Is the Collapse of the U.S. Now Inevitable?

[Surfd]

Most of the issues highlighted in the OP are either results of corruption or buying votes by the left along with subsidizing immigrant workers who take up jobs that previously were filled by teenagers for pocket money.

Lol wut? Unless the republican party suddenly became "the left" when I wasn't looking, I think you are barking up the wrong side of the political divide there friend.

Also, I would love to know how many teenagers you knew who were willing to do backbreaking menial labor for pocket money, cause that sounds nothing like any teenager I ever knew. But yeah, go on trying to push that myth that the immigrants "r takin' ur jerbs", considering most of the jobs the immigrants were taking are the ones the average American considered beneath them.

[Deleted]

Lol wut? Unless the republican party suddenly became "the left" when I wasn't looking, I think you are barking up the wrong side of the political divide there friend.

Also, I would love to know how many teenagers you knew who were willing to do backbreaking menial labor for pocket money, cause that sounds nothing like any teenager I ever knew. But yeah, go on trying to push that myth that the immigrants "r takin' ur jerbs", considering most of the jobs the immigrants were taking are the ones the average American considered beneath them.

"Beneath them". Shit, dude. If you weren't importing people who were willing to work in another country for the sake of comparably higher living standards when they go back home or support people back there, those shit menial jobs would compensate adequately for less-experienced labourers.

It's the same here - why hire a local who needs taxes and shit paid and lives on the local level of costs, when you can take three or four Estonians or whatever for the price?

[Cosmic Janitor]

Climate change won't kill the US really, that is more a threat for other countries. And debt is the driving force of the global economy, as long as you can pay the interest that is due next you are fine, even if you owed a quintillion for each american. One day there will be a huge system crash and everything will reset, some bankers and lower level politicans will be hung and then all will start over. The biggest threat is probably the cheeto in chief atm, you can only hope that the military and the people that try to pull the strings in the background don't fuck up too much and accidently let him start a nuclear war, otherwise it will just be a continuation of the slow erosion of the middle class but that has been going for the past 30 years and will keep going for another 30 probably.

[THE Bigzoman]

Well yeah, all things end.

You've been a doomsayer most of the time you've been here. Is this really the core of your belief; "All things end, so this will end...eventually!"

[Theodarzna]

You've been a doomsayer most of the time you've been here. Is this really the core of your belief; "All things end, so this will end...eventually!"

Yes, the core; absolute essence is an assumption that death is a given. Expanding past that I'd say Empires have short shelf lives.

America is barely a country and isn't really a Nation IMHO. As in, unlike say the Soviet Union which could just go back to being Russia after Marxism turned out to be bogus, America has no fallback core to itself. America was founded and peopled largely by treasure seekers with a higher penchant for wanderlust, most of its population is in it for the money or the ancestors were. As economic prosperity fades and becomes hyper concentrated, there will be the existential question of why does this country even exist? We are not united by some sense of common ancestry, there is a common language but even that was not organically produced and increasingly not universal either, we aren't united by religion, ect. The values were never upheld nor evenly spread, and those values were things you could get elsewhere. People came her for the cash, and the cash has all but dried up for most of the population. If ever there was a time the country was vulnerable to contraction and future collapse, now is it. If anything Trump is but a symptom of a deeply sickly system.

[Glnger]

America has surrendered itself to Corporations and international business corruption which have no interest outside of having an advanced military with a technological advantage to achieve immediate results that requires little sacrifice in terms of casualties to Americans simply to avoid public scrutiny not because of a genuine empathy for the average soldier.

A hard truth is that America never deserved the place in the world that it found itself in the aftermath of WW2, a rational understanding of history will tell you that. (As a Nation) We were a second world libertarian/agrarian economy country whose elite class understood the threat that Germany/Japan posed to its expansion plans and free use of the oceans for commerce and did what was necessary in terms of industrialization/modernization/ and infrastructure investment(highway system and an advanced Navy to enforce norms which they dictate for example.) to protect themselves and their interests and their investment in what was thought before the war to be an easy victory for the united British/French forces. We quickly lost our position in the world even in 1949 with the "loss of China" to Communism as per Chomsky's analysis. Which immediately led to Opposing a united USSR/China in East Asia which brought on The Korean War and Vietnam, both of which we numerically won but strategically lost at least as far as the goals for going to war in the first place. The fact that capitalism surged vs socialism in Latin America is directly related to the CIA, whose infrastructure, again was constructed as a result of counter-terrorism in WW2 undermined and actively pursued agendas to undermine them, both violently and non-violently, but of course at the pay and pursuit of capitalist interests.

