Is Blizzard actively trying to kill the raiding scene?

[Daedius]

The day lootboxes are introduced into WoW is the day I leave the game for good. Moreso if they have the gall to keep the monthly subscription AND the box price.

Aye... I avoid games with paid lootboxes like the plague.

[Teri]

I may be out of my mind, but I could have sworn that they said that those pieces were slated for raid drops that are Normal and higher and are different "power" based on the difficulty of the raid.

I think they come from quests/craft/dungeons too, they just can't warforge/titanforge, so the Mythic is obviously better then a LFR drop as the powers scale with itemlevel.

Same name item still has same power choices.

I think all BfA shoulder/chest/helm have azerite powers cause I believe the demo characters had level 185 (basicly like 840 110 leveling greens)

[MasterHamster]

Can't say I'm surprised. Legion tier set bonuses has to be the least interesting they've ever done. Just another step on the endless road of streamlining.

[Spaze]

I may be out of my mind, but I could have sworn that they said that those pieces were slated for raid drops that are Normal and higher and are different "power" based on the difficulty of the raid.

maybe in raids drop THE BEST Items, but I guess it would never be raidonly items maybe some worse things ouf of dungeons etc

[Deianeira]

no what blizzard is getting ready for is introduction of lootboxes into wow

its pretty obvious in world where titanforging is the king

get ready to join the gaming ad2017 where microtransactions are absolute must in every game.

This could be true but i doubt they will contain ANYTHING other then cosmetic awards such as mounts, pets, OR Gear appearances.

I hope they dont go there but it could surely happen since apparently that is easy money.

[Jalham]

With the announcement of eliminating tier sets, it feels like Blizzard wants to kill off raiding. I know what you are thinking, another player screaming "the sky is falling". But, with BfA and other changes from Legion, it seems Blizzard is steering the game to a more casual, open world sandbox and away from a structured game style, which is what raiding is.

Loot and gear is raining down all over the game. You can even obtain better gear from non raiding content as compared to raid drops. I am a heroic raider but my character probably about 50% non raid gear equipped. These pieces are from my mythic weekly caches, bonus week caches, emissary quests and relinquished gear from the Argus vendor. Heck, if you get lucky enough you can even top mythic level gear from some sources. Really, the only gear that is obtainable only from raiding is tier gear.

Ion said they are not getting rid of titanforging and other mechanics to increase item level from drops. This mechanic plus all the new sources for gear that is equal to or better than raid gear and eliminating tier sets, tells you where they want to take this game.

Raiding is about testing yourself against some of the toughest content in the game. Raiding is what brings people back week after week in order to progress and finally kill the end boss. But loot and gear was the carrot on the stick. It kept you coming back. And the satisfaction of finally downing that boss your team has struggled with is the reason we raid. But getting that epic tier piece, weapon, trinket, etc was the icing on the cake. Tier sets are unique to raiding. If you look at a player and see they are item level 930 but have no tier you can tell they dont raid. But if you look at a player with item level 930 and you see heroic or even mythic tier gear, you know they have beaten some of the hardest content in the game.

wait, I thought they eliminating tier set BONUSES not the Tier sets themselves

[Hellrime]

just a different way of enjoying the game.

why does raiding have to be the only way to progress ur char?

Because otherwise WoW would be just like every other MMO. Raiding, actual grindy progression raiding is one of the key differences between WoW and MMOs that failed. Think about it logically, all MMOs have quests, all MMOs have ways to obtain gear, all MMOs have dungeons, all MMOs have crafting, but not all MMOs have serious progression raiding. Which game are people still paying for all these years later?

[Deianeira]

wait, I thought they eliminating tier set BONUSES not the Tier sets themselves

This is what i think that they mean.

[Zephre]

I may be out of my mind, but I could have sworn that they said that those pieces were slated for raid drops that are Normal and higher and are different "power" based on the difficulty of the raid.

My understanding is this, the three pieces effected by the necklace cannot be titanforged, which means to get the best in slot for those items you will have to raid.

just a different way of enjoying the game.

why does raiding have to be the only way to progress ur char?

Raiding requires greater time investment than other things such as M+ therefore it should have the biggest pay off in terms of progression, dungeons should not rival mythic raiding gear under any circumstance. I don't like the idea that M+ will most likely be competitive with raiding.

