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  1. #1
    Deleted

    Retribution: The JUST build [Battle of Azeroth edition]

    Edited to balance it more out and tried to address some issues players had but my goal is, to stay as close as I can to Blizzard view for paladins while making it more fun and putting allot of synergy in this talent tree to choose from.

    Retribution: The JUST build [Battle for Azeroth edition]

    My goal was to make this build for Retribution more enjoyable and fun while this talent tree offers different sorts of playstyle you can choose for but remains competitive (or as close I try to make) with other talent builds you can choose from.

    This build isn’t a complete overhaul. I try to tweak and adjust abilities sticking close to Blizzard View for Retribution and added or baked some old Paladin abilities here and there.

    Mastery

    Hand of Light:
    Increase all Holy damage done by %.

    Note: Plain and simple.

    Paladin Basic Abilities

    Judgment:
    Instant 30yd 9sec cd
    Judges the target and causes “moderate” Holy damage.
    Generates 1 Holy Power.

    Note: No longer copy-past Colossus Smash thing.

    Crusader Strike:
    Instant Melee 3sec cd
    Strikes an enemy for “low” Physical damage.
    Generates 1 Holy Power.

    Note: Removed charges and changed the cooldown to 3 sec baseline.


    Blades of Justice:
    Instant Melee 12sec cd
    Strikes 2 additionally enemies for “heavy” Physical damage.
    Generates 2 Holy Power.

    Note: In total 3 targets, to provide some cleave damage.
    Melee range, because it should be feeling rewarding to hit an enemy within melee range.


    Hammer of Wrath
    Instant 30yd 6sec cd
    Hurls a magical hammer that strikes an enemy dealing “heavy” Holy damage. Only usable on enemies that have 30% or less health.
    Generates 1 Holy Power.

    Note: Nothing to discuss here because we all agree to keep this iconic spell for Paladins.

    Consecration: [Baseline]
    Instant 30sec cd
    Blesses the land beneath you. Causing enemies in the area to take “low” Holy damage for 15 sec. While standing in your Consecration, Crusader Strike hits all nearby enemies.

    Note: Death Knights and Protection Paladins already have this mechanic, so why not Retribution?
    Crusader Strike still only grants 1 Holy Power.


    Shield of Vengeance:
    Instant 1min cd
    Creates a barrier of holy light that absorbs damage for 15 sec. When the barrier is consumed, all damage absorbed is dealt as Holy damage divided across all enemies within 8 yds.

    Note: Changed cooldown to 1 min.

    Templar’s Verdict:
    Instant Melee Cost 3 Holy Power
    Consumes 3 Holy Power to deal “heavy” Holy damage to an enemy.

    Note: Unchanged.

    Divine Storm:
    Instant Cost 3 Holy power
    Consumes 3 Holy Power to deal “heavy” Holy damage to all nearby enemies.
    Divine Storm heals a nearby party or raid players for each single hit it made.

    Note: If 5 enemies are hit, then 5 nearby players will be healed (not from the total damage Divine Storm did to surrounded enemies, but only for each single hit Divine Storm applied. If I make sense?)

    Divine Steed: [Unchanged]
    Divine Shield: [Unchanged]
    Avenging Wrath: [Unchanged]
    Hammer of Justice: [Unchanged]
    Cleanse: [Unchanged]
    Rebuke: [Unchanged]
    Flash of Light: [Unchanged]
    Redemption: [Unchanged]

    Blessings

    Freedom: [Unchanged]
    Protection: [Unchanged]
    Kings: [Unchanged]

    Might:
    Cause all attacks to have a chance to increased your highest secondary stats by % for 8sec.

    Wisdom:
    Doesn’t longer regenerate mana or health but regenerates important resources every 15sec in combat.

    Note: Classes with no resources, just reduce the mana cost of spells by %.
    The amount of resources can be different to each class to balance it out. The recharge timer can also be adjusted for balance reasons.


    Hands

    Hindrance: [Unchanged]
    Reckoning: [Unchanged]

    Passives

    Hearth of the Crusader:
    Increase your movement and mounted speed by 20%. This does not stack with other movement speed increasing effect.

    Note: This movement speed passive helps out our mobility a bit more.

    Supplication:
    After you kill an enemy that yields experience or honor, your next Flash of Light will cost for free and is an instant Critical Hit.

    Note: Helps out while leveling or solo-content, helping out our survivability.