If China or Russia for example were to develop a weapon changer platform on par with the Nuke at the end of WW2 I guarantee you US multinationals, even those that are the most subsidized by the US tax payers will flee/retreat only to resume business with whomever the winner is. Giving more tax reductions/regulation reductions for these people just gives them more money(which equals power) which translates to more power/corruption/influence, and on the cycle goes. Endless greed in the pursuit of a race to see who can "exit" the world with the "most".

jesus, I get pedantic when i drink a few

[Zecora]

Is the Collapse of the U.S. Now Inevitable?

Oh, I do hope so.

(Of course, in the long run it certainly is, but in the shorter timeframe? Hopefully.)

[ParanoiD84]

Not in our life time, all empires fall in the end though.

[Antius]

by collapse, do you mean states going as independent nations or a civil insurrection against oligarchy?


fascinating enough, if california decide to be independant, it would be the 8th economy of the world, get into G8 (which i guess would be renamed G9) and could really thrive without having to shoulder the failling economy of more rural states of the US.

California, it's hollywood, it's silicon valley, it's a massive economy.

That would probably the biggest mistake Cali would/could ever make. Not that it will ever happen. It would actually be kind of funny to see though.

[Glnger]

That would probably the biggest mistake Cali would/could ever make. Not that it will ever happen. It would actually be kind of funny to see though.

what makes you think Californians would be any less willing to defend their state than Carolinian's, Virginians, Georgians, ect. It's actually best to learn from history, not antagonize it.

[Auxora]

I wouldn't be all doom and gloom. Most of those things mentioned like debt have been a problem for many years and the US hasn't collapsed. And some of the other problems are just general world issues. Every decade has problems. Back in the 70's it was inflation, gas crisis, Three Mile Island, the Cold War, the collapse of unions, etc. Life goes on. And automation will change some jobs but automation isn't that new. Large manufacturing factories in the US run with about 1/4 the people they did 30 years ago, but unemployment is lower. Instead of people running a steel press, now people write a program to run the steel press. The same will happen with other automation. Unskilled and lower skilled people will suffer the brunt of though if they don't learn skills that are more in demand.

Longer-term every system of government eventually changes historically. Most are lucky to last a couple hundred years.

[Antius]

how you work that out?? is that why every country in eu buys u.s military equipment/planes all time??

the u.s can destroy the eu 7 times over, it spends over 700billion on military alone, if anything the e.u is americas puppet.

This. The U.S. produces and sells a ridiculously large amount of military hardware and tech to many countries.

[Surfd]

"Beneath them". Shit, dude. If you weren't importing people who were willing to work in another country for the sake of comparably higher living standards when they go back home or support people back there, those shit menial jobs would compensate adequately for less-experienced labourers.

Except that they wouldn't. Your "less experienced" American laborers literally sneer at the vast majority of those jobs and refuse to take them, even when they are available. The Imported Immigrants are taking them because the Americans straight up don't want them. It's the literal equivalent of handing the American a Peanut Butter sandwich, watching him throw it away because he wants a Roast Beef sandwich, and then listening to him scream about how Mexicans are stealing his sandwiches when an Immigrant comes by and takes the sandwich he didn't want.

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This. The U.S. produces and sells a ridiculously large amount of military hardware and tech to many countries.

Know what else the US produces a lot of? Instability and war in third world shitholes. Ain't it awesome when the local arsonist also conveniently happens to be the largest local supplier of fire fighting and prevention equipment?

[Easo]

Ehh, OP, countries right now are more stable than ever. With some exceptions bunch of them have lasted for centuries already and others are on the way to do that.
All you listed will not be enough...

[Skroe]

Yes, the core; absolute essence is an assumption that death is a given. Expanding past that I'd say Empires have short shelf lives.

