Trump's Benghazi

[Orbitus]

Did he order them to be there and refuse to send help while they were under siege??? unless so its nowhere near the same but nice try.

Considering that Obama and Hillary DIDN'T REFUSE to send help, I don't know how you can say that bullshit with a straight face. It is like you are saying the whole bullshit "stand down" order again, WHICH NEVER HAPPENED.

[Paranoid Android]

Considering that Obama and Hillary DIDN'T REFUSE to send help, I don't know how you can say that bullshit with a straight face. It is like you are saying the whole bullshit "stand down" order again, WHICH NEVER HAPPENED.

I made this thread with the title of "Benghazi" in it as little tongue and cheek.

It's amazing the people in here who now believe the myth of Benghazi. They are so brainwashed, they believe every false fact.

[Tijuana]

[Merkava]

I think the most obvious example is the Obamacare issues.

Trump is complaining that the Dems won't negotiate. The Dems won. Obamacare is law. If you want them to negotiate, because you can't remove Obamacare without their support, you need to move further left than the status quo. You need to find ways to make your health care more to the Democrat's liking than the current health plan. THAT is "negotiation".

When you want to repeal Obamacare and all your alternatives are garbage that move way to the right, the proper and ethical response of Democrats should be to stonewall you, because you are refusing to negotiate.

Negotiation isn't the fine art of demanding people do what you want and sulking and throwing a tantrum when they won't.

I agree completely.

How dare that vampire refuse the garlic?!?

It's like he just expects them to help him gut the signature domestic legislative achievement of their party during the previous administration.

[Karfal]

Well it's here. Four Green Berets were killed in Niger and Trump remained silent until today.







http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/13/politi...nce/index.html

You're a fucking autist. How is this equal to benghazi? Seriously you liberal idiots are reeeeeally reaching here. And these fucking jackass mods let you clowns get away with this shit.


Trump didn't just sit on his hands to allow americans to die like your great hero hitlery

[BrerBear]

Trump didn't just sit on his hands to allow americans to die like your great hero hitlery

We don't know that yet.
Only after many, many Congressional investigations will we be able to make that conclusion.

[Grapemask]

You're a fucking autist. How is this equal to benghazi? Seriously you liberal idiots are reeeeeally reaching here. And these fucking jackass mods let you clowns get away with this shit.


Trump didn't just sit on his hands to allow americans to die like your great hero hitlery

One of those posts where you can actually see r/The_Donald transposed behind it.

[ati87]

You're a fucking autist. How is this equal to benghazi? Seriously you liberal idiots are reeeeeally reaching here. And these fucking jackass mods let you clowns get away with this shit.


Trump didn't just sit on his hands to allow americans to die like your great hero hitlery

Knowing trump he was probably playing golf, tweeting or watching tv

[Edge-]

The comparisons are seeming more apt -

(Video post)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/video...=.1ba1958d50b2

Defense Secretary Jim Mattis said on Oct. 19 that the ambush in Niger earlier this month that killed four U.S. soldiers is under investigation. "We do not have all the accurate information yet," he said.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/1...bpoenas-243951

And McCain threatening subpoenas. Interesting bit about this though -

He also reiterated his criticism that he had better communication with the Obama administration than with Trump national security officials.

"Actually, it was easier under Obama," McCain said. "I'm very close to these people. We converse all the time. Gen. McMaster was in to see me yesterday. We're just not getting the information in a timely fashion that we need."

[Thepersona]

You're a fucking autist. How is this equal to benghazi? Seriously you liberal idiots are reeeeeally reaching here. And these fucking jackass mods let you clowns get away with this shit.


Trump didn't just sit on his hands to allow americans to die like your great hero hitlery

Before anything else, what have autism do with anything else? I'm an aspie and i find using that shit against us incredibly insulting.
Second, this post reeks of T_D, and its talking points (some old, like hitlery and some more new, like his handling of this shitfest). All of this with a sprinkle of good ol' insults and attacks to the mods.
And then you have the audacity to wonder why you're banned non stop

[Kallisto]

And because the Republicans refuse to play ball with the Democrats, the Democrats are forced to refuse to play ball with the Republicans. I mean, how can you even try to be bipartisan when the other side refuses to even talk with you? When the other side puts themselves into a closet to hammer out a healthcare bill where no one is looking and no Democrat is invited?

That's not how our democracy was intended. The idea behind Congress is to use debate and compromise to find solutions that can please the most people. But it's turned into a game. The Rs on one side, the Ds on the other side.

You will not get compramise when the political system is designed in such a way that only two parties can exist. Both are a compramise with themselves to cover broad bases to which the two can not compramise with each other anymore. It was bound to happen at some point with FPTP voting system for the senate and the lower house. A PR system will be the only thing that breaks the D & R stronghold. It will actually break Democrats and Republicans as we know it as well because those who are in those parties for small reasons will splinter off. Voters will actually have more choices outside "Well these two are electable and the others are just jokes." to "No matter who I vote it will count and even if the % is small my views will still be properly represented."

