Undercity laid waste

[In Ogres We Trust]

At this point, the game and story are rather... well... stale.

[Teaon]

One of the few things we know for sure about B4A is that the Alliance razes Undercity, and the Horde burns Darnassus down in retaliation.

there fixed it for ya, the alliance assaulted Undercity as a revenge for their king.

why would the horde attack Darnassus first?

[iamthedevil]

That is in fact not a thing we know, it's actually far more likely the attack on Undercity is in response to a failed assault on Stormwind.

We do know. Gamespot interview yesterday. Whichever dev it was stated that UC is in retaliation to Darnassus. How Darnassus goes down or why, we don't know.

[Soon-TM]

there fixed it for ya, the alliance assaulted Undercity as a revenge for their king.

why would the horde attack Darnassus first?

Kk my bad

[Tierbook]

Another question to ask, with Darnassus and UC burned where will Night Elves and Undead start? Or will they start just before the attacks and the final quest will be leaving the zone.... Are they redoing the old world again? It's the only way i can see this making sense.

[Deleted]

Another question to ask, with Darnassus and UC burned where will Night Elves and Undead start? Or will they start just before the attacks and the final quest will be leaving the zone.... Are they redoing the old world again? It's the only way i can see this making sense.

They've already said leveling will remain the same, you'll phase into the "modern" events once you hit post-Legion content at 110.

[Krille]

Another question to ask, with Darnassus and UC burned where will Night Elves and Undead start? Or will they start just before the attacks and the final quest will be leaving the zone.... Are they redoing the old world again? It's the only way i can see this making sense.

They already confirmed that the starting experience will still be in the same Undercity/Darnassus (phasing tech). Their reason was that they wanted new people to understand what they lost with UC/Darnassus gone. But as soon as you turn 110 those 2 cities are gone.

[Kathranis]

I do wonder if perhaps after this expansion is done, that it might lead into another update of Azeroth as per Cata.

I almost feel like it will be a necessity, though I don't know whether it means these cities will be retaken and rebuilt, or new cities will be added to replace them.

I think the fact that Teldrassil has actually kind of become an eyesore with the game's increased draw distance might be a major contributing factor to their decision to torch it. The in-game representation -- just a big ugly stump -- absolutely does not deliver the fantasy of what Teldrassil is supposed to be.




So, in my mind it feels like a perfect opportunity to either give the night elves a new capital (either rebuilt Teldrassil or a completely new city) that actually suits their artistic vision, or if not, then to at least replace it with another new capital for another race, like Gilneas.

[Tierbook]

I almost feel like it will be a necessity, though I don't know whether it means these cities will be retaken and rebuilt, or new cities will be added to replace them.

I think the fact that Teldrassil has actually kind of become an eyesore with the game's increased draw distance might be a major contributing factor to their decision to torch it. The in-game representation -- just a big ugly stump -- absolutely does not deliver the fantasy of what Teldrassil is supposed to be.




So, in my mind it feels like a perfect opportunity to either give the night elves a new capital (either rebuilt Teldrassil or a completely new city) that actually suits their artistic vision, or if not, then to at least replace it with another new capital for another race, like Gilneas.

Considering the new continents are horde/alliance only for leveling I think that's where the new capitols will be.... which I'd say is fine, it's not Gilneas but it's the same art style at least.

[Kathranis]

We do know. Gamespot interview yesterday. Whichever dev it was stated that UC is in retaliation to Darnassus. How Darnassus goes down or why, we don't know.

He didn't say which came first, he just described the two scenes. He said one was Sylvanas standing in front of a burning Teldrassil, and the other was the Alliance saying "we've had enough" and attacking Lordaeron.

I wouldn't read too much into it, especially given the effor they've gone to sidestep answering the question.

[iamthedevil]

He didn't say which came first, he just described the two scenes. He said one was Sylvanas standing in front of a burning Teldrassil, and the other was the Alliance saying "we've had enough" and attacking Lordaeron.

