99% of pro-change people never played Classic

[Ferocity]

I'm always amused at how arrogant and/or delusional some of you "purist" vanilla wow players are. You guys so CANNOT fathom that not everyone wants the exact same thing to the point you accuse almost everyone in the "classic but with changes" group of trolling or shitposting. I thought you guys were suppose to be "community orientated" and more accepting. Looks more like you're just another self important elitist group to me.

But that's actually true. People who wanted Classic, they want the exactly same Classic (or as faithfully reconstructed to be as close to authentic as possible). They want exactly same thing!

It is the other people who suddenly swarmed this idea and started demanding changes and calling things broken, while most of those "broken" things were exactly why people liked Classic. Most of pro-change people never played or enjoyed Classic but think they have some right to ruin it for those who actually liked old WoW for what it was.

Pro-changers should just admit to themselves - they don't really want Classic as it was, they want something else. That's ok, people have different tastes, but why ruin it for those who wanted Classic servers (and later TBC/WotLK) for so long? Those servers are coming for us, not for those who want their flashy WoW with modern graphics and all the features of Legion minus Lv.60+ content.

[Truewarlock]

99% of all people who demand such and such changes, they never actually played Classic.

99% of all people who demand such and such changed played classic, that's why Blizzard changed things in BC and then in Wotlk

[Fjordkeeper]

99% of all people who demand such and such changes, they never actually played Classic. They are too dumb to understand that people feel nostalgy for old WoW with its graphics, with its pluses AND minuses.

I greatly fear for future of Classic servers if this overly loud minority will screw it for us.

People like them already caused the ruination of old WoW by constantly demanding changes on retail. Why can't they stick to Legion with all its new graphics, security updates, addons' API, homogenized classes and such?

I hope Blizzard won't do half-a**ed job and will actually reconstruct Classic as it was. With original client, original graphics, original UI, original gameplay. THAT one original WoW that veterans miss so much.

And to people who demand changes: go to Legion, you have everything you want there....

The thing is that different people, want different things.

I of course agree with you that drastic changes could completely ruin the vanilla servers.
But I also get the people who remember some of the absolutely horrible aspects that come with vanilla wow.

One guy might want to play vanilla exactly how it was.
Another guy might want to play vanilla but with some of the changes in later expansions.

The point is: Everyone wants something else.

So if they implement vanilla just like it was in the old days, you will inevitably get a lot of people whining in the forums that they want this and that changed because it actually sucked ass in vanilla.

Who is right and who is wrong?
Would you simply make a poll to let people decide?

That would be a horrible idea since people don't know what's best for them.

[Daffan]

Made-up statistics and shit aside, I will throw in my anecdotal evidence. LITERALLY every person that I know from vanilla that I'm still in contact with wants to play Classic and for there to be no changes. The people I knew from Nost are against changes as well. Obviously this does not represent the entire world, but it sure does suggest to me that the people who ACTUALLY WANTED CLASSIC are probably not the same people pushing for changes.

hahahahahah no. A lot of people from Nost for instance want cheaper respecs this time around, as does many in the priv scene community.

I played retail vanilla and I think some minor changes are good, as long as the core design of Vanilla stays intact.

[Doomchicken]

But that's actually true. People who wanted Classic, they want the exactly same Classic (or as faithfully reconstructed to be as close to authentic as possible). They want exactly same thing!

It is the other people who suddenly swarmed this idea and started demanding changes and calling things broken, while most of those "broken" things were exactly why people liked Classic. Most of pro-change people never played or enjoyed Classic but think they have some right to ruin it for those who actually liked old WoW for what it was.

Pro-changers should just admit to themselves - they don't really want Classic as it was, they want something else. That's ok, people have different tastes, but why ruin it for those who wanted Classic servers (and later TBC/WotLK) for so long? Those servers are coming for us, not for those who want their flashy WoW with modern graphics and all the features of Legion minus Lv.60+ content.

This is a generalization post and not actually directly aimed at you:
If you want pure vanilla servers that's fine, that's your opinion. if you agree that not everyone wants the exact same thing also fine as you're recognizing a reality and no one says you have to want the same as they. If you're one of those crazies that actually believes that those who want something different are trolls and are only trolling or shitposting or lying, that's bullshit and you either know it, or you're delusional as fuck. That's the entire gist of my post in a Tl;Dr version.

[Jyggalag]

I've played Vanilla and everything since. I'm a massive legacy server advocate. Now we've got one, I'm determined to see it succeed. This means QoL improvements.