[XDurionX]

Tier bonuses have always sucked, you always gimped yourself seriously by not having them. Locked slots aren't fun.

[Soon-TM]

Because otherwise WoW would be just like every other MMO. Raiding, actual grindy progression raiding is one of the key differences between WoW and MMOs that failed. Think about it logically, all MMOs have quests, all MMOs have ways to obtain gear, all MMOs have dungeons, all MMOs have crafting, but not all MMOs have serious progression raiding. Which game are people still paying for all these years later?

The problem with all those MMOs is that they tried too hard to copy WoW, and thus they failed. The ones doing well are those who introduced twists of their own, e.g. FF14 or GW2. It has nothing to do with raids.

[h4rr0d]

I used to love raiding, back when it was 10-man. I won't buy BfA if the raiding formats stay the same. As far as your post goes, I'm fine with them getting rid of tier gear. People will still raid for trinkets and other stuff. I wouldn't be sad if "raiding died" anyway, as I feel its been dying for a long time. People use it as a means to get gear and then drop out (a lot of the time). Its not about guilds anymore, and that's a shame.

There is 10man raiding. It's called normal and heroic. Heroic is on par with most 10man encounters that were available. Sure, there were some outliers, but in general, 10mans were a joke compared to today's mythic.

[Hyral]

Making dungeons that people will do over and over nonstop and be happy with is a lot less resources than raid tiers.

[Hellrime]

The problem with all those MMOs is that they tried too hard to copy WoW, and thus they failed. The ones doing well are those who introduced twists of their own, e.g. FF14 or GW2. It has nothing to do with raids.

You're comparing GW2 and FF14 to WoW? Both games active playerbase isn't even a fraction of that of WoW. Seeing even 20 people in a zone at any given time is a testament to that. Not to mention without seeing numbers for the playerbase the argument is invalid. I can with certainty as a person who played GW2 that zone population is dismal in comparison to WoW. Not to mention active streamers of WoW content is higher. Raids, and I know this hurts people's feelings, ARE the difference and is what highly contributes to WoW's success. The vast majority of posts on this site are about raids and itemization for them. It has EVERYTHING to do with raids.

[Soon-TM]

Making dungeons that people will do over and over nonstop and be happy with is a lot less resources than raid tiers.

Tbh, Legion raids have been quite lackluster so far. I hope Antorus really improves the lot, otherwise Legion will be remembered as the xpac with the worse raids since Classic.

[music49]

With Azerite gear not being able to titanforge, raid is still the best place for PvE gear. and most bonuses are passive anyway so who cares about the actual bonus. And more sources of great gear is never a bad thing.

[rootbeerboy]

It felt nice getting a new tier bonus each tier that can change your class up abit. Even 2pc4pc players are losing out on flavor.

- - - Updated - - -

With Azerite gear not being able to titanforge, raid is still the best place for PvE gear. and most bonuses are passive anyway so who cares about the actual bonus. And more sources of great gear is never a bad thing.

Sounds like an easy way to burn out grinding dungeons for forges versus raiding.

[Kaeth]

Since sometime in Cataclysm, raiding has only been a "means to an end" for me. I don't find it enjoyable and haven't for years. Maybe because my life outside of WoW has become more exhausting, with kids running around and more hours spent at work, and at least partly because my evening schedule has become so unpredictable, I get less excitement out of new challenges and play WoW more as a fun diversion. Whatever the reason(s), my response to new raid content over the years has become less and less, "Sweet, new bosses to fight!" and more and more, "Eh, whatever, here comes yet another gear reset."

Flame me if you will, but I guess I'm one of those increasingly casual players who is glad any time the developers give the slightest hint that they're devoting more resources to non-raid endgame content.

[rootbeerboy]

There is 10man raiding. It's called normal and heroic. Heroic is on par with most 10man encounters that were available. Sure, there were some outliers, but in general, 10mans were a joke compared to today's mythic.

Heroic is the new normal mode. Today's mythic really isn't that bad if you know anything about your class and work hard on your character.

[Serenais]

I wouldn't be surprised if the raid tier bonus for the sets was instead included in the azerite powers uniquely available for class/spec-speciffic gear.