What Ruined World of Warcraft

[MagusHenosis]

Stop the bickering/personal attacks, guys.

If that's what you REALLY want, then I would suggest having a chat with the hater trolls, of which MOST of the community is now comprised of.

You don't really want that though, now do you, since really ALL of you seem to think that hating on others, and trolling them is perfectly fine???

You guys really do lol, and you know what the proof is???

The proof is how you guys treat me, when I am trying to FIGHT AGAINST THIS TREND OF HATEFUL TROLLING!!!!

Which clearly makes me the "bad guy" in your minds, when NOTHING could be further from the truth in reality OK!!!

I am the bad guy, like John Wayne was the bad guy YO!!!

Meaning pretty much never OK......

[Sansnom]

leveling was part of the experience (and not a 3 day chore to endgame)

Have not noticed any difference. I am still collecting teeth, fur, eyes, etc for people I do not know for rewards that I will sell.

I have not seen any poo quests anymore though. Maybe it was that?

, community was king, and inconvenience just lead to good memories. Now it's just a lobby to pug raid in for ever increasing boring stat increases on forgettable items, with a Facebook game style treadmill on the side.

Bad memories. Spamming trade chat for LFG as a DPS was not good memories.

The sad state of MMORPGS really. I cross my fingers that we see what Dark Souls did to to the action adventure genre in MMO land. Bring back the difficulty, remove the hand holding, and let you experience the world again instead of chase after mindless quest markers doing piss easy content."

It was not that hard before. People used quest markers add ons and hint books or web sites. It is just more convenience now.

Do you agree?

Nope.

[Kyanion]

There is no doubt WoW's revenue is impressive and so is its timespan, nobody is disputing that. The quality of the game however is much lower and a shadow of its previous self.

And I am glad people like you stopped playing the game. Compared to WoD the quality of the game is vastly improved with plenty of things to do. I enjoy M+ dungeons and the raids. Just because you don't like the game anymore does not mean Blizz needs to bow down to you and present you with Legacy. You sure as hell don't deserve it considering how fast you are to bash Blizz.

What if they give you legacy but it is on a patch you don't like. Going to storm out and yell "Legacy WoW is a shadow of its previous self!". Of course you fucking would.

[haxartus]

And I am glad people like you stopped playing the game. Compared to WoD the quality of the game is vastly improved with plenty of things to do. I enjoy M+ dungeons and the raids.

Yeah. Compared to WoD. What about compared to Wrath ? If the game wants to survive, it should constantly improve, not go downhill one expansion and try to recover the next.

[crusadernero]

That wow has less players now than in wotlk is a given. The people who played back then are now older(meaning jobs, family++) and many just get tierd of the game/genre and move on to other games. I remember when wow came out, I would spend many years playing that for hours upon hours. Me and friends could sit an entire weekend playing wow. Can I do that today? Not really, nor do I want to. Goes with any game out there. I just dont have that in me anymore since I passed 30.

I still love playing games, both on my xbox and PC. What has changed is everything else in my life. I got commitments(work, football coach, friends, girlfriend). But, with my changes in life, wow has also changed. Personally, I would say for the better. If wow was like classic today in terms of time commitment, I would not have a chance to dip into content as much as I can now in legion.

The times have changed, both for us and the MMORPG genre. Sure, there is a place for hardcore mmos, but Blizzard didnt want that for wow. They want to reach out to as many as possible with the great game they have.

If wow didnt changed over the years, the game surely would be dead.

[Maudib]

And this is the mentality of the millenial and why the game has turned into the crap it is now. Have to summon 3 people out of 25? Not too bad if you ask me. Now you LFR and have people auto zoned in... and out... at a whim. Without ever having to say hello. Or even caring. What a great mmo.

Or they were just elitist pricks who thought their time was more important then the rest of the grps. It was fairly common to have to always summon 3 people. Not because they were a bit slower, got stuck or attacked in route, naa they were just chillin in town somewhere or still at the opposite end of the map 10mins later.

As for the decline, I was seeing this month's before TBC dropped, so definitely not at Wows decline. As for dumbing down of the game, the game has always had an easy entry level requirement..