    Righteous Vengeance:
    When a party or raid member get struck by any damage source, The Paladin gains Righteous Vengeance. Increasing your critical strike chance by 3% for 9 secs, stacking up to 3 times.

    Note: Retribution fantasy worthy and help out low ilvl crit progression.

    Boundless Conviction:
    You may store an additional 2 Holy Power beyond the maximum of 3.

    Talents

    Lvl 15 [Gapclosers row]

    Execution Sentence:
    Instant 30yd 30sec cd
    A hammer slowly falls from the sky, dealing “heavy” Holy damage over 10 sec.
    Reactivating this ability, Cause you to teleport you above the target location and culminate the remaining seconds into a final burst.

    Note: When dispelled, it doesn’t teleport the paladin but triggers the final burst of the remaining duration.

    Turalyon’s Might:
    Instant 30yd 1min cd
    Leap yourself to a targeted location. Forcing your “weapon” on the ground, dealing “moderate” Holy damage. Causes enemies to be incapacitated including yourself and radiates “low” Holy damage for 3sec

    Note: Allot of people where excited for this, so I bring it back with all of its full glory.
    Imaged this, leaping to a designated area forcing your weapon on the ground cause an explosion of light, disoriented surrounding enemies while you kneel for couple of seconds holding your weapon on the ground, pulsing light waves. If you move prematurely, it cancel the pulsing effect.


    Divine Charger: [Replaces Divine Steed]
    Instant 45sec cd 2Charges
    Causing you Holy mount to charge at the enemy , knocking down any enemy on his path, dealing “moderate” Psychical damage.

    Note: The 100% speed buff will still apply after the charge and you can trigger the speed buff without any target requirement.

    Lvl 30 [HoPo row]

    The Fires of Justice:
    Blades of Justice apply Righteous Fire, dealing Holy Fire damage every 3 sec over 15 sec. Righteous Fire Critical Hits have a chance to generates 1 Holy Power.

    Note: Making Crit build more interesting and Righteous Vengeance helps out with it.
    Righteous Fire can only apply on one target at a time for balance reasons.


    Zeal: [replaces Crusader Strike]
    Instant Melee Range 3 sec cd 3 Charges
    Strikes the enemy for “moderate” physical damage. Maximum 3 charges.
    Generates 1 Holy Power.

    Note: At first this seems the best talent choice, but The fire of Justice becomes more interest if your reach the Level 60 talent row.

    Divine purpose:
    Your Holy Power abilities have a 20% chance to make your next Holy Power spending ability free and deals 20% more damage.

    Note: Baked with “Final Verdict 7.0.3” so that it doesn’t fall behind in this talent row.

    Lvl 45 [CC row]

    Fist of Justice:
    Each Holy Power spent reduce the remaining cooldown of Hammer of Justice by 2.5 sec.

    Note: Unchanged.

    Repentance:
    % of base mana Instant 30sec cd 30yd
    Forces an enemy target to meditate, incapitating the target for 30sec.

    Note: Made it instant to make us life easier (PvP reasons).

    Blinding Light:
    % of base mana Instant 1min cd
    Emits a dazzling light in all directions, blinding enemies within 10 yards to wander disoriented for 6 sec. Holy damage will not break this disorient effect.

    Note: Unchanged.

    Lvl 60

    Virtue’s Blade:
    Blades of Justice Critical Strikes now deal 3 times normal the damage.

    Note: Unchanged. Making Crit build interesting with Fire of Justice.

    Blades of Wrath: [Replaces Blades of Justice]
    Instant 12yd 6sec cd
    Strikes 2 additionally enemies, dealing "moderate” Holy damage.
    Generates 1 Holy Power.

    Note: Brought back the old version of “Blade of Wrath 7.0.3”. Generates 1 Holy Power to balance out this talent row.

    Art of War:
    Your Crusader Strike have a chance to reset the cooldown of Judgement and cause additionally 100% damage.

    Note: Nice synergy with Zeal.

    Lvl 75 [AoE row]

    Mass Judgement:
    Your judgment judge 2 additionally nearby enemies and always deals a Critical Strike against target above 50% health.

    Note: Nice synergy with Art of War, which haves a nice synergy with Zeal.

    Greater Consecration:
    Reduce the cooldown by half and allows Consecration to follows your path.
    Crusader Strike now deals Holy damage while standing in your Consecration.

    Note: A more consistent AoE talent. It is a bit similar as Divine Hammers but you don’t have to trade Blade of Justice for it.

