Senator Al Franken accused of sexual assault

[Zan15]

It is. If he grabbed her against her will, as the photo clearly shows, it is categorically sexual assault. The only way it isn't is if we somehow create an exception whereby "done as a funny", even when that person is asleep, is okay. And in the context of this specific episode, where he did these skit practices where he tried to kill her and shit... yeah. He was horny for her, and when she was out, he groped her.

No mercy. No exceptions. There are other liberals who can do his job, ones without this taint.

The only way we can restore the highest ethical and moral standards to government is by not being forgiving when EVEN THE GOOD GUYS fuck up.

This is exactly why there's been a rash of "I was against Bill Clinton's impeachment in the 1990s, but in retrospect, he should have resigned because what he did was wrong." coming from liberal corners the past few weeks. Because many Americans are craving high standards in government - in character least of all - and this Al Franken episode is just more of everything wrong with us right now.

Do we think he's alone in the Senate? Hell no. There are certainly other sexual predators Senators. What happens when their names come up? Do we selectively say "you stay. You go. You stay. You go.".

No. I say: they all go. You sexually assault a woman - and let's be clear, groping sexual organs is sexual assault - you're done. No exceptions. A person who compromises themselves in that fashion will compromise themselves in further fashions.

He just needs to use the Trump defense

Even though there is proof/and admitted it on tape.....it was just LOCKER ROOM BEHAVIOR.

then he can stay in the senate and run for president.

[cubby]

Yes it is highly open to interpretation because he has a "D" next to his name and not an "R".

Nope, but your world would be easier if that were the case. I've already condemned Spacey and C.K. - so I'm fine. Also Weiner, so save your partisan drama for someone else.

This is about being fair before we destroy a person.

[mvaliz]

[IMG]http://images.tritondigitalcms.com/6616/sites/320/2017/11/15155723/leeann-airplane-pic.jpg[IMG]

Clearly look at his left hand. His left ring finger is even resting on her chest. The right hand too.

Technicalities to have outs for "people we like" undermines any kind of high-standards agenda.

He has to go. Even for this. It means anyone doing anything worse has to go too. No. He didn't rape her. That also is irrelevant. The bar for sexual assault must be very low, and he broke it.

I will say this... he (Franken) can't go unless Dumbass Dump goes first as it would be also "undermine any kind of high-standards" to hold a Senator to these standards to fire him, but NOT for the President for all the batshit stupid sexual assaults (and BRAGGING about them!) which have been far more egregious than what Franken did. (Or did we all forget Dump's comments about sneaking into teen beauty pagent dressing rooms to "check on them"?)

On the flipside, if they have to let Franken go - they could (and SHOULD!) use this against Dumbass Dump for impeachment.

[Deletedaccount1]

His version of events makes it not even close to sexual assault. Rehearsing a scene, gag photo where he isn't touching her.

See above remarks about waiting to see if there are others.

“The first thing I want to do is apologize: to Leeann, to everyone else who was part of that tour, to everyone who has worked for me, to everyone I represent, and to everyone who counts on me to be an ally and supporter and champion of women. There's more I want to say, but the first and most important thing—and if it's the only thing you care to hear, that's fine—is: I'm sorry.

“I respect women. I don't respect men who don't. And the fact that my own actions have given people a good reason to doubt that makes me feel ashamed.

“But I want to say something else, too. Over the last few months, all of us—including and especially men who respect women—have been forced to take a good, hard look at our own actions and think (perhaps, shamefully, for the first time) about how those actions have affected women.

“For instance, that picture. I don't know what was in my head when I took that picture, and it doesn't matter. There's no excuse. I look at it now and I feel disgusted with myself. It isn't funny. It's completely inappropriate. It's obvious how Leeann would feel violated by that picture. And, what's more, I can see how millions of other women would feel violated by it—women who have had similar experiences in their own lives, women who fear having those experiences, women who look up to me, women who have counted on me.

“Coming from the world of comedy, I've told and written a lot of jokes that I once thought were funny but later came to realize were just plain offensive. But the intentions behind my actions aren't the point at all. It's the impact these jokes had on others that matters. And I'm sorry it's taken me so long to come to terms with that.

“While I don't remember the rehearsal for the skit as Leeann does, I understand why we need to listen to and believe women’s experiences.

“I am asking that an ethics investigation be undertaken, and I will gladly cooperate.

“And the truth is, what people think of me in light of this is far less important than what people think of women who continue to come forward to tell their stories. They deserve to be heard, and believed. And they deserve to know that I am their ally and supporter. I have let them down and am committed to making it up to them.”

These remarks or are there others that he also made? These don't say anything that you claim they do.