I'm currently playing on a TBC private server, and recently downloaded Vanilla in the wake of the Classic announcement. It's fucking garbage by comparison even to TBC. QoL improvements are pretty much mandatory if Blizzard wish to attract anyone outside of the OP and people like him who quit in 2008 and haven't handed Blizzard a $ since...

[Hashtronaut]

I played vanilla, and I support appropriate QoL changes.

As long as they don't go overboard there's definitely an appropriate line. Too far in either extreme would be bad.

[Azadina]

I started in Wrath, but it is impossible to recreate the classic experience. For one , even if they release the original client, that works on modern OS' and only fix that, the graphics would look at least a little better, as your computer has a MUCH better graphics card then whatever you ran it on back then. On top of that your going to be running it most likely on a widescreen monitor, that will also improve the game play immensely.

I don't know if classic wow supported "Windowed full screen" mode, but most people now have two monitors. Theoretically the average Vanilla player was playing on one 4x3 monitor. That made it harder to look things up, less space on the screen for the UI..etc. So back then you were likely sitting in a basement or your "room" playing wow on your computer, if you had to grind something you listened to music maybe or if you were lucky had a TV near by, but for the most part if you were grinding you were bored. Today sure people grind stuff, but we have Netflix or youtube playing on the other screen, or an internet browser.

People WILL figure it out. They will find out tips, tricks, ways to make money, etc. That being said, my only goal is to level a character to 60 and just explore the old pre-cata world again, as I did in wrath.

What I wonder about is if it is the same, if it is as hard and some of the people that are considered "casuals" DON'T find it as hard as everyone says, I wonder what will happen then? Will people's heads explode?

Not even nearly the same. By wrath the xp needed for 1-60 was massively nerfed. Cut in half twice if I remember right. So 25% of original.

Most elite mobs had been nerfed to normal/removed. Rest that remained had their levels and damage nerfed down. Mor'ladim was lvl 38 elite, in duskwood where you were lucky to get 30. In Wrath? 30-32, can't remember which. Why is that important? Well, 38 elite would smash your face with crushing blows almost entirely, while you would hit it back with glancing blows at best, when not missing/dodge/parry.

[Cassidin]

I played vanilla, and I support appropriate QoL changes.

As long as they don't go overboard there's definitely an appropriate line. Too far in either extreme would be bad.

I've recently installed for my own use only, Mangos Zero. I had simply forgotten how much I take for granted. It was SOOO Very basic back then. Hardly any settings you could change in interface compared to now. Maps for caverns etc not available (but I accept that MAY be that the maps for these just arn't in the mangos I have - cant be sure if thats the reason or not), No notifications on the world map where anything is. You have to REALLY study the quest to see where it is you are going - I remember now always looking this up on Thottbot at the time. Some quests tracked - some didnt.

Many will put these latter things down into a "good" category (am not sure one way or another). Some quests that are VERY hard to solo. A level 9 quest in Teldrassil that I only just managed to do at level 12. I remember either skipping this or getting a group for this on live. Another quest that took me over 40 mins to complete where I had to collect some items from some caves. TBH I grew increasingly frustrated this time pullling three mobs at a time the same level as me - some that heal to full regularly while running out of mana after three casts. I got so frustrated that I cheated by giving myself a lvl60 staff which nearly one shot them - but I still had to .revive several times. Again - that quest I used to skip if I couldnt find a group for. Finding groups was good though at the time - it was all new and exciting. This is of course one of the things people WANT with the Classic servers.

I am unsure about the QOL stuff though. Some would be good probably. Some of the new interface options, maybe a toggleable option to see quest objectives (or at least rough areas) on the world map. I am not sure about others though - sharing mounts/pets etc or more so heirlooms (actually those should NOT exist on classic).

[Sarevokcz]

They keep telling me about how awesome Vannilla communities are. But somehow the vanilla forum is full of people, I wouldnt want to see anywhere near my group.
Is that one of those vocal minority things or are vanilla servers just going to be lfr chat on steroids?

its called "barrens chat"!

and yes, the only reason why vanilla community seems better is because there was no lfd and you didnt encounter the dicks, not that they werent there. you preferred to do everything with a guild, since looking for tank for 2 hours only for healer to disconnect when you finally got full group and flew from undercity to thorium point so you could run that LBRS and had to get back to city to spam chat some more was super annoying.

