Mega-Thread: Mueller investigation

[Skroe]

Surprisingly, I actually read through all of that. It's actually a pretty absorbing read, and very convincing! Especially when he dives into the details revealed by Popadopapopopoulopadopuswhatever his name is.

Earlier today (after you left) I was discussing how I'm actually starting to see/believe Dumbass Dumpy actually did willingly collude. I'm just thinking he didn't REALIZE he was doing it and thought he was simply doing a "deal that would bring the countries together".

Seriously, when you think about it - it's just as simple as Russia playing to his ego.

First, a short story to explain my stance:

Long ago, I had a co-worker that worked with me in the gaming media who had a MASSIVE ego problem. Accolade came by and showed of Bubsy 3D (......). But my co-worker was the one guy who couldn't stop harping on about great he thought it was when we all thought it was utter crap.

I found out later that at their lunch meeting, the media people pulled him aside and told him how amazing he was, and how he was a "real gamer" who understood better than anybody else than our staff what a real game is. They stroked and stroked his ego - and, unto his dying breath, defended that damn game.

I believe this is EXACTLY the same thing with Dumbass Dump probably

Chances are, through his Russia business dealings, they probably stroked his obvious ego as to how he was a "great negotiator/dealmaker" via all his Russian transactions, and when he did his political run - all they had to do was tell him that he was a better politician than American ones... and since they worked well together, that he could be the first to bring Russia and the USA together in blessed harmony! /eyeflutter That he would be more popular than Ronald Regan if he did it! Blah Blah Mount Rushmore Trump's head, blah blah blah....

Which really fits why Dumpy was saying things like "I'm really good at negotiation, so that's why I'd like a chance to give Mideast peace talks a chance" thinking he tamed Russia.

This is also why Dumpy says things like "Wouldn't it be great if America and Russia were together as friends? Wouldn't that be great?"

Seriously, Dump is so damn naive he probably thought he was "bringing peace between the countries" and people would love him via russia making negotiation easy via stroking his ego. He probably thought he already did via his business transactions and didn't see Russia as 'normal' people do (ie. mob rule. Killing reporters. Imprisoning homosexuals/protesters. ect). To him, this wasn't about going "Gwahahaha! I'm going to sell out America!" but probably thought he was going to easily bring the two countries together because, well, they were so nice to him and easy to work with! Unknowing, of course, what a giant hand up his ass feels like as they paraded him around like a orange-painted Muppet.

Seriously, it just all makes sense IMO. What do you think?

Yeah I've been in situations like that to.

I think that is absolutely true what you said. My opinion of Donald Trump hasn't changed in over year and a half. He's to put it bluntly, kind of a loser.

Think about it. This is a guy who has lived at the heart of New York City, Finance Capital of the Human race, and has managed to turn his wealth "only" from about $700 million to about $3 billion in the last 45 years. This despite the two largest economic expansions in American history which disproportionately benefited the wealthy. He became worth "$3 billion" when his peers became worth $25 billion. When they diversified into financial instruments, tech (especially tech), new media and emerging markets, he went into Trump steaks, Trump University, Trump ties, and more Hotels.

Donald Trump would like us to believe he is America's most successful businessman. He isn't even the most successful within 2 square miles of the place he calls home. He is not a Michael Bloomberg for example.

And his peers regard him as something of a tabloid-level joke. The NFL wouldn't sell him a team. He, despite being there for 45 years, didn't have the connections to get in on some of the biggest financial deals of the last 40 years. Donald Trump not being worth $25 billion (and then lying that he's worth $10 billion) says an enormous amount about Donald Trump.

He's kind of a failure. As billionaires go, he's a remarkably underachieveing one.

He's not a smart man. He knows what he knows and doesn't care about what he doesn't know. That also explains why his statements about Japan in the campaign are so 1980s. Because that is the Japan donald Trump knew.

I think what you're describing is entirely possible because the Russia that existed in Donald Trump's head is a frozen in time one that is disconnected from reality, and he lacked in the intellectual curiosity to even quickly re-evaluate that.

Such a man would be open to all sorts of manipulation, by playing to his prejudices.

[Machismo]

So far, nothing that Manafort has been charged with has anything to do with Trump and collusion.
Funny enough it does have things to do with the DNC and Podesta. Curious.

And yet, the third gentleman pleaded guilty to lying about having conversations with Russians about the election, during the campaign, while he was working for Trump.

[Ripster42]

Who was overseeing him, is what I mean. There was somebody immediately above him.

It's been reported that the two un-named people who conferred with each other about covering up the meeting between russia/trump by sending a low level lackey (carter page's eventual meeting in russia) were manafort and gates.

[Bullettime]

So far, nothing that Manafort has been charged with has anything to do with Trump and collusion.
Funny enough it does have things to do with the DNC and Podesta. Curious.

Mueller and the other prosecutors working with him have made moves like this in the past to force flips. This is how they've tackled crime families and syndicates.

Also, George Papadopolous's guilty plea did provide a link directly between the campaign and Russia.

[Zandermill]

And yet, the third gentleman pleaded guilty to lying about having conversations with Russians about the election, during the campaign, while he was working for Trump.

That's quite alright by itself, but I only made a comment on Manafort.

[mage21]

Sessions was his direct above him.