[Ehzurhadn]

I think a number of things eroded it over time. I can agree to some extent, but I believe there was more to it than what you listed. If you ask 50 people, you'll get at least 20 answers. For me personally, it was what Cataclysm did to the world. To my "home". The oversimplification of talents, was the last straw. Sure, there were other things that I wasn't wild about, but none of those really leap to mind all these years later. The big one, was the world changes.

[haxartus]

Basically, the lack of major changes. People don't want to be playing the same game for 12 years.

Each expansion is basically the same: you do quests to max level, then some dungeons, then some raids, maybe some pvp and wait for the next patch/expansion. Maybe they tweak a few numbers, they add a new race/class, new mounts, but it's basically the same thing as before, just slightly changed. World Quests, for example, are basically dailies.

Nothing major changes ever. An example for a major change would be the game moving form a tab targeting to an action combat.

Or doing branching storylines where the player has to make a choice and they have to stick with it permanently. Maybe the NPC tells me to kill someone during a quest, but I let them live and tell the NPC that I killed them. Then maybe something happens in the future.

Or updating the game engine so things around the world are not statically glued and react to player actions (why can't I stop fire with ice spells ?).

But they risk losing players that like the old system, so they will never change it. Nobody does this, this is why games die over time. They don't evolve to keep the players interested, mostly from fear of losing the current players. I think that WoW will survive at least 3 more expansions, maybe even will hit the 20 year mark. But every game has to die at some point.

[FuxieDK]

Basically, the lack of major changes. People don't want to be playing the same game for 12 years.

LOL.. WHAT??

First of all, there are lots and lots of major changes, second, major changes in the biggest reason, people loose interest. People want <insert favorite class/spec> to behave the same way it did, when they fell in love with it.

Take Moonkin as an example: Eclipse system have been reworked, EVERYTHING SINGLE EXPANSION.. You basically have to learn how to Moonkin every two years. People do not want this. They want the moonkin as it was "last expansion"..
Same for Warlocks, Mages, Enh Shaman, Hunters and Protect Paladins (probably more, but those are classes/specs I play regularly)..

Major changes are ALWAYS bad, even when they are good..

[haxartus]

LOL.. WHAT??

First of all, there are lots and lots of major changes.

No there aren't.

I can't speak for druid, but frost mage has been pretty much the same. Freeze stuff -> deal damage to it -> keep it away form you -> repeat until it dies. Slight tweaks or adding and removing spells don't count as major changes.

Also, class changes are generally a different thing since people have different opinions about them. I'm talking about changes to the core gameplay of the entire game.

We have tank, dps and healer roles. Well, how about adding a 4th role ? How about changing the existing roles a bit...

[MagusHenosis]

That wow has less players now than in wotlk is a given. The people who played back then are now older(meaning jobs, family++) and many just get tierd of the game/genre and move on to other games. I remember when wow came out, I would spend many years playing that for hours upon hours. Me and friends could sit an entire weekend playing wow. Can I do that today? Not really, nor do I want to. Goes with any game out there. I just dont have that in me anymore since I passed 30.

I still love playing games, both on my xbox and PC. What has changed is everything else in my life. I got commitments(work, football coach, friends, girlfriend). But, with my changes in life, wow has also changed. Personally, I would say for the better. If wow was like classic today in terms of time commitment, I would not have a chance to dip into content as much as I can now in legion.

The times have changed, both for us and the MMORPG genre. Sure, there is a place for hardcore mmos, but Blizzard didnt want that for wow. They want to reach out to as many as possible with the great game they have.

If wow didnt changed over the years, the game surely would be dead.

Ironically, it was making changes that almost killed WoW in WoD.

Truly ironically so indeed.

You work for Blizzard, don't you??? It really seems like you do considering how you are speaking about the game here.

No, sorry, it's not all in the minds of the players, and things are OBJECTIVELY MUCH DIFFERENT NOW!!! And in this players opinion, much worse than in TBC!!!

Whatever happened to most of the class buffs after all for example???

They were removed???