I wouldn't read too much into it, especially given the effor they've gone to sidestep answering the question.

Read to much into it?

"And then things happen in the opening of Battle for Azeroth that cement it. Some of the imagery that you'll see is the scene is with Sylvanas standing in front Teldrassil on fire. Then with the opening cinematic, that event was right before the Alliance finally says, "Okay, we've had it" before they assault Lordaeron. "

He straight up states the cinematic is after the tree.

Meh i see what you can see though.

[Elfezen]

Won't these places be re-used as hubs for the opposite faction? Otherwise whats the point of just ruining areas and making them unusable? Same with Theramore it was handled in a very stupid way and they made that place unusable so they had to add the option to travel back in time...

[Doomchicken]

One of the few things we know for sure about B4A is that the Horde burns Darnassus down, and the Alliance razes Undercity down in retaliation. What are your thoughts about losing those cities? In my case, I don't know about Darnassus, but UC was always fairly populated by low level players, due to its strategic placing. Still, it always struck me as a big Halloween pumpkin instead of the dark, terrific place it was always supposed to be, so I won't regret losing it. What do you think?

I think it's a stupid idea to go back to the well of horde vs alliance yet again when we all know there cannot be a winner due to the nature of the game we're playing. And destroying one zone while changing the occupational status of another to hype up a war neither side will win is ridiculous. I'm all for destruction and change if it ultimately makes a positive difference to the story, but I fear this will be akin to theramore 2.0 where ultimately nothing apart from the warchief and the fact there is one less place that we can visit will change by the end of the story.

At this point Blizzard needs to realize that the orcs versus humans/alliance versus horde storyline has been overused to the point that the horse has been beaten to death, resurrected and beaten to death again and need to evolve past this ridiculous theme. In every other fantasy realm if you had 2 major factions fight eachother and then put aside their differences to fight something worse multiple times they'd be smart enough to make a long term alliance, but in this fantasy realm, all the characters are set to chaotic stupid and must always fight and never learn anything. That's bad storytelling in my opinion.

[nothingsjim]

I'm INCREDIBLY annoyed that Blizzard seems to have FORGOTTEN the Forsaken's New Plague exists though, Undercity should have been the most untakable city on the map - any attempt to take it should have been a WRATHGATE 2.0. I hope they'll say something about it once the expansion launches, but what we already know is bad enough, looks like after spending 10 years making it ever more potent has culminated into sweeping it under the rug for convenience's sake, though I'm open to being surprised.

Did you conveniently forget that the New Plague has been deemed immoral by everyone, and even outlawed by Garrosh-Hitler-Hellscream? Can you imagine how would the other Horde Leaders react, especially High Overlord Saurfang, whose son died to the plague, if Sylvanas starts using them?? Do you think they would still rally behind her and come to defend Undercity if she uses it?

I don't think Blizzard has forgotten about the Plague, it's just Sylvanas, now Warchief of the Horde, cannot use the plague lest it drives her allies away, much to her annoyance. I do believe, the Plague will play a role, once Alliance retake Lordaeron...

Sylvanas would hid caches of New Plague in various places in Undercity, ready to blow at a moment of notice. She would set it off months, or even years after Alliance has retaken Lordaeron, killing thousands and turn them all into Undead, similar to Sept of Baelor in Game of Thrones, except instead of Wildfire, you get Undead Plague (They both look green!). This way, she gets away with it because noone on Horde's side can blame her, and she can easily convince them it's Alliance accidentally setting off the plague that she has absolutely no intention of using.

Lastly, may I use a quote from our trustworthy Dreadlord who advised Sylvanas for years.
Varimathras: So, your Alliance still endures. Longer than I expected, though she has already planted the seeds of its downfall. She is patient, that one.