    Final Verdict:
    After using Templar’s Verdict, you Lash out with your weapon, dealing “heavy” Radiant damage to all enemies in front of you and causes all enemies to burn for “moderate” Holy Fire damage over 6 sec.
    This effect cannot occur more than once every 45 sec.

    Note: By the loss of Ashbringer in Battle for Azeroth, I find it a bit weird to have things related to the Ashbringer in our talent tree. That’s why I tweaked and changed the name of “Wake of Ashe” and baked with “Ashes to Ashes” without gaining the 5 Holy Power.
    Need to handle with skill, to hold it sometimes in some AoE situations for dps increase.


    Lvl 90 [Survivability row]

    Divine Intervention:
    Increase the effects of Shield of Vengeance by %. In addition, any attack that reduce you below 30%, triggers Shield of Vengeance effect. This effect cannot occur more than once every 60 sec.

    Note: It only apply the Shield of Vengeance effect, meaning that the ability itself wont trigger.

    Eye for an Eye:
    Instant 1min cd
    Absorb 35% damage taken by and reflect it back as Holy damage. Lasts 10 sec.

    Note: The damage cannot exceed over 35% of your total hp.

    Justicar’s Vengeance:
    When using Templar’s Verdict on 5 Holy Power, restores health equal to half the damage has done and 100% additionally healing when used against a stunned enemy.

    Note:A more consistent self-healing talent.
    Consumes 5 Holy Power, causing you to actually smart manage your Holy Powers.


    Lvl 100

    Crusade: [Replaces Avenging Wrath]
    Instant 2min cd
    Increase your damage, Haste, Mastery and Critical Strike by 2% for 20 sec. Each Holy Power spent during Crusade increase damage and haste by and additionally 2%. Maximum 15 stacks.

    Note: Added Crit and Mastery. Numbers (duration, % and stacks) can be changed to balance out this talent row.

    Greater Judgment:
    Judgment causes your next 3 Holy Power spenders to cost one less Holy Power and increased its damage by %.

    Note: The damage % increase should be noteworthy to be on par with this talent row.

    Holy Wrath: [Replaces Hammer of Wrath]
    Instant 30yd 6sec cd
    Hammer of Wrath is now usable regardless the enemy health, but deals half damage against enemies above 30% health and deals double the damage against enemies below 30% health.
    Generates 1 Holy Power.

    Note: I love Hammer of Wrath and it deserve some love to make it more interesting and unique amongst finishers.
    Should it only grant 1 Holy Power on targets below 30% health for balance issues?
    There so much potential in Hammer of Wrath, I can’t decide to make it a longer cooldown to balance it more out or change it completely to be usable on wings. Like I said, there so much things you can do with it.



    Feel free to add feedback please.

    Greetings Balti(bruh).
    Last edited by mmoc4bd380d75b; 2017-12-02 at 11:14 AM.

  2. #2
    Good job on building this mate, but i have many issues with this build... At work now, but ill comment later on how i think it could be better


    Madness will consume you!!!

  3. #3
    HoHindrance/Protection/Reckoning removed due to "less buttons to worry"
    why do even bother

  4. #4
    Deleted
    Same. Talents make some sense but i would whine lots about the rest

  5. #5
    Warchief Serenais's Avatar
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    Disclaimer: I main prot and ret only very, very rarely.
    These are the things that popped into my mind when reading the text.
    I can see a potential necessary nerfing late expansion, as with high crit and haste this spec could get VERY powerful, especially with Virtue's Blade and Fires of Justice; I suppose it would depend on CD for Fires of Justice.
    Execution might need longer CD or lower damage, otherwise it might be too powerful for just a gapcloser ability.
    I would also keep hands and blessings, as I personaly preffer having utility. Instead of removing them, they could apply a nonstacking small short term (5s?) damage buff to make up for the dps lost using them.

  6. #6
    Well i stopped the moment you wanted Hands/utility in general removed because "less buttons".... Why do you even bother. Don't give blizzard stupid idea removing hand of sacrifice was annoying enough to see people think more needs to be removed just boggles my mind.

  7. #7
    Deleted
    Lots of thanks to everyone for the feedback.

