Raid tier sets being removed in BfA confirmed

[Polarthief]

That is actually the single worst thing i have ever fucking read in my entire WOW playing career. What an utter lack of foresight and enthusiasm. Im downright appalled by the lack of insight into why raiding is fun and engaging. Why even have gear? Any argument for that, is an argument for tier-sets. The fact that tiers have gotten so god damn stale, must be because of this change.
You can now expect to never ever have innovative new ways of playing based on gear and tiers coming in BfA, its fucking god damn sad. Sadly, its hardly surprising, with the utter lack of understanding shown in the latest tier designs, its hardly a stretch to imagine that they just cant be bothered anymore. What a fucking cop-out blizzard you utter mongs.

Hyperbole much? Calm down. This is actually a really good thing when you think of it. No more 4-6 slots being forced into tier pieces and more room for fun items like cloaks in Kara and chests in Seat.

Honestly, I'm more than thrilled, assuming they keep making item effects like ^.

Oh and I've been raiding since BC, Heroic/Mythic/Hardest Tier raiding since LK, inb4 someone calls me a mega casual shitter or something.

Again, this is ASSUMING they make more fun items, hopefully for more slots now too. Maybe some small 2p sets in dungeons, raids, M+, etc. Make gearing fun instead of just +Stats or +iLvl.

[anveena]

Disincentivize raiding even more. Good job Blizzard.

[FurryRedVixen]

Makes me wonder if they will do something similiar to Pillars of Eternity where gem like items would give you abilities or modify abilities.

What i mean by this is if certain bosses will drop Azerite shards that will give your gear abilities, these abilities can be turned on or off, selected in those spots and you can sorta mix match those abilities you want from your gear.

Example would be some item that you would use on your chest, and give that item a set bonus like ability. hopefully you will be able to choose from other abilities on that item like this ability or that ability (like a drop down of 1 2 3 4 etc) and you can switch those at a npc somewhere for some cost or something.

That might be neat, still allowing hard core raiders to feel rewarded with higher ilvl gear and such.

Unless they just do a time put in mechanic where mythic raiders just get more of whatever such currency is needed to upgrade gear -.-

[Gum]

Hyperbole much? Calm down. This is actually a really good thing when you think of it. No more 4-6 slots being forced into tier pieces and more room for fun items like cloaks in Kara and chests in Seat.

Honestly, I'm more than thrilled, assuming they keep making item effects like ^.

Oh and I've been raiding since BC, Heroic/Mythic/Hardest Tier raiding since LK, inb4 someone calls me a mega casual shitter or something.

Again, this is ASSUMING they make more fun items, hopefully for more slots now too. Maybe some small 2p sets in dungeons, raids, M+, etc. Make gearing fun instead of just +Stats or +iLvl.

Why does having something, prevent you from having something else?
People use whats best, no matter what. Taking the best away, just makes something else the best. Looking at tiers as "this is the best cus stats" is hopefully not something anyone does, but purely based on the bonuses it provides. Just like what you want from other items.... Now removing individual class/spec tiers removes the possibility of having a different play-style every tier. You're locked into playing the same way, the entire expansion.
Clearly this is cus of their new AP system, taking up traditional tier slots, and they cant find a workaround. But ultimately, its making the game simpler, without the need to do it. Its already fairly simple and having actual effort being rewarded isnt a bad way to run a RPG.
Taking stuff like tiers and sets out of the game, makes all gear more bland. Just like legendaries spiced up the game, taking them out will take away flavour. Having things that changes the way to play a game, id say is quite important, else every tier feels the same, cept for "new bosses".
I hardly doubt anyone playing diablo 3, if theres even any of those around, would have enjoyed playing the same Demon huntress spec for 10 seasons in a row. Tiers and sets are flavour in a stale game that otherwise only have lore as a means of progression for your char.
The new AP system is clearly a mix of the legendary system and the AP system itself, but ultimately, assuming they stay the same the entire expansion, it adds no flavour after 3 months.
For a game that needs to last for 2, thats hardly acceptable. Thats why tiers are so important, not cus they fill a lootslot, but because of its abillity to refresh the nature of a game that is old. Every tier is a chance for you to relearn how to play, the game is in essence "new" every tier, if done right. Without that, i dont see the retaining nature of a new tier release being even close to what it is now.
People are flaming mad over titanforging, atleast tiers were the one thing keeping that in check.. Not anymore i guess. What a fucking disgrade blizzard.

[callipygoustp]

"Less is more" has been making for a better game ever since WotLK. Why go back on that philosophy now.

