Vanilla raid difficulty should be increased

[Deleted]

For vanilla longevity it would be better to increase a bit of HP or Damage or add stricter enrage timers for all raid bosses, because nowadays we have many useful addons, good PCs with 60+ fps, stable connection, knowledge of fights and etc.

It will be very sad to see how all those raids will be cleared very fast and we get no more content.

For example MC can be cleared now with 20 ppl instead of 40 even with shitty gear and this is not fun!

I think those raids should be dangerous and mysterious just like in 2005-2006, only then we can have the same atmosphere.

Thats the only one change i want to vanilla.

[VincentWolf]

No. I quit wow soon after they introduced this overtuned heroic/mythic bullshit, I don't want this to happen to vanilla/tbc as well. It literary sucked all the epicness and fun out of the game.

[Allenschezar]

hm i would want it to be the same. I reallly liked the difficulty back then.

The only thing i'm worried is the size. I liked the 40 man raids a lot. But when i think of my latest experience on live servers many guilds on my realm struggle to even get 20 people to raid mythic.

So i dunno about that. Really hope there will be a good guild on EU i can join to raid the 40 man raids again.

[Taeldorian]

No sir. No changes should be made whatsoever unless it’s impossible to take away (like Battle.net).

I think Raids will definitely be a joke. The addons we currently have are so fucking overkill for vanilla raids it’s crazy. Vanilla raid bosses have like 3-4 mechanics. Addons advances so far (and player skill level as well) that blizzard has needed to add more and more mechanics to keep raids challenging in more ways than just “need more gear” we now have 8-10 mechanics sometimes more.

Not only that but vanilla raid content has been accessible for 12+ years. There are thousands of guides for vanilla that have been made throughout that time. We have so much more knowledge going into vanilla now then we did back then it’s going to make raiding very very easy.

However, nothing should be changed because of that. Give everyone what they asked for AKA vanilla.

[Deleted]

For vanilla longevity it would be better to increase a bit of HP or Damage or add stricter enrage timers for all raid bosses, because nowadays we have many useful addons, good PCs with 60+ fps, stable connection, knowledge of fights and etc.

It will be very sad to see how all those raids will be cleared very fast and we get no more content.

For example MC can be cleared now with 20 ppl instead of 40 even with shitty gear and this is not fun!

I think those raids should be dangerous and mysterious just like in 2005-2006, only then we can have the same atmosphere.

Thats the only one change i want to vanilla.

As soon as you start tweaking stuff you can no longer call it vanilla can you?
Also 20 people now does not equal 20 people in vanilla. Classes are at least twice as strong at level 60 than they were in vanilla.

[Barnabas]

For vanilla longevity it would be better to increase a bit of HP or Damage or add stricter enrage timers for all raid bosses, because nowadays we have many useful addons, good PCs with 60+ fps, stable connection, knowledge of fights and etc.

It will be very sad to see how all those raids will be cleared very fast and we get no more content.

For example MC can be cleared now with 20 ppl instead of 40 even with shitty gear and this is not fun!

I think those raids should be dangerous and mysterious just like in 2005-2006, only then we can have the same atmosphere.

Thats the only one change i want to vanilla.

You can't because you can't put as many debuffs up as you want in vanilla raids. There are limited slots available on the bosses. If you want things like they are now then BfA is what you want to play.

In Vanilla WoW the number of debuffs that may be applied to a creature at one time was originally 8, but was later increased to 16 in patch 1.7.0.

[dexx]

nowadays For example MC can be cleared now with 20 ppl instead of 40 even with shitty gear and this is not fun!

Thats in current Wow. But isnt the point of Classic to be like it was? It was MUCH harder back then. So i'd expect Classic to be similarly much harder.
As for addons, just make it that none of them will work.

[bmjclark]

You can't because you can't put as many debuffs up as you want in vanilla raids. There are limited slots available on the bosses. If you want things like they are now then BfA is what you want to play.

What does that even have to do with what he said? lol. The debuff slot limit doesn't really matter too much, even private server guilds assigned certain debuffs to be allowed on the boss (curse of shadows/elements, sunder, shadow vulnerability). Still leaves room for dots from classes that it actually matters to.

I honestly expect these raids to fall over, even to pugs right up until aq40. Aq40 and Naxx will get cleared easily by guilds that are half decent. It doesn't mean these servers won't be a fun experience, but if you're looking for actually challenging raids, raid mythic on live because you wont find them in vanilla.

[Ettan]

As soon as you start tweaking stuff you can no longer call it vanilla can you?
Also 20 people now does not equal 20 people in vanilla. Classes are at least twice as strong at level 60 than they were in vanilla.

Yep this.

I have actually 4 manned ALL of molten core back in wod, even with the annoying silence elementals.

Bwl it was the same, only the second boss was actually a challange. Needed perfect rng on the debuff with 2 combat resses + 1 ahnk and a soulstone still got it down eventually. Having a cd on dispells made chromaggus abit iffy, but not that bad really.