most people dont even realize how much stuff has changed since then, for most of them, it was first time playing MMO, the atmosphere was great, but that wears off quickly nowadays, just basic stuff like being able to ress in raids and run from graveyard back into instance, which changed during AQ when people literally used this tactic on kurinaxx/rajaxx/skeram, metting stones not being summoning stones, limited debuffs on target, several of which were reserved for most important stuff like sunders, CoE and CoS, not to mention dead simple, very slow rotations, since there was no haste

but I guess everyone is looking forward to rogues and ferals having so much downtime they could write in chat between energy ticks, warriors waiting ages for rage and casters taking longass time to cast spells, as pretty much every caster sans eleshaman was using 2.5s or longer as their main and usually their only usefull spell etc.

no thanks, my days, of farming blue dragons in azshara for the three piece 52 level "set" because it was better than the 30 level questing items, that werent replaced at all during the next 20 levels, are over

[Runenwächter]

99% of all people who demand such and such changes, they never actually played Classic. They are too dumb to understand that people feel nostalgy for old WoW with its graphics, with its pluses AND minuses.

I greatly fear for future of Classic servers if this overly loud minority will screw it for us.

People like them already caused the ruination of old WoW by constantly demanding changes on retail. Why can't they stick to Legion with all its new graphics, security updates, addons' API, homogenized classes and such?

I hope Blizzard won't do half-a**ed job and will actually reconstruct Classic as it was. With original client, original graphics, original UI, original gameplay. THAT one original WoW that veterans miss so much.

And to people who demand changes: go to Legion, you have everything you want there....

Or people remember all mage ignites rolling in one pool making it inevitable that one pulls aggro. Or people didnt find buffing Paladin buffs every 5 minutes enjoyable. I recon thats 9 out of 10 paladins. If you dont get your old addons back that at least made the process largely automatic thats probably closer to 10/10 Paladins. Or people remember that you could at one point execute html code through chat. Or people remember that attrocious class balance and class stacking. Or one of the hundreds, if not thousands of balancing issues and bugs.

WoW didnt get worse by people demanding blizz fix that shit. WoW got better, for a long time. When we talk "classic" what patch exactly are we talking about? Original release, including original server hardware? Or the last patch before TBC?

I suggest you consider the following: You can roll back a game to a patch version, but you cant roll back the rest of the internet, the rest of the playerbase and the rest of your own life. No matter what you imagine WoW Classic Servers to be, it will not be 2004 again.

The most serious problem for a success of wow classic servers are whiny little shits that are too mentaly challenged to weight each change on its own merrit to the cause. Or people unhappy with their lives and those who have deep seated mental issues, that hope for the same escapist experience WoW provided them in 2004.

Face it, if people got the WoW you are demanding people will not meet a mix of well adjusted people, casuals and nerds, but they will most likely be amongst people whose nostalgia got fueled by the same personal issues as their own. Perhaps being among likeminded individuals sounds great, but being among likeminded individuals who are inherently miserable in life isnt and that very selection process will shape the spirit of the community on these servers.

I suggest people who fall in that cathegory get help elsewhere and let sensible people make the decisions what balance and quality of life changes should become part of the classic package.

[solarfallz]

No, I am not linking my account on public forum and think what you want, but I did that once, never again.

And look who is BSing now. So EVEN IF I am right, it is still okay? What horse are you riding, if you believe, that no changes should be made in Classic WoW and your opinion is the right one? There is a reason why many specs were laugh at in Vanilla. Many underperformed in PvP, many in PvE, some in both. WoW was never perfect.

The thing about Vanilla WoW is, that many people believed it is okay, if one spec is godlike in PvP but mediocre in PvE and vice-versa, but is that truth? I don't think so, that's why I think balance changes should be made and improve quest flow. You disagree, that's okay, but your e-peen is not long enough to actually tell others, they don't understand and their opinion doesn't matter. (you are not probably as experience as you believe you are ).

I have very little experience with Vanilla dungeons and close to zero experience with raiding, but I leveled several alts to level 60 and was pvp-ing like 12-14 hours almost every day.

Why not? Here's mine: https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-us/ch...ayer-vs-player you can see level 60 pvp titles, which are proof of playing during the time period. It would easily prove that you are telling the truth, but again, even if you aren't lying, you're still objectively wrong about everything.

And how is proposing a hypothetical situation BSing? Is English your second language?

[Uselessrouge]

450% of all statistics are made up

9 out of 10 poeple like gang rape

[Caaethil]

But it's not fair cuz Horde gets bloodlust! /s