[Reloe]

Clearly this is cus of their new AP system, taking up traditional tier slots, and they cant find a workaround. But ultimately, its making the game simpler, without the need to do it. Its already fairly simple and having actual effort being rewarded isnt a bad way to run a RPG.

Yea it would be really hard to use wrist belt and boots for that purpose, thats cleary the reason.

Or they could just add new traits into the azerite system every raidpatch and that is how your playstyle will change? He even said that some of the tier-set style will be included in the azerite system.

Personally I think the problem isn't the tierset itself though, its the combination with legendaries and with old tiersets being too good. Some classes have to wear 4pc+2pc+2legendaries, that clearly feels terrible because you have little slots to swap items around.
But since legendaries are gone, it'll be a lot easier to switch things around, they could just stay with 6 tier pieces being available and disable 4pc+2pc functionallity, that way you have enough options if say you get a high proc item on one of the tier slots.
Another thing I always hated about tier is that it doesn't show procs before you open it, ever since they introduced the warforge system I wanted them to include that into the token, sadly it never happened.

Ultimately it will not make a big difference if the functionallity is just going into a different system so its fine.

[Gum]

Man, just like I said... people itching for any reason to be angry.

Personally I don't like gimping my overall gear because I'm clinging to the hope that I'll get that four piece bonus. Maybe you luck into your pieces easily. Maybe you like having a nice and easy path laid out for you where it's simply a matter of "get tier pieces, turn off brain, smash boss." Some of us prefer to have to take a nuanced look at assembling our character's gear and balancing stats.


See? I can be needlessly pissy too.

What are you even on about??? Gear is nothing more than.. yea gear. Its used to empower your toon, thats it. Tier bonuses allow for more then that, it changes the way you play if done correctly. So having tier gives you more damage, but not cus the pieces themselves are the best, but because something extra they provide making them sought after items.
You like it when all you have to think about is adding a +1 to your gear, knowing its better. You like the idea that after playing for a month of a new expansion, you will play your char the exact same way for 2 year.
I think personally, you have forgotten that there is close to NO rotational scaling based on stats left in the game. Warriors gaining more gear, barely change how they play. This goes for pretty much any class. Some have, but mostly, its gone and if there is anything its mainly based on haste, making you use more stuff.
Tiers allowed for more then that, it allowed you to use your abilities differently than what you were used to, giving you a payoff. Pretending that taking something like that away isnt horrid, is a blatant defense of flavourless and casualized gameplay. I for one dont enjoy depthless games like that, i want to think, enjoy and learn new things. A new tier basically represented a new release of the game everytime, cus you could expect new balance and new ways to approch your gameplay. With that being locked away due to whatever reason, makes me wonder what incentive there is to doing tiers at all? Why not just make bosses randomly as you go along? Why even have gear upgrades? Whats the point in not just making a template and giving it to everyone and let them upgrade their template through doing content. Grind azruatites or whatever the fuck to get a +1 in your char sheet.

Level 120 Warlock with 56 gearlevel lfg.
How fucking shit is that ? To me its utterly disgusting, but thats in essence where its heading. You think you gain choices by tiers being removed? What rock are you living under? Removing something that is "best", just makes something else the best. You wont gain anything from this, its just a loss of flavour. What a disgrace.

[Hctaz]

Disincentivize raiding even more. Good job Blizzard.

It's not removing the incentive to raid at all. The chest/helm/shoulder slots will not titanforge in BfA. Take this model into the game right now and you'd see that Mythic ToS drops 930 while M+ drops 915. If you want the best gear for those slots, you still need to do mythic raiding. All they're doing is removing 1 of the mandatory raid pieces that you normally needed to get back to Mythic+.

[Onikaroshi]

It's not removing the incentive to raid at all. The chest/helm/shoulder slots will not titanforge in BfA. Take this model into the game right now and you'd see that Mythic ToS drops 930 while M+ drops 915. If you want the best gear for those slots, you still need to do mythic raiding. All they're doing is removing 1 of the mandatory raid pieces that you normally needed to get back to Mythic+.

They have not mentioned changing the M+ system, as of right now the chest at the end of the week drops Mythic quality gear, if that does not change M+ is basically an easier and less stressful way of getting the same ilvl over time as Mythic. Sure it takes longer, but you don't even need to finish that +10/+15 on time to get that chest.

[Gum]

Yea it would be really hard to use wrist belt and boots for that purpose, thats cleary the reason.

Or they could just add new traits into the azerite system every raidpatch and that is how your playstyle will change? He even said that some of the tier-set style will be included in the azerite system.