America is barely a country and isn't really a Nation IMHO. As in, unlike say the Soviet Union which could just go back to being Russia after Marxism turned out to be bogus, America has no fallback core to itself. America was founded and peopled largely by treasure seekers with a higher penchant for wanderlust, most of its population is in it for the money or the ancestors were. As economic prosperity fades and becomes hyper concentrated, there will be the existential question of why does this country even exist? We are not united by some sense of common ancestry, there is a common language but even that was not organically produced and increasingly not universal either, we aren't united by religion, ect. The values were never upheld nor evenly spread, and those values were things you could get elsewhere. People came her for the cash, and the cash has all but dried up for most of the population. If ever there was a time the country was vulnerable to contraction and future collapse, now is it. If anything Trump is but a symptom of a deeply sickly system.

Truly bizarre post. But then again, Blood and Soil nationalism is the bread and butter of European politics, and you are one of them despite living here (for some reason).

I love Europe deeply, but one of the ways in which we are just completely better is that, for the vast majority of us anyway, blood and soil nationalism is an abhorrent anahcronism.

America is the nation of the idea. The fact that you don't accept or recognize that from a very practical perspective, explains basically everything about you.

[Surfd]

Truly bizarre post. But then again, Blood and Soil nationalism is the bread and butter of European politics, and you are one of them despite living here (for some reason).

I love Europe deeply, but one of the ways in which we are just completely better is that, for the vast majority of us anyway, blood and soil nationalism is an abhorrent anahcronism.

America is the nation of the idea. The fact that you don't accept or recognize that from a very practical perspective, explains basically everything about you.

Umm, you do realize that your currently sitting president was literally elected pretty much for running on the very platform you just called an Abhorrent Anachronism, right? The entire MAGA marketing campaign was basically just a cute way to dress up Blood and Soil nationalism to appeal to the largest possible crowd. And since enough people pulled the lever to land the orange nutball in the whitehouse, your vast majority is obviously not as vast as you think it is.

[Skroe]

Umm, you do realize that your currently sitting president was literally elected pretty much for running on the very platform you just called an Abhorrent Anachronism, right? The entire MAGA marketing campaign was basically just a cute way to dress up Blood and Soil nationalism to appeal to the largest possible crowd. And since enough people pulled the lever to land the orange nutball in the whitehouse, your vast majority is obviously not as vast as you think it is.

Elected by less 60 million people out of 325 million. 235 million eligible voters.

So yes. Vast majority. Our electoral system sucks.

[Theodarzna]

Truly bizarre post. But then again, Blood and Soil nationalism is the bread and butter of European politics, and you are one of them despite living here (for some reason).

I love Europe deeply, but one of the ways in which we are just completely better is that, for the vast majority of us anyway, blood and soil nationalism is an abhorrent anahcronism.

America is the nation of the idea. The fact that you don't accept or recognize that from a very practical perspective, explains basically everything about you.

America is not a nation, but it is an idea. That is why there are no ideologies in America, America is an ideology. But an ideology of money making and thus vapid and pointless. The freedom can be had in many places, sometimes in far greater abundance. People came here because the indigenous people had all been exterminated almost to the man and that cleared space for a rapacious expansion and wealth generation.

I like the story of the Native Americans who after looking in on the Donor party was asked to explain Americans to the tribe, and he said "They eat each other."

[truckboattruck]

i am neither in debt nor have i ever gone to prison.
america is just fine

you see friends....stupid people deserve what they get. and the rest of us do not exist to clean up their messes.

[breadisfunny]

so what does climate change have to do with being exclusive to the united states? yes it's a factor but not one that's exclusive to the u.s. it's affecting nations across the board even if orangey doesn't want to admit it.

also replace 20 years with 30 years.

i don't think the collapse is inevitable it can still be fixed but stuff is slowly reaching critical mass.

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i am neither in debt nor have i ever gone to prison.
america is just fine

you see friends....stupid people deserve what they get. and the rest of us do not exist to clean up their messes.

hey how's that island of self imposed exile doing for ya?

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Oh, I do hope so.

(Of course, in the long run it certainly is, but in the shorter timeframe? Hopefully.)

why? do you want to damage the world economy?