This will also mean no one party will ever reach 50% again and will have to work together to get anything done. Forcing compramise instead of hoping it will happen.

FPTP was fine in the 1700s due to logistics. But the US (And UK) need to realise it's not the 1700s and we now have easier time getting from A - B anywhere in the world really within 2 days.

[LaserSharkDFB]

You're a fucking autist. How is this equal to benghazi? Seriously you liberal idiots are reeeeeally reaching here. And these fucking jackass mods let you clowns get away with this shit.


Trump didn't just sit on his hands to allow americans to die like your great hero hitlery

You're right, this is way, way worse than Benghazi. For one thing, Obama didn't sit on a report about Benghazi for almost two weeks before a reporter made him admit it happened.

[Breccia]

How many ways can we interpret the term "massive intelligence failure"?

A senior congressional aide who has been briefed on the deaths of four U.S. servicemen in Niger says the ambush by militants stemmed in part from a "massive intelligence failure."

The Pentagon has said that 40 to 50 militants ambushed a 12-man U.S. force in Niger on Oct. 4, killing four and wounding two. The U.S. patrol was seen as routine and had been carried out nearly 30 times in the six months before the attack, the Pentagon has reported.

The aide, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he is not authorized to speak publicly, said the House and Senate armed services committees have questions about the scope of the U.S. mission in Niger, and whether the Pentagon is properly supporting the troops on the ground there.

There was no U.S. overhead surveillance of the mission, he said, and no American quick-reaction force available to rescue the troops if things went wrong. If it weren't for the arrival of French fighter jets, he said, things could have been much worse for the Americans.

Holy shit, we were bailed out by the French? Sacre bleu, we're never going to live that one down.

Congress also has many unanswered questions about what happened, he said, including about the specifics of the mission that day and the accounts lawmakers have been given about the timeline of the attack and rescue.

The aide said questions are being asked about whether the U.S. soldiers were intentionally delayed in the village they were visiting. He said they began pursuing some men on motorcycles, who lured them into a complex ambush. The enemy force had "technical" vehicles — light, improvised military vehicles — and rocket-propelled grenades, the official said.

After the rescue when it became clear that one soldier was missing, "movements and actions to try and find him and bring him back were considered. They just were not postured properly [to get him]." The body of Sgt. La David Johnson was not recovered until nearly 48 hours after the Oct. 4 attack.

A Pentagon spokesperson called the claim of an intelligence failure "speculation."

"An investigation is underway," said the spokesperson. "At the conclusion of the investigation, we will provide further details."

On Thursday, Director of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Lt. Gen. Kenneth McKenzie said that "every tactical engagement doesn’t necessarily proceed from an intelligence failure. We'll look at it and we'll come to conclusions about how intelligence could have supported adequately or inadequately the engagement that occurred. But on a battlefield, the enemy gets a vote."

"Sub-Saharan Africa is a very difficult place to operate," said Gen. McKenzie.

On Friday afternoon, Defense Secretary James Mattis met with Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., chairman of the Senate Armed Services Committee, to discuss the Niger raid.

Earlier this week, McCain said the committee had not been provided with the information about the Niger mission that it "deserves."

Sen. Lindsay Graham, R-S.C., told reporters Friday that it's too early to say whether there was an intelligence failure, "but that's exactly the kind of questions we should be asking ourselves."

He said Congress will require more information from a Trump administration that is expanding counterterrorism operations across the globe.

Trump is loosening the rules of engagement when it comes to lethal action against terrorists, and expanding the counterterrorism fight to different parts of the world, including across Africa, Graham said.

"The war is morphing," he said. "You're going to see more actions in Africa, not less."

In that context, Graham said, "I will insist that Congress is informed more often and in more detail," about military operations.

He added, "As the war expands, as the military had more authority, Congress is going to require more information."

Pentagon officials say operations in the region have already "tightened up" and there's been an operational "pause" while the U.S. military's Africa Command (AFRICOM) assesses the situation. U.S. officials believe the attack was carried out by a local terror group that claims association with ISIS.

Gen. Thomas Waldhauser, commander of AFRICOM since 2016, told Congress in March that only 20 to 30 percent of AFRICOM's needs for "intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance" flights were being met. The Marine Corps general said there weren't enough helicopters to find wounded or dead soldiers, and that African partners weren't able to help with recovery missions.

"For personnel recovery," he said, "Africa Command relies heavily on contract search and rescue assets."

Well. A lot of questions top GOP members like McCain and Graham want answered. And the Pentagon isn't giving them anything.

Now I know some people are still trying to say Clinton, in her duties as Secretary of State, was somehow responsible when she failed to use her nonexistent military authority to launch a massive rescue with the security funds that got cut, and meanwhile, Trump did everything in his power to salvage this situation by not being involved in any way at all, outsourcing his Commander in Chief duties not just to the Pentagon but also somehow to the motherfucking French.

But those people know they are being hypocrites. Credit to the GOP: at least they're demanding answers from both sides.

[Deleted]

Strangely enough, if you send people with guns to other countries they often try and kill you.

There is nothing particulary remarkable in this. It is the testament to the brainwashed militarism of the US that people think there is something outrageous about soldiers being killed.