Personally I think the problem isn't the tierset itself though, its the combination with legendaries and with old tiersets being too good. Some classes have to wear 4pc+2pc+2legendaries, that clearly feels terrible because you have little slots to swap items around.
But since legendaries are gone, it'll be a lot easier to switch things around, they could just stay with 6 tier pieces being available and disable 4pc+2pc functionallity, that way you have enough options if say you get a high proc item on one of the tier slots.
Another thing I always hated about tier is that it doesn't show procs before you open it, ever since they introduced the warforge system I wanted them to include that into the token, sadly it never happened.

Ultimately it will not make a big difference if the functionallity is just going into a different system so its fine.

So basically what youre saying is, that they missed the mark with this, the issue is with the titanforge system and that as long as functionallity of tiersets stay its fine.

Well damn, thats exactly true.
Remove TF
Remove 2-set/4-set
Build legendaires into azuriteterededtered system.
Keep the tier system.

Damn, yea looks good to me.

[Sithalos]

Tier set bonuses have been boring for all of legion for almost every spec.

If they can't make fun bonuses, I'd rather they not bother. I guess they feel the same way.

[brbshower]

I'm okay with this. If I have the freedom to swap out more pieces of gear without having to worry about breaking a set bonus, I'm all for it. You guys are bitching about something you haven't even experienced for yourself yet. Give it a chance, and if it sucks...then yes, we can burn it all down. Most of the complainers are LFR heroes anyway.

Again, I can see the good in this. I could very well be wrong, but I'm willing to give it a chance. It'll be nice to have a new piece of gear drop that stat/ilvl wise is a clear upgrade that I can actually use b/c I'm not busting up tier bonuses and losing out. I can't tell you how many mythic + chests I've opened that were clear piece for piece upgrades that I had to trash b/c it would break my tier bonus. So in essence, I wasn't even getting rewards from doing weekly mythics.

[Nefarious Tea]

Well, I mean it's obvious why this is happening. They only have to make four armor models per tier instead of twelve.

Plus, balance will be a no-brainer if they never have to worry about whether or not a class has a set bonus.

[Onikaroshi]

I'm okay with this. If I have the freedom to swap out more pieces of gear without having to worry about breaking a set bonus, I'm all for it. You guys are bitching about something you haven't even experienced for yourself yet. Give it a chance, and if it sucks...then yes, we can burn it all down. Most of the complainers are LFR heroes anyway.

Again, I can see the good in this. I could very well be wrong, but I'm willing to give it a chance. It'll be nice to have a new piece of gear drop that stat/ilvl wise is a clear upgrade that I can actually use b/c I'm not busting up tier bonuses and losing out. I can't tell you how many mythic + chests I've opened that were clear piece for piece upgrades that I had to trash b/c it would break my tier bonus. So in essence, I wasn't even getting rewards from doing weekly mythics.

If we wait to complain, it's over before it started. Blizzard VERY RARELY goes full reverse on a design decision, only one I can even think of is the reversal on LFR gear back to lower ilvl regular raid gear.

We get our opinion out now or we may as well nail the coffin shut ourselves.

[Gloriandus]

Well, I mean it's obvious why this is happening. They only have to make four armor models per tier instead of twelve.

This change is about removing tier set bonuses, not nixing fresh designs for armor.

[Moshots]

Azurite gear can’t Titanforge so mythic raiding will provide the best gear available 100% of the time now. (And possibly very high end M+ depending on what they do with its rewards)

Yeah but isn't Azurite gear just LOL artifact weapons all over so everyone will have it??? and the rest of the gear can Titanforge? so basically 0 reason to raid at all anymore outside trinkets. and even then only if they make OP trinkets drop from raid.

[brbshower]

I see both sides, but I'm still supportive of it for now. I see the good. In the past I've always enjoyed working towards completing my tier set. Even though drops are random and never guaranteed, it made the grind feel a little less grindy. I will definitely hate to see that go. I'll have to get my hands on the Azurite gear / system to see if those bonuses to abilities and the system as a whole are able to fill the void.

[toxicrusader]

Shout out to all the 4pc+2pc people.

This one is on you.

[Onikaroshi]

Shout out to all the 4pc+2pc people.

This one is on you.

That's a legion only problem and has zero basis outside of it. Without legendaries taking up 2 slots in BfA, there's no reason to have 6 tier pieces. 5 tier slots = no possible way of 2p+4p

[Wondercrab]

This sounds like a great change to me. With raids no longer being the only source of end-game progression it felt weird to be locked into specific sets that were only available through raiding content in Legion. The freedom of gearing this allows will certainly be welcome, and I'll be interested to see what sorts of cosmetic sets we end up with now that there won't be so much of the art budget going into class-specific items.