    I see that by removing some hands and blessing, people getting upset. I thought people disliked the blessings because it isn’t fun or interesting enough. I should have thought more to make them fun and interesting. I always liked Retribution because they were “simple” and “easy” (in the old days), that’s why I decided to remove or shift some abilities to Holy or Prot.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by Serenais View Post
    I can see a potential necessary nerfing late expansion, as with high crit and haste this spec could get VERY powerful, especially with Virtue's Blade and Fires of Justice; I suppose it would depend on CD for Fires of Justice.
    I understand your concern. Indeed, when in late expansion, stats will be very high making it overpowered. Ofc number can be tuned and adjusted to balance it out. Or make Fire of Justice a chance to proc on a crit. Such things are easy to fix, I think.

  8. #8
    Everything was solid until the removal of the Blessing/Hand stuff.

    - - - Updated - - -

    In addition the Wake of Ashes thing needs to be baseline anyways and there should be a talent that buffs that choice.

  9. #9
    Deleted
    Quote Originally Posted by Ulthane View Post
    Everything was solid until the removal of the Blessing/Hand stuff.
    Brought back the Blessings/Hands stuff.

    - - - Updated - - -

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    Good job on building this mate, but i have many issues with this build... At work now, but ill comment later on how i think it could be better
    Can't wait to hear your feedback on this .

  10. #10
    So, first of all - the basic abilities:

    - Having BoJ do cleave damge baseline seems way too OP, makes it seem to me like the Divine Hammer of Nighthold.

    - Having Cons baseline like that feels weird, too long off a cooldown makes it feel out of place, and having yet another cleave baseline, its just too much.

    - Shield of Vengance should be replaced by Divine Protection. A spell like this has no place on a dps spec.

    - I think i understand your itteration of DS, and it sounds cool... It works like this? If i stand in melee with 4 more melees and there are 2 enemies i hit with DS, it will heal 2 players near me? Out of the 4? Will it be a smart heal? Or just pick the closest to me?

    - The greater Blessing, such as Wisdom and Might should go in the bin. They only produce anxiaty and stupidy... They can be either overtuned, where you will be OP as Ret, or they will be undertuned, where no one cares for them. No middle ground.

    - Over all seems like way too many HoPo generating abilities, maybe reduce BoJ to 1, give it 40 yard range and rename it 'Exorcism'? Just a thought...

    Talents:

    - CD on ES is way to short and nothing else on that tier can compete in PvE. Also, Turalyons Might disorients you? That pretty counter intuitive.

    - I like how you integrated DP in a lower lvl of Talent, but Fires of justice is way too OP and Zeal seems very weak, especially since all it does is allows you to smooth out rotation.
    Idk what can compete with that OP DoT but ill try to think of something.

    - The CC is nice.

    - Virtues Blade will have no effect on playstyle and it will be very weaksauce compared to a DoT that can tick off of 5 enemies and be refreshed every 6 seconds, with a chance to virtually make you fire off 10 consecutive TV's within 7 seconds... That spell is just way too OP.

    - Yet again, there way too much Cleave in your build... Seal of Command and Greater Cons have no place as talents. It would be beneficial to have some sort of a glyph to make Cons follow you, but thats it.
    The Final Verdict talent is the Talent i least liked here... It makes you fire off an AoE spell every 45 seconds regardless of whats happening, and you wont be able to hold it off untill adds spawn, because TV is our most hard hitting ST spell... (presumably)

    - Justicar Vengance is too OP here... It has essentialy no CD and it will heal you by basically doing your rotation.
    Sgield of Vengance is stupid and should be... Oh wait, yeah... So Divine Intervention could stay as it is now, just reduce Divine Shield Cd by more than 20%.

    - Greater Judgement is crap. Crusade will be even harder to balance with all the additional stats, and Hammer of Wrath (as much as i love it) is wayyyyyy to OP. If in this itteration HoW is castable during wings (as it was previously) then this talent might be less OP, but still...

    So basically, tone down the AoE/Cleave in your build... Think about things that can integrate with each other while not breaking the game, and please for the love of god, dont take Blizzards mistakes and try to itterate upon them (SoV and Blessings)

    As i said, ill try to come up with something more interesting, and maybe we can go with some version to Blizz so that they might take ideas how to improve BfA Ret...


    Madness will consume you!!!

  11. #11
    Deleted
    First of all, thank you very much for this constructive feedback. I really appreciated this allot, much gratitude’s for this dude.

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - Having BoJ do cleave damge baseline seems way too OP, makes it seem to me like the Divine Hammer of Nighthold.
    Retribution was always weak in cleaving 2 targets and I thought I would help out by giving them some cleave damage but I understand your concerns because I might have overdone it, giving to much cleave.