[zanzan28]

I always thought that they'd get to the point where they'd need to do something major to shake up the faction conflict, and that the Alliance retaking Lordaeron would be a great place to start. I also think that retaking Gilneas and making it a major player city (with the Night Elves moving in as a return favour for their accommodation of the Gilneans in Cataclysm) should also happen. The Exodar and Silvermoon look like they could be the sites of epic battles as they try to defend their cities in enemy territory.

I love the idea and I hope it works out well.

^ 100% right here. Hope this all happens.

[Kathranis]

Read to much into it?

"And then things happen in the opening of Battle for Azeroth that cement it. Some of the imagery that you'll see is the scene is with Sylvanas standing in front Teldrassil on fire. Then with the opening cinematic, that event was right before the Alliance finally says, "Okay, we've had it" before they assault Lordaeron. "

He straight up states the cinematic is after the tree.

Meh i see what you can see though.

He doesn't, though. He describes the Lordaeron cinematic after describing the Teldrassil scene.


It's like if I said, "Here's a photo of the atomic bomb being dropped on Hiroshima. And here's a photo of some Japanese pilots before they attack Pearl Harbor."

It can easily be misinterpreted, which is why I'm cautioning not to read into it. Unless the guy slipped up, it seems like they really intend to keep the lid on the order of events. They spent all Blizzcon dodging the question.

[Deleted]

Did you conveniently forget that the New Plague has been deemed immoral by everyone, and even outlawed by Garrosh-Hitler-Hellscream? Can you imagine how would the other Horde Leaders react, especially High Overlord Saurfang, whose son died to the plague, if Sylvanas starts using them?? Do you think they would still rally behind her and come to defend Undercity if she uses it?

I don't think Blizzard has forgotten about the Plague, it's just Sylvanas, now Warchief of the Horde, cannot use the plague lest it drives her allies away, much to her annoyance. I do believe, the Plague will play a role, once Alliance retake Lordaeron...

Sylvanas would hid caches of New Plague in various places in Undercity, ready to blow at a moment of notice. She would set it off months, or even years after Alliance has retaken Lordaeron, killing thousands and turn them all into Undead, similar to Sept of Baelor in Game of Thrones, except instead of Wildfire, you get Undead Plague (They both look green!). This way, she gets away with it because noone on Horde's side can blame her, and she can easily convince them it's Alliance accidentally setting off the plague that she has absolutely no intention of using.

Lastly, may I use a quote from our trustworthy Dreadlord who advised Sylvanas for years.
Varimathras: So, your Alliance still endures. Longer than I expected, though she has already planted the seeds of its downfall. She is patient, that one.

The plague WAS being used in Legion - re-play Stormheim's intro. It was outlawed in Cataclysm by Garrosh and continued to be used in a watered down but STILL destructive fashion, once the orcs were removed from the undercity it was being developed again and is being deployed in use against the alliance as well as being used to tip Sylvanas' and Nathanos' arrows.

Sylvanas HAS used the plague in petty conflict with the alliance almost no time ago, the idea she wouldn't use it when the undercity, the ONLY home the forsaken have, which was allegedly the reason she decided to stave off killing herself after her revenge plot against Arthas ran it's course is ludicrous - it's been used against the alliance when they were supposed to be at truce with the horde, it seems pretty justifiable to use it when your capital is being demolished.

[Amnaught]

I honestly would have rather seen the level 110-120 zones be the transformed Lordaeron and Teldrassil-Darkshore. I'm much more interested in what's going on in my homeland.

[Alvito]

Darnassus has always been one of my favorites. It's such a beautiful capital and i'm quite sad it's going.

Undercity is also great, I think i'll miss the above ruins move though, the Undercity itself has always been too cartoony for me to take it seriously

This is also a great way for them to fix all the 3 sided trees and other chopping hollow graphics there. Both of those cities have some of the worst art assets out of each factions capitol cities.

[CreatureLives]

Do we know for sure if Undercity gets destroyed or if it just gets taken back? I hope it gets taken back and restored to what it once was.