling back on discussing magic schools and pulling points from the Warcraft II game manual to debunk claims that people haven't made.

Have fun in fantasyland where UnhDKs are ranged, there's no room for Necromancers, and Death Coil was an iconic Necrolyte spell in WCIII!

Yes, I prefer the Ninja idea.

We can be casual and demand all kind of nonsense anyway.

And its good that you could pick on 2 arguments of out many and mislead the point.

[Deleted]

For what i've read about these necromancer idea's for me atleast the spec combo i'd be more than happy to play with would be combination of cloth class with ability to tank with some pet oriented style, in melee. sharing dmg with some flesh golem type of thing, blood healer(liked the blood essence secondary resource mentioned somewhere) and a ranged dps spec, bones, spirits and that sort of thing. bit like bonemancer from d2. Could include skeleton pets too.

[Wildberry]

Yes, I prefer the Ninja idea.

We can be casual and demand all kind of nonsense anyway.

And its good that you could pick on 2 arguments of out many and mislead the point.

Your other arguments are just as bad, it just takes longer to expose them for being ridiculously not-smart.