Since there was no point, right???

BUT THERE WAS A POINT OK!!! SINCE IN PVP IT TOOK MAD SKILLS TO BE ON THE BALL WITH REBUFFING, AS DISPELS HAPPENED!!!

Here is the thing though, most of you LOVE IT this way, since it means you don't need to be as good in order to do decent.

Long story short, the game has been dumbed down, and made where skill just isn't very important anymore, and tons of you LOVE IT!!!

Please don't try and tell me that it's all in my head, since it's not, and things are as they are, if you know how they are or not, or like it or not!!!!

It's like THAT OK!!!

[Saucerian]

"There was a time when loot was exciting instead of generic, dungeons were hard, leveling was part of the experience (and not a 3 day chore to endgame), community was king, and inconvenience just lead to good memories. Now it's just a lobby to pug raid in for ever increasing boring stat increases on forgettable items, with a Facebook game style treadmill on the side.

The sad state of MMORPGS really. I cross my fingers that we see what Dark Souls did to to the action adventure genre in MMO land. Bring back the difficulty, remove the hand holding, and let you experience the world again instead of chase after mindless quest markers doing piss easy content."

-Equestria



Do you agree?

Yep. The experience has been distilled nearly to the point of "log in, collect random loot".

Reversion to more game, less casino, plz.

[MagusHenosis]

I am getting REALLY tired of this same thing again and again here.

People say it's all in the heads of the ones who are displeased that the game isn't what it used to be.

THEN.....

I explain IN GREAT DETAIL, AND WITH IMPECCABLE LOGIC WHY IT IS OBJECTIVELY DIFFERENT, BUT IT JUST SEEMS TO GO IN ONE EAR, AND OUT THE OTHER!!!

PLEASE STOP DENYING REALITY THERE BLIZZARD!!!

THE GAME WAS "DUMBED DOWN" OK, IT JUST WAS!!!

PLEASE LISTEN TO REASON HERE OK!!!

IT IS VERY MUCH NOT ALL IN MY MIND, IT REALLY IS NOT!!!

I HAVE BEEN TELLING YOU FOR YEARS NOW THAT IT ISN'T GOOD TO "DUMB THE GAME DOWN" OK!!!!

Perhaps it's time to finally listen to reason YO.

The game would be MUCH higher quality if it wasn't so tailored to a "no player left behind" philosophy, it really would be OK.....

[Luckx]

Many things did but it was not LFR,templates and CRZ. Without templates new players doing PVP for the first time would be two shotted.

[MagusHenosis]

Many things did but it was not LFR,templates and CRZ. Without templates new players doing PVP for the first time would be two shotted.

Look, I am really not trying to put words in your mouth here, but it sounds A LOT like what you are saying is that the game is better off being "idiot proof," (choose your own words, since it doesn't matter what you call it really) where it is far less likely that they will mess up??

I mean, you just said that "without templates new players doing PvP for the first time would be two shotted," right???

Here is the thing though, it's not the "new players" in general that are getting the most out of them, it really is not OK.

Who is then???

It is THE UNSKILLED PLAYERS in general who are getting the most out of them, and I have news for you, there are TONS of players that have been playing a LONG TIME, who are ALMOST TOTALLY SKILL-LESS!!!

How is this possible???

Well, since Blizzard made skill almost a total non-factor in a lot of cases, THAT'S HOW!!!

And now we have come full circle, to why the game is such a piece of shit, and why it is a WASTELAND of horrid, delusional, entitled players, who just want MORE HANDOUTS!!!

OK???

That is how it is!!!

It is this disgusting philosophy now, where "no player is left behind," and where entitlement is VERY MUCH CATERED TO!!!

I am so sick and tired of hearing about how it's all in my head, and how "LFR/CRZ aren't the problem, and....blah....blah....blah!!!"

YES THEY ARE IN FACT PROBLEMS, AND BIG ONES AT THAT.....TO ME AT LEAST!!!

I SEE PLENTY OF OTHER THINGS, SUCH AS THE REMOVAL OF REFORGING AND CLASS BUFFS AS PROBLEMS TOO FYI!!!

