Mythic plus killed the raiding scene.

[judgementofantonidas]

What's wrong with Mythic +? Probably the best end game feature they have added to WoW since...raiding. It's like raiding, but with a much tighter group, less time commitment (per run) and infinitely scaling challenge.

now this is the laughable post. mythic plus being end game.

[GKLeatherCraft]

What's wrong with Mythic +? Probably the best end game feature they have added to WoW since...raiding. It's like raiding, but with a much tighter group, less time commitment (per run) and infinitely scaling challenge.

I'll agree with this one, I enjoy it because I can actually get the time to do it, I never had enough time to dedicate 4hours. 2 or 3 times a week, But with this you still get decent gear for a decent challenge^^

The only issue with it is this WoWProgress crap, It doesn't even work properly as a website, But I suppose that's a good way of rooting out the tards, The people who only invite you based on your "WPDERPSCORE" lol

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now this is the laughable post. mythic plus being end game.

Laughable how? It is endgame for many people, I'm sorry you don't think so but it doesn't make it true, It quite literally is "endgame" Endgame in WoW being the stuff you do when you reach max level...Lol

[Osmeric]

do you find the irony in your own words? and I'm done with you

He was mocking you.

[Akalaka]

Titanforging did more damage to mythic raiding than Mythic+ ever did

[Osmeric]

That's one thing I don't understand... why? I am genuinely curious why LFR is so hated by some people.

Because LFR is the galling evidence that the MMO design world doesn't revolve around them.

[xcitng]

raiding died (for me at least) because of token wow, spend 1502 hour raiding and a guy who doesn't live in a shit of country buy some tokens, get gold in-game, buy boost, and here gear far superior than me with zero effort
and if u don't believe check twisting nether EU trade chat, they sell every raid u want on every difficulty
I raided hardcore during wrath, managed few server firsts with my guild, strict schedule 3 nights 25 raids 3 10 men etc, trying to do all there is, back then i felt rewarded for what i do, now i see ppl just because game sub don't cost them over 10% of their salary can spare few more $$, buy tokens, and get everything and more than i bust my ass trying to get, so now for me game is just altoholic very casual sh8t and nothing else

Why do you care what other people get? boosting has existed forever....

[Maybach]

The things that damaged raiding were:

Getting rid of 10 man raiding and making it fixed 20 man

Lower and lower numbers of players each year

Mythic + has injected some new activity into the game and probably kept players in WoW

[judgementofantonidas]

I'll agree with this one, I enjoy it because I can actually get the time to do it, I never had enough time to dedicate 4hours. 2 or 3 times a week, But with this you still get decent gear for a decent challenge^^

The only issue with it is this WoWProgress crap, It doesn't even work properly as a website, But I suppose that's a good way of rooting out the tards, The people who only invite you based on your "WPDERPSCORE" lol

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Laughable how? It is endgame for many people, I'm sorry you don't think so but it doesn't make it true, It quite literally is "endgame" Endgame in WoW being the stuff you do when you reach max level...Lol

it would take literally no effort to turn that right back around on you. just because you feel the content you have time for is end game doesnt make it so. raiding and more properly the highest difficulty of raiding is, has been, and always will be the true end game for any accomplished player. An endlessly scaling difficulty level dungeon is nothing but a time waster with no finish line.

[Queen of Hamsters]

Something being "killed" according to people on the internet actually translates into "it's about the same or better than before".

The raiding scene was always small. M+ didn't "kill" anything other than the concept of dungeons growing obsolete. In the end though, it's still DUNGEON content, not raiding.

[americandavey]

raiding died (for me at least) because of token wow, spend 1502 hour raiding and a guy who doesn't live in a shit of country buy some tokens, get gold in-game, buy boost, and here gear far superior than me with zero effort
and if u don't believe check twisting nether EU trade chat, they sell every raid u want on every difficulty
I raided hardcore during wrath, managed few server firsts with my guild, strict schedule 3 nights 25 raids 3 10 men etc, trying to do all there is, back then i felt rewarded for what i do, now i see ppl just because game sub don't cost them over 10% of their salary can spare few more $$, buy tokens, and get everything and more than i bust my ass trying to get, so now for me game is just altoholic very casual sh8t and nothing else

Why do you care what other people get? Selling raid loot (aka boosting) been in the game forever. Vanilla, "Selling under 45 min UD STRAT. TBC, "selling vial ruins" or the "Selling ZA bear mount" etc and etc.