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - Having Cons baseline like that feels weird, too long off a cooldown makes it feel out of place, and having yet another cleave baseline, its just too much.
    Removing BoJ cleave ability, thus making our only cleave ability CS while standing in Cons and reduce its CD by half?

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - Shield of Vengance should be replaced by Divine Protection. A spell like this has no place on a dps spec.
    I find it personally fantasy worthy for Retribution Paladins but I do respect your opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - I think i understand your itteration of DS, and it sounds cool... It works like this? If i stand in melee with 4 more melees and there are 2 enemies i hit with DS, it will heal 2 players near me? Out of the 4? Will it be a smart heal? Or just pick the closest to me?
    Thankyou finding this cool and yes indeed it works like this. I think a smart heal would be agreeable but Blizzard dislike smart heals…

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - The greater Blessing, such as Wisdom and Might should go in the bin. They only produce anxiaty and stupidy... They can be either overtuned, where you will be OP as Ret, or they will be undertuned, where no one cares for them. No middle ground.
    I totally agree with you but it seems other people dislike this idea, so I feel conflicted .

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - Over all seems like way too many HoPo generating abilities, maybe reduce BoJ to 1, give it 40 yard range and rename it 'Exorcism'? Just a thought...
    BoJ should indeed give 1 HoPo and adding back his range because there are too many HoPo generating abilities in this build. I always found "Exorcism" a Priest thing, don’t know why, perhaps from the many exorcist movies, priest driving demons out of people.

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - CD on ES is way to short and nothing else on that tier can compete in PvE. Also, Turalyons Might disorients you? That pretty counter intuitive.
    Damage from ES can be tuned down but I like the CD, otherwise it can’t compete with the other gapclosers.
    Turaylon’s Might doesn’t really disorient you. imaged this, leaping to a designated area forcing your weapon on the ground cause an explosion of light, disoriented surrounding enemies while you kneel for couple of seconds holding your weapon on the ground, pulsing light waves. Maybe if you move prematurely, cancel the pulsing effect?

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - I like how you integrated DP in a lower lvl of Talent, but Fires of justice is way too OP and Zeal seems very weak, especially since all it does is allows you to smooth out rotation.
    Idk what can compete with that OP DoT but ill try to think of something.
    FoJ can only applied on 1 enemy at a time and have a chance to generate 1 HoPo on Critical Hits?
    Zeal does more physical damage than CS and have 3 charges instead of 1, does not sound weak to me?

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - Virtues Blade will have no effect on playstyle and it will be very weaksauce compared to a DoT that can tick off of 5 enemies and be refreshed every 6 seconds, with a chance to virtually make you fire off 10 consecutive TV's within 7 seconds... That spell is just way too OP.
    Fixed FoJ and the problems will be solved?

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - Yet again, there way too much Cleave in your build... Seal of Command and Greater Cons have no place as talents. It would be beneficial to have some sort of a glyph to make Cons follow you, but thats it.
    Can seal of command stay if BoJ only hits one target?
    I like Greater Consecration, it just improves CS making a much stronger cleave/AoE.

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    The Final Verdict talent is the Talent i least liked here... It makes you fire off an AoE spell every 45 seconds regardless of whats happening, and you wont be able to hold it off untill adds spawn, because TV is our most hard hitting ST spell... (presumably)
    Yeah I knew that would cause a problem but I counted for smart usage or something like that? Requiring skills and timing some sort, you know?

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - Justicar Vengance is too OP here... It has essentialy no CD and it will heal you by basically doing your rotation.
    Sgield of Vengance is stupid and should be... Oh wait, yeah... So Divine Intervention could stay as it is now, just reduce Divine Shield Cd by more than 20%.
    Maybe to receive the heal effect you need to use TV with 5 HoPo?
    You know my standpiont on SoV .

    Quote Originally Posted by killwithpwr View Post
    - Greater Judgement is crap. Crusade will be even harder to balance with all the additional stats, and Hammer of Wrath (as much as i love it) is wayyyyyy to OP. If in this itteration HoW is castable during wings (as it was previously) then this talent might be less OP, but still...
    Why is Greater Jugment crap and Why would HoW be OP when it deals half the damage on targets above 30% health? The 1 HoP below 30% can stay as it is. The damage can be tuned down ofc.
    Last edited by mmoc4bd380d75b; 2017-11-16 at 11:12 AM.