In Aq40 the only really difficult boss for our 4 man group was princess, for the wyvern sting (hits ten nearest players and sleeps them so with less than 10 it hits everyone irregardless of range) The only way we could cheese it was getting lucky, with tanks utilizing their spider senses and having major defensives up for it.

Everything else you could simply beat by having too much healing/ too big hp pool.
But yea that was 4 fully bis/broken 60 twinks w/o any limitations.

I would say keep it as it is and change nothing except integrating bnet.

[Deleted]

As soon as you start tweaking stuff you can no longer call it vanilla can you?
Also 20 people now does not equal 20 people in vanilla. Classes are at least twice as strong at level 60 than they were in vanilla.

Thats in current Wow. But isnt the point of Classic to be like it was? It was MUCH harder back then. So i'd expect Classic to be similarly much harder.
As for addons, just make it that none of them will work.

Im not talking about current wow, i was talking about famous pirate server.

[Sevarin]

for all the love people seemed to have for vanilla, they sure do wanna change almost every aspect of it.

[Tekkommo]

As soon as you start tweaking stuff you can no longer call it vanilla can you?
Also 20 people now does not equal 20 people in vanilla. Classes are at least twice as strong at level 60 than they were in vanilla.

Back in Vanilla half of your 40 man raid was afk. MC was often cleared with 20-25 people as well.

Raids are going to be cleared instantly, but I don't think they'll increase difficulty.

Maybe they should give the option of having harder versions (mythic+ style), but it doesn't drop more or better loot, it's only for bragging rights. But even that would cause a shit storm.

[grexly75]

Dear OP from your post it shows that you don't really want classic WoW, you want a bastardized version of it that will no longer be considered classic..

- - - Updated - - -

for all the love people seemed to have for vanilla, they sure do wanna change almost every aspect of it.

Which shows that all the whinging and harping on from the pro legacy group wanting proper legacy servers was all hot air.. I think that Blizzard will regret kowtowing to this group by announcing these servers..

[Blezius]

If you want longevity a good suggestion would be to have progression servers later on that advance to TBC and WOTLK.

[Sparklelord]

For vanilla longevity...
It will be very sad to see how all those raids will be cleared very fast and we get no more content.

Rumor has it, since they're creating a unique team for the project, that they'll probably also create new 'vanilla' content that feels 'vanilla' pending it's all successful and people want it.

[Barnabas]

What does that even have to do with what he said? lol. The debuff slot limit doesn't really matter too much, even private server guilds assigned certain debuffs to be allowed on the boss (curse of shadows/elements, sunder, shadow vulnerability). Still leaves room for dots from classes that it actually matters to.

I honestly expect these raids to fall over, even to pugs right up until aq40. Aq40 and Naxx will get cleared easily by guilds that are half decent. It doesn't mean these servers won't be a fun experience, but if you're looking for actually challenging raids, raid mythic on live because you wont find them in vanilla.

It matters because everyone can't use all of their debuffs on the boss as they see fit. So if every spec was viable you would end up overlapping debuffs all the time and it would be pointless. It was the intended vanilla raid mechanic that applied to mobs. If you want the actual experience then that is what is to be expected. No not all private servers changed that and the ones that did so what? Well of course the raids that have been going on private servers will do well. It doesn't take a rocket surgeon to figure this out. People play for fun and the experience. Like I said if you like things the way they are now then play BfA. There is nothing wrong with that.

[Deleted]

well a full geared cloth lvl 60 in vanilla had 3k hp.

a lvl 29 char today has 3k hp.

a debuff in vanilla ticked with 2k hp sometimes. sometimes damage numbers in naxx-vanilla were higher than damage numbers from the same boss in naxx-wotlk although players had 20k hp instead of 3k.

[grexly75]

If you want longevity a good suggestion would be to have progression servers later on that advance to TBC and WOTLK.

Terrible idea as then where does it stop? Does it stop at TBC, WoTLK, Cata, MoP, WoD then Legion? For doing that you are just re releasing all of the previous expacs all over again which is just plain stupid..

[Blezius]

Terrible idea as then where does it stop? Does it stop at TBC, WoTLK, Cata, MoP, WoD then Legion? For doing that you are just re releasing all of the previous expacs all over again which is just plain stupid..

What ? when retail players argue about classic servers you come out and say " let everyone play what they enjoy , its a sepetste server , bla bla bla " and a lot of people want progression servers and not just static vanilla, you dont like the idea? Guess what, a lot of people do.

[Deleted]

It will be very sad to see how all those raids will be cleared very fast and we get no more content.

For example MC can be cleared now with 20 ppl instead of 40 even with shitty gear and this is not fun!

Some people keep saying this, but I don't think we have hard evidence of this, just speculation (and a bunch of ego-defenses). They should raid test how the old raids hold up, and decide based on that.