Legion - Assassination Discussion

[Deleted]

I was wondering if anyone could tell me what the minimum Haste / Crit % you need on assa spec?

[Varolyn]

I was wondering if anyone could tell me what the minimum Haste / Crit % you need on assa spec?

Crit is a strong stat if you go bleed, where you try to stack it along with vers. With poison build, crit is ok but you should aim to get as much mastery as you can, unless if there is a significant ilvl disparity between a piece with mastery compared to a piece with no mastery.

In both builds, try to avoid haste as it is assassin's worse stat by far (and sub's for that matter).

[davesignal]

None of assassination's DOTs scale with haste, right?

[ymirsson]

None of assassination's DOTs scale with haste, right?

Only DoTs of spellcasters scale with haste.

[elfporn]

Only DoTs of spellcasters scale with haste.

Which is a shame, if they did scale with haste, then it would actually be worth something as a stat.

[Deleted]

Which is a shame, if they did scale with haste, then it would actually be worth something as a stat.

they should at least make the poison scale with haste

[Deleted]

they should at least make the poison scale with haste

The instant effect of our poison already scales with haste because of the attack speed, only the DoT does not but it represents at most 10% of our DPS on fights with AOE. Having haste speed the DoT up would increase the haste value by 10% which is still very low.

But I agree with you the DoT pace of our poison should scale with haste and so should scale the Garrot and Rupture DoTs. All together they represent about 30% of our damage. This will still not bring haste as a desirable stat compared to Mastery, Crit and Versa. This will neither bring Assassination on par with other DPS specs as it is bottom of the charts with Outlaw. At most Assassination would gain one rank :
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/13

The best rogue DPS spec is far behind both drood dps specs while droods can heal, tank, range and melee dps, have a battle res and prowl. Blizzard logic...

[Deleted]

The instant effect of our poison already scales with haste because of the attack speed, only the DoT does not but it represents at most 10% of our DPS on fights with AOE. Having haste speed the DoT up would increase the haste value by 10% which is still very low.

But I agree with you the DoT pace of our poison should scale with haste and so should scale the Garrot and Rupture DoTs. All together they represent about 30% of our damage. This will still not bring haste as a desirable stat compared to Mastery, Crit and Versa. This will neither bring Assassination on par with other DPS specs as it is bottom of the charts with Outlaw. At most Assassination would gain one rank :
https://www.warcraftlogs.com/statistics/13

The best rogue DPS spec is far behind both drood dps specs while droods can heal, tank, range and melee dps, have a battle res and prowl. Blizzard logic...

i just thought that it would at least make haste a little better for rogues since its like the worst stat.

[Won7on]

Exsang build is simming higher than TB build? Am I dreaming? Is it October 2016 and are we about to start on Nythendra progression?

But seriously, I'm so happy Exsang is back. TB is a mongoloid talent that kinda ruined a good spec IMO.

[omeomorfismo]

Exsang build is simming higher than TB build? Am I dreaming? Is it October 2016 and are we about to start on Nythendra progression?

But seriously, I'm so happy Exsang is back. TB is a mongoloid talent that kinda ruined a good spec IMO.

why no NS on TB build? in pure ST envenom and rupture are my 1° source of damage even now

btw toxic blade best assa iteration evah
the changes in rhythim with the different debuffs are lovables

[Won7on]

Subt TB sims about 25k higher than NS TB, and most of the Sin Rogues at the top of Mythic Goroth are using Subt TB too.

We'll have to agree to disagree on TB being "the best evah". I like when things line up and have a logical usage together - a rhythm. It's why I like current DFA sub so much and why I liked pre-7.2 Sin. Those feel/felt like executing a precise a dance routine, while TB Sin feels like spinning 5 plates while riding a skateboard. TB Sin never has that satisfying payoff of "ok NOW everything is lined up, let's go ham".

[elfporn]

Exsang build is simming higher than TB build? Am I dreaming? Is it October 2016 and are we about to start on Nythendra progression?

But seriously, I'm so happy Exsang is back. TB is a mongoloid talent that kinda ruined a good spec IMO.

It's not likely to stay that way for long, the t21 set favors poison builds quite a bit. Personally i like gearing for crit heavy mastery, gives me a lot of flexibility in spec/build choice. (I'm favoring crit heavy mastery atm for t21, because reasons....for now)

- - - Updated - - -

Subt TB sims about 25k higher than NS TB, and most of the Sin Rogues at the top of Mythic Goroth are using Subt TB too.

We'll have to agree to disagree on TB being "the best evah". I like when things line up and have a logical usage together - a rhythm. It's why I like current DFA sub so much and why I liked pre-7.2 Sin. Those feel/felt like executing a precise a dance routine, while TB Sin feels like spinning 5 plates while riding a skateboard. TB Sin never has that satisfying payoff of "ok NOW everything is lined up, let's go ham".

I have zero problems getting TB to line up with things. Though i admit it doesn't always sync with everything at once - i use tb with KB and vendetta separately much of the time, and it's great - pooling for tb is the only real prep needed; i don't have to prep with 3-4 button presses before every burst window.

[Varolyn]

I really wouldn't throw exsang out the window for t21. The new tier actually benefits it quite a bit, a lot more than what you may think. On ptr, using boots/bracers, 4 piece t21/2p t20, and three MA relics I was able to line up each vendetta with exsang, making for very high vendetta and pretty high amp for assassin standards. Now of course the numbers aren't out yet but I wouldn't say exsang is dead for t21 just yet.

[omeomorfismo]

Subt TB sims about 25k higher than NS TB, and most of the Sin Rogues at the top of Mythic Goroth are using Subt TB too.

We'll have to agree to disagree on TB being "the best evah". I like when things line up and have a logical usage together - a rhythm. It's why I like current DFA sub so much and why I liked pre-7.2 Sin. Those feel/felt like executing a precise a dance routine, while TB Sin feels like spinning 5 plates while riding a skateboard. TB Sin never has that satisfying payoff of "ok NOW everything is lined up, let's go ham".

im tard, i was thinking that these sims are for ptr and t21 bonus

btw its fine, i never liked the cds stacking and prefers to juggle around them. de gustibus

[davesignal]

I must be in some sort of magical sweet spot with my gear because Kingsbane, Toxic Blade, and Vendetta all seem to line up for me quite often. It's pretty common for me to end up using Toxic Blade into a 5 CP Envenom, and then have Kingsbane come off CD shortly thereafter.

[Chemii]

I must be in some sort of magical sweet spot with my gear because Kingsbane, Toxic Blade, and Vendetta all seem to line up for me quite often. It's pretty common for me to end up using Toxic Blade into a 5 CP Envenom, and then have Kingsbane come off CD shortly thereafter.

Why would you Toxic Blade before Kingsbane. Kingsbane does most of its damage at the end of the Dot.

[Millyraynge]

Why would you Toxic Blade before Kingsbane. Kingsbane does most of its damage at the end of the Dot.

the last tick is still a question of rng. In practice it makes absolutely no difference.

[elfporn]

Why would you Toxic Blade before Kingsbane. Kingsbane does most of its damage at the end of the Dot.

This is why people don't like TB. This thought process.

It matters more to fit 2+ envenoms into every single TB than to time it so that TB covers the last ticks of the dot. Kingsbane application is affected by tb too.

TB is the burst window that you play with, the rest just supports it. It's a shift in thought from how the rotation used to roll.

[megavolt419]

COF still good to use?

I have every trinket from ToS...

[Symphonic]

what item levels are your trinkets