  12. #12
    Just a quick response to why Judgement is crap, it essentially only gives you one extra spender every 9 seconds.
    The reason i said HoW would be OP if it is not usable with Wings, is that this spell must hit hard because it is an execute spell, if it wasn't hard hitting, then there will be no reason to bring it back.
    And as a hard hitting spell even at 50% capacity it will be much stronger than not having it and when execute comes... Well... Dps be flying.
    Don't forget that any talent you put in the same row as Crusade has to be tuned with having Avenging Wrath in mind. This is why balancing Crusade is so stupidly annoying.
    If you go all out with Crusade, its going to put us at god level (at least for the burst) and if you tone it down a bit, Baseline Avenging Wrath will pull ahead making Crusade actually worse than having no Talent picked at all.
    The reason Crusade works fine (not good, fine...) at the moment, is mainly due to the Ashbringer Traits.
    Taking the traits out of the picture should make it possible to nuts with Crusade because its duration will finally be limited.

    All this being said, the build still has way too many HoPo builders, and there arent enough spenders to pull off


    Madness will consume you!!!

  13. #13
    Wisdom:
    Doesn’t longer regenerate mana or health but regenerates important resources every 10sec.

    Note: 1 HoPo, 1 Soul Shard, 10 Runic Power, 10 Furry, 10 Energy, 10 Rage, 10 Focus, 10 Maelstrom, 10 Insanity, 100 Astral Power. (Classes with no resources, just reduce the mana cost of spells by %).
    There is a reason Greater Blessing of Might was removed. No one liked it. This is that but worse. We'd need to be balanced around actually having this on ourselves but chances are we would have to put it on healers for progression and whoever the top dps was after. It also affects everyone else's playstyle. Getting a bunch of random extra resources can cause a lot of misplays.

  14. #14
    Deleted
    Great,... you took the live spec and made it way less balanced and way more boring. I applaud you.

    There's a very good reason why GBoM was removed as it was.
    Shifting back towards a FCFS rotation seems to me like the wrong direction alltogether; and that seems to be the underlying theme of this "build".

  15. #15
    In my opinion tweaking some spells here and there achieves nothing, ret needs much deeper overhaul than this. Half of the spec feels very placeholdish.

  16. #16
    The Lightbringer Aqua's Avatar
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    From what I played on the demo, currently, Wake of Ashes has been placed on the 100 tier talent. So it's there, but it just seems like such a weird place while crusade still exists. (Crusade either needs to be Avenging wrath's baseline or to go away personally)

    I know this is extremely early days, so nothing from there matters, but their intent is obviously to keep wake of ashes as a 'thing'.
    I have eaten all the popcorn, I left none for anyone else.

  17. #17
    Quote Originally Posted by Aqua View Post
    From what I played on the demo, currently, Wake of Ashes has been placed on the 100 tier talent. So it's there, but it just seems like such a weird place while crusade still exists. (Crusade either needs to be Avenging wrath's baseline or to go away personally)

    I know this is extremely early days, so nothing from there matters, but their intent is obviously to keep wake of ashes as a 'thing'.
    They could, you know, make it baseline.
    They could add a proc to Retribution, aswell.
    afaik, Retribution currently is the only (melee) dd besides Havoc without any kind of a baseline proc
    Why?
    Last edited by Morally Grey Storm; 2017-11-22 at 12:21 AM. Reason: Wagakki Band_-_Homura

  18. #18
    Moderator Malthanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Storm the Sorrow View Post
    They could, you know, make it baseline.
    They could add a proc to Retribution, aswell.
    afaik, Retribution currently is the only (melee) dd besides Havoc without any kind of a baseline proc
    Why?
    "Because that one time in Cataclysm you Ret paladins got all mad about your proc-based mastery so we thought you meant that you never wanted RNG in your baseline kit ever!" - The Class Devs (probably)

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Malthanis View Post
    "Because that one time in Cataclysm you Ret paladins got all mad about your proc-based mastery so we thought you meant that you never wanted RNG in your baseline kit ever!" - The Class Devs (probably)
    Yet we had a baseline proc in Mists of Awful Villain Development and in Warcocks of Gachinor.

  20. #20
    Moderator Malthanis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Storm the Sorrow View Post
    Yet we had a baseline proc in Mists of Awful Villain Development and in Warcocks of Gachinor.
    What was the proc in Mists? It's been a while, so I can't quite remember. As for Warlords, I only ever got to play the "come back to us!" version where they didn't let you level.

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