Were you one of those people in vanilla that stood in Ironforge or Org with the latest complete Tier Set or Thunderfury so people can go, "Aww he is so cool!"

Are you against the economy? Buy a token, sell token, someone buys that token, buy a raid slot to get loot or mount, the cycle continues.

[Queen of Hamsters]

if the game was social again, subs would surge higher than 10 million and the raw number of raiders would swell which would thus support the raid community.

The game never stopped being social, nor did it ever have some flawless design making the players feel all carebear about one-another.

Stop blaming the game for your own social ineptitude and be social if that's what you crave.

[D3athsting]

The things that damaged raiding were:

Getting rid of 10 man raiding and making it fixed 20 man

Lower and lower numbers of players each year

Mythic + has injected some new activity into the game and probably kept players in WoW

removing 10man was totally retarded, what was wrong with pandaria system where 10 man and 25 man dropped same loot but 25 man had more chance of warforging? They probably grew tired of trying to balance 2 raid sizes with players crying everywhere "10 man is harder!" "no 25 man is!" "xxx boss is too hard on 10 man!" etc so they decide to end the discussion and said "now hardest raiding is 20 man no less no more, fuck you crybabies!"

[Queen of Hamsters]

removing 10man was totally retarded, what was wrong with pandaria system where 10 man and 25 man dropped same loot but 25 man had more chance of warforging? They probably grew tired of trying to balance 2 raid sizes with players crying everywhere "10 man is harder!" "no 25 man is!" "xxx boss is too hard on 10 man!" etc so they decide to end the discussion and said "now hardest raiding is 20 man no less no more, fuck you crybabies!"

Well yes, they've explained at length why they went with 20-man as their fixed size for the most difficult content.
I doubt they'd return to 10man/25man and 2 difficulties again, but I wouldn't be against it if they did.

[ItsTiddles]

As someone who, at this point in the expansion, exclusively does m+, I would love mythic raid loot. Not banking on titanforge for gear to be higher ilvl? For more classes than not, tier and trinkets from raid are better than anything out of m+? I don't know how m+ killed mythic raiding when mythic raiding is beneficial to those who do m+.

[Aaronioslo]

He was mocking you.

thank you so much for pointing that out, I wasn't aware

[Jahaga]

"Mythic plus killed the raiding scene for me."

Fixed the title for you. I know quite a number of people that enjoy both 5-mans and raiding. They're both something to do in the game and adding Mythic+ to Dungeons made them much more relevant as end game content. I look at both Mythic+ Dungeons and Raiding in general as the main sources of end game content (I strongly dislike PvP). Raiding brings much more people together and the content is challenging, while Mythic+ does the same thing for smaller groups of people.

No, Mythic+ Dungeons did not and will not replace raiding, period.

[Maybach]

removing 10man was totally retarded, what was wrong with pandaria system where 10 man and 25 man dropped same loot but 25 man had more chance of warforging? They probably grew tired of trying to balance 2 raid sizes with players crying everywhere "10 man is harder!" "no 25 man is!" "xxx boss is too hard on 10 man!" etc so they decide to end the discussion and said "now hardest raiding is 20 man no less no more, fuck you crybabies!"

It would make more sense now, especially with the lower numbers of players in the game, to have both 10 and 20 person raids

Blizzard is too stupid to admit it fucked up and continues down the same path to the game losing more and more players

People like M+ because they only need five people, unlike Mythic raids where you need 20 which is simply impossible on some servers

[SpellCleave]

I kinda wish we had slower paced dungeons. We just fly through on Mythics. The whole game needs a slow down imo. But hey, I'm just a wizard who likes to slay dragons.

[Thunderball]

Cataclysm design desicions killed the raiding scene. Can't kill what's already been dead for a long time.

[SirCowdog]

Because LFR is the galling evidence that the MMO design world doesn't revolve around them.

Pretty much this. ^

Hardcore raiders like to feel superior. Before LFR and M+ all the best loot was only available from one place in the entire game, and the entire game was engineered to funnel people into it regardless of whether or not the actually enjoyed it.

Surprise surprise: Along comes options to play the game in different ways, and suddenly the shitlords at the top who would sacrifice their own health and friends for a spot in a top raid don't get to lord their playstyle over everyone else.

As far as I'm concerned, LFR and M+ are two of the best things to ever happen to the MMORPG industry.