All I've been able to find is that he was part of a volunteer advisory board. Surely there was a main contact within the Trump campaign that he answered to directly. Otherwise that does seem to support the idea that he was low-level "hanger on", eager to prove his worth. Without a chain of command to follow, it makes it much more difficult to connect Papadopoulos up the chain.

Like I said, so many unanswered questions. Back to the waiting game.

[draynay]

All I've been able to find is that he was part of an volunteer advisory board. Surely there was a main contact within the Trump campaign that he answered to directly. Otherwise that does seem to support the idea that he was low-level "hanger on", eager to prove his worth. Without a chain of command to follow, it makes it much more difficult to connect Papadopoulos up the chain.

Oh, is it time to fabricate suitable narratives already?

[Skroe]

I read it. As I said, there's no evidence that anyone hacked the U.S. elections. There never has been any, and certainly not how it has been insinuated by the DNC for these many months.

Keep jerkin' it, Skroe. Except it's embarrassing to watch here on a public forum.

You clearly did not read it and are being a liar again. The guilty plea directly references the fact that the Russia intermediary claimed to have thousands of hillary's emails at a time that was months BEFORE knowledge of the hack was public. That would be hacking the election.

Papadopoulos seeking them out with the approval of the Trump campaign, that, under Papadopoulos assertion, offered ideas on how to build an ongoing Russian-Trump connection by using lower-level intermediaries to keep it out of the public eye, qualifies as collusion.

It's all there. You just haven't read it.

[Zandermill]

George Papadopolous's guilty plea is fine. It was enough to help get the conversation started. I'm sure this colludes to the evidence for the grand jury. However, just because he has plead guilty, doesn't mean it will stick for conviction's during trial.

I'm curious to see how this will go.

[Shalcker]

Papadopolous...
...
I'm sorry, you were lying?

Not actually Putin's niece!

...those Nigerian Princes aren't real either.

[Machismo]

That's quite alright by itself, but I only made a comment on Manafort.

And I was pointing out that the narrative doesn't really work for the other guy, and shows a direct link to Trump and his campaign.

[Skroe]

Not actually Putin's niece!

...those Nigerian Princes aren't real either.

Yes. What's your point? And he continued the relationship anyway lol.

Sit down Russian, we're dealing with you people later.

[mage21]

Oh, is it time to fabricate suitable narratives already?

That's an interesting way to say, "Wonder aloud at the possibilities since we have incomplete information."

[Breccia]

Who was overseeing him, is what I mean. There was somebody immediately above him.

...Trump? I mean, don't advisors basically report to the person they're advising?

Or do you mean Lewandowski, or his replacement, Manafort?

Trump's foreign policy team, including Carter Page let's not forget him, did not appear to have any head.

[Machismo]

George Papadopolous's guilty plea is fine. It was enough to help get the conversation started. I'm sure this colludes to the evidence for the grand jury. However, just because he has plead guilty, doesn't mean it will stick for conviction's during trial.

I'm curious to see how this will go.

Well, one guy already admitted to being guilty, and more are already falling. Manafort has a very long blood trail, and will not be able to escape the charges he has. He will die in prison if he doesn't have damn important information to offer in trade.

[Skroe]

This sure is a delicious Kobe Nothingburger. Mmmmm.

[Breccia]

Surely there was a main contact within the Trump campaign that he answered to directly.

I still think it was Trump. Failing that, it was Lewandowski until he resigned, or Manafort...which doesn't help matters.

[mage21]

...Trump? I mean, don't advisors basically report to the person they're advising?

Or do you mean Lewandowski, or his replacement, Manafort?

Trump's foreign policy team, including Carter Page let's not forget him, did not appear to have any head.

It does not appear that Papadopoulos reported directly to Trump. Nothing suggests that.

[Ripster42]

All I've been able to find is that he was part of a volunteer advisory board. Surely there was a main contact within the Trump campaign that he answered to directly. Otherwise that does seem to support the idea that he was low-level "hanger on", eager to prove his worth. Without a chain of command to follow, it makes it much more difficult to connect Papadopoulos up the chain.

Like I said, so many unanswered questions. Back to the waiting game.

I refer you to Document 19 of Case 1:17-cr-00182-RDM

Particularly pages 8-9.

[Grapemask]

I wish I could frame these tweets and put them on the wall of every Trump supporter and "woke independent." Especially those in this thread. So they could see, every morning and every night, how absolutely moronic their mentality is.

A serious, professional adult - of Trump's own choosing, no less - selected a serious, professional adult to investigate this matter. A man who made a lifelong career out of investigating criminal behavior, from financial slipups to mass murder. That man selected a team of other serious, professional adults who all have the same background. Those men impaneled a serious grand jury filled with serious adults to assist in this matter.

"But but but whatabout" and armchair hypothesizing about what may be wrong with these very serious men reads like nothing but childlike whining. They outclass and outsmart nearly everyone at the discussion table - especially those who are Trump supporters - and they are doing their job appropriately and professionally, because they are serious, professional adults, not whiny internet children sitting on 4chan and r/The_Donald and Twitter slamming their chubby little fists on the keys.

At the same time, watching the outright denial and outrage of Trump supporters has me feeling almost drunk with laughter. You can absolutely feel their minds struggling to process what's happening and come up with a way to make it positive. You can see their own neurons fighting each other in how rapidly these people switch tracks and cling to the loudest positive explanation that sticks out through the noise. There's so much desperation. It's delicious.