[LaserSharkDFB]

Strangely enough, if you send people with guns to other countries they often try and kill you.

There is nothing particulary remarkable in this. It is the testament to the brainwashed militarism of the US that people think there is something outrageous about soldiers being killed.

There is, however, something outrageous about a president that doesn't release a statement about an attack for twelve days - during which time he tweeted multiple times about such topics as the NFL, how great the PR recovery was doing (it isn't), and the mean ol' media - and only does so after a reporter forces the issue, and then immediately tries to change the subject.

[Deleted]

There is, however, something outrageous about a president that doesn't release a statement about an attack for twelve days - during which time he tweeted multiple times about such topics as the NFL, how great the PR recovery was doing (it isn't), and the mean ol' media - and only does so after a reporter forces the issue, and then immediately tries to change the subject.

That sounds like normal Trump behavior frankly. It is what happens when people keep on electing village idiots to the White House.

[Eldar45]

Well it's here. Four Green Berets were killed in Niger and Trump remained silent until today.







http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/13/politi...nce/index.html

I will say that the Benghazi embassy was begging for help for almost a month before they got hit by the al-Sharia terrorists. A quick glance over the article shows that this attack kind of came out of nowhere.

It is really sad that these guys got killed, and there should be an investigation into whether this could have been prevented. However, there is some amount of blame that could be put on the administration for the Benghazi incident, and not much for this one.

[-Nurot]

It is really sad that these guys got killed, and there should be an investigation into whether this could have been prevented. However, there is some amount of blame that could be put on the administration for the Benghazi incident, and not much for this one.

Did he order them to be there and refuse to send help while they were under siege??? unless so its nowhere near the same but nice try.

No the blame is completely on the shoulders of this administration.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/21/opinio...ion/index.html

It seems that US Homeland Security gave all countries 50 days to meet a "baseline" of security conditions, including producing a counterfeit-proof version of their passport to prove that they were reliable enough to allow their citizens into America. But Chad, desperately poor, had quite simply run out of passport paper.

They reportedly offered to provide a pre-existing sample of this type of passport. No dice. The next thing they knew they were on the banned list, alongside their arch enemy Libya and other clearly terrorist-driven nations.

Barely a week after the announcement of the new travel ban, the Chadian government suddenly began pulling hundreds of their fighters from Niger. There was no immediate explanation, though the nation's communications minister Madeleine Alingué condemned the Trump administration's unheralded move, observing that it "seriously undermines" the "good relations between the two countries, notably in the fight against terrorism." Hard to be more direct than that.

.......

But now, Chad's troops, one of the major components of the multinational force in Niger, are largely gone. They had been assembled to patrol, defend and especially to understand this vast stretch of largely barren desert that includes Mali and Niger -- a combined territory nearly four times the size of Texas. Few could understand it better or be better equipped to fight there than the army of Chad. I've seen that first-hand. Donald Trump has not.

Inexplicably, though, we still sent our small, under-armed band of troops into harm's way. Fifty jihadis, heavily armed with rocket-propelled grenades and machine guns, utterly outgunned and outmanned the slim American force they ambushed.

And then our boys died there. The backstory is frightful -- filled with mindless decisions executed with minimal knowledge and catastrophic results.

People want to cry about Benghazi and blame Hillary, then those same people can literally do nothing except rest the blame squarely on Trump's shoulders. Unlike Benghazi, this is actually the administration's fault. Not a misjudgment of danger, but the intentional pissing on of our allies and allowing US soldiers to die without previous support of a major asset, who would have otherwise been there to assist. All just to prove a point about Trump's travel ban.

He proved his point, and now the soldiers are dead. I'm sure the Trumpettes will applaud him for this, but frankly it's disgusting.

[rogueMatthias]

No the blame is completely on the shoulders of this administration.
...
People want to cry about Benghazi and blame Hillary, then those same people can literally do nothing except rest the blame squarely on Trump's shoulders. Unlike Benghazi, this is actually the administration's fault. Not a misjudgment of danger, but the intentional pissing on of our allies and allowing US soldiers to die without previous support of a major asset, who would have otherwise been there to assist. All just to prove a point about Trump's travel ban.

He proved his point, and now the soldiers are dead. I'm sure the Trumpettes will applaud him for this, but frankly it's disgusting.

People SERIOUSLY actually believe that they pulled all of their fighters against Boko Haram because of the travel ban?

Chads economy is collapsing after oil prices plunged. They even had to restructure all their loans a few months ago because they couldn't afford any payment. You don't think MAYBE this is a more likely reason to pull out than "their feelings were hurt"?

[Edge-]

People SERIOUSLY actually believe that they pulled all of their fighters against Boko Haram because of the travel ban?

Chads economy is collapsing after oil prices plunged. They even had to restructure all their loans a few months ago because they couldn't afford any payment. You don't think MAYBE this is a more likely reason to pull out than "their feelings were hurt"?

It wasn't a large force, but that seems to be the general consensus, yes. The timing is sure surprisingly coincidental, if nothing else.