AND I WOULD LIKE TO THINK THAT MY OPINION WOULD MATTER.....AS THE BEST PLAYER FOR PVP IN GENERAL......BY FAR......

THE GAME HAS BECOME ABSURDLY SHALLOW, AND NON-CHALLENGING, IT REALLY HAS OK!!!

THINGS ARE AS THEY ARE......THEY REALLY ARE YO......AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO KNOW HOW THEY ARE......FOR THEM TO BE THAT WAY!!!

THAT IS A VERY IMPORTANT LESSON TO LEARN IN LIFE OK!!!

IT'S NOT ABOUT WHAT WE THINK, OR WHAT WE WANT!!!

NO SIR!!!

IT IS INSTEAD ABOUT WHAT IS!!!

THAT'S ALL THAT MATTERS YO.

- - - Updated - - -

Guys, people were bitching about the long grinds, but if you took that away, then there would be ALMOST NO CHALLENGE LEFT AT ALL!!!

To me that sounds like the plane crashing into the mountain......it really does OK.

But to LOTS of you???

It sure sounds like heaven, now doesn't it???

But it's actually hollow as hell in reality, isn't it???

Nice massive unfair advantage.....I mean skill there bro!!!

YOU DA BEST YO!!!

YOU ARE ALL THE BEST!!!

AND SINCE YOU ARE ALL THE BEST, I CAN'T BE THE BEST, EVEN THOUGH I ACTUALLY AM IN REALITY!!!

REALLY LOL???

IT'S PROBABLY BEST TO NOT EVEN THINK ABOUT SUCH THINGS THOUGH, SINCE WHO NEEDS THE TRUTH AND LOGIC AFTER ALL.....RIGHT???

Well, it would seem that I do lol......in order to be this absurdly amazing!!!

Again, probably just nevermind that, since whatever, right???

Foolish much there guys???

Just saying OK.....

*rolls eyes*

[Maudib]

Basically, the lack of major changes. People don't want to be playing the same game for 12 years.

I disagree. All they have done are drastic changes... which have buried the simple progression. All WoW ever needed was new lore, new gear, new enemies... all built around the same old time tested formula of world adventure, gearing up, and feel powerful.

[Kyanion]

I disagree. All they have done are drastic changes... which have buried the simple progression. All WoW ever needed was new lore, new gear, new enemies... all built around the same old time tested formula of world adventure, gearing up, and feel powerful.

And you assume that wouldn't have killed the game? You don't know how that would have played out in reality you just ASSUME it would have went just fine and WoW would be well over 12mil subs and there would be rainbows and puppies and kitties.

Instead you'd rather shit on the amazing fact that this game has been around almost 13 years raking in the amount of cash it does.

[Leyre]

pages like mmo-champion

[epLe]

Many things did but it was not LFR,templates and CRZ. Without templates new players doing PVP for the first time would be two shotted.

Even without or with functioning templates (still capped at i.e i800 or something), "new players doing PVP for the first time" would still be 2shot, pose no threat to others, and be totally cannon fodder.

But there is nothing wrong with that, it is working as intended.
Templates got introduced only because Blizzard listen to silly whine about "forced to PvE to PvP successfully".

Since Vanilla the incentive to raid is to gear up for PvP for very many players.
Alot of the PvP changes done through the expansions, was to prevent the opposite. That PvE'ers don't have to PvP.

Trying to combine "PvP'ers should not have reasons to PvE" and "PvE'ers no reason to PvP" makes for a miserable system.

[darklogrus]

And this is the mentality of the millenial and why the game has turned into the crap it is now. Have to summon 3 people out of 25? Not too bad if you ask me. Now you LFR and have people auto zoned in... and out... at a whim. Without ever having to say hello. Or even caring. What a great mmo.

3 people out of 25 no big deal, have to summon 4 people out of 5 in Vanilla, big problem. Like I said from the start, the idiotic mentality has always been there. People socializing or not socializing really falls on them and not the game. Ive had grps from Vanilla to Legion that would either talk non stop, or barely say a word other then "hi" an "thanks".