[Breccia]

He should resign immediately.

Sorry, but, no he should not.

There is someone running for Senate, right now, who is accused of statutory-ing a 14 year old and a half-dozen other girls/women who were also manhandled. Not only has that candidate refused to drop out, depending on which polls you're looking at, he's ahead and/or gaining.

AND Trump, the leader of the majority party, has not condemned the behavior. In fact, he damn near admitted the same thing himself.

If the American people prove that groping an unwilling child is behavior they are willing to accept, then Franken has zero to negative reasons to stand down. Any attempt to say he should is a moral equivalence argument, and therefore, invalid.

The only way to resolve this situation is to do so in a way that's equal to every side involved. Asking Franken to resign for things far, far less than what Moore (running) and Trump (won) have admitted to doing, is not equal.

Sorry. I don't make the rules.

His voters can throw him out if they object to his behavior.

[Dextroden]

Nope, but your world would be easier if that were the case. I've already condemned Spacey and C.K. - so I'm fine. Also Weiner, so save your partisan drama for someone else.

This is about being fair before we destroy a person.

Hmm. That's hilarious from "Trump is guilty because of that recording crowd".

[cubby]

These remarks or are there others that he also made? These don't say anything that you claim they do.

You mean thoughtful remarks from a person who wants to honestly evaluate their past actions. Yeah, we really want to get rid of people like that.

Jesus, how much does the GOP pay you per post?

[Deletedaccount1]

Nope, but your world would be easier if that were the case. I've already condemned Spacey and C.K. - so I'm fine. Also Weiner, so save your partisan drama for someone else.

This is about being fair before we destroy a person.

Only a fool would defend those two with incontrovertible evidence against them. They are also not entirely partisan nor are they prominent Democratic leaders. Your first post was lambasting people for criticizing him and immediately deflecting to the other party so so much for "save your partisan drama for someone else". I guess it is only okay when you do it.

[Breccia]

EDIT: Update

The woman who accused Sen. Al Franken (D-Minn.) of sexual misconduct said she accepts his apology.

[mvaliz]

One is far worse than the other but they are both the same class of crime that should not be tolerated among people as important as senators.

Our current dumbass in chief has done far worse than what Franken did, and yet you don't seem to give a shit about that....

Unless you're suggesting we hold our Senators (especially ones with a "D" next to their name) to different standards than our presidents (Especially ones with an "R" next to their name).

[Valizix]

I realize you're going for points, but he's doing what he's doing in front of a lot of people. He's generally known as a good guy. He claims not touching, and rehearsing a scene. So far only her word vs his. Let's not condemn a person based on an event that has different versions until we know more, shall we?

read the article, the kiss she complained about was for some skit they were rehearsing, the pic happened when she was asleep, are you claiming she was fake sleeping?

[Deletedaccount1]

You mean thoughtful remarks from a person who wants to honestly evaluate their past actions. Yeah, we really want to get rid of people like that.

Jesus, how much does the GOP pay you per post?

You said his remarks prove it wasn't sexual assault and that he didn't grope her. Highlight where in that quote he said that or show me somewhere else where he said that.

[mvaliz]

EDIT: Update

The woman who accused Sen. Al Franken (D-Minn.) of sexual misconduct said she accepts his apology.

Oh, well - that does it then. Case closed... right?

Yes, this is sarcasm BTW. >_<

But, I will admit at least this is appearing very civil between them ATM. :P

[cubby]

Only a fool would defend those two with incontrovertible evidence against them. They are also not entirely partisan nor are they prominent Democratic leaders. Your first post was lambasting people for criticizing him and immediately deflecting to the other party so so much for "save your partisan drama for someone else". I guess it is only okay when you do it.

So you're ok with having double standards based on party lines? That's great - I hope you're proud of yourself - you're demeaning every sexual assault victim out there. You're part of the problem.

[Deletedaccount1]

Our current dumbass in chief has done far worse than what Franken did, and yet you don't seem to give a shit about that....

Unless you're suggesting we hold our Senators (especially ones with a "D" next to their name) to different standards than our presidents (Especially ones with an "R" next to their name).

I do give a shit about that and that is just one of many reasons why Trump should not be president. You claim to know what I think about that like you know me personally when you are just some guy who has gotten upset over a select few of my posts on a forum to the point where you presume to know my positions on everything else.

[cubby]

read the article, the kiss she complained about was for some skit they were rehearsing, the pic happened when she was asleep, are you claiming she was fake sleeping?

Exactly. Kiss was for a skit and the pic is a gag photo, and he's not touching her.

[Breccia]

But, I will admit at least this is appearing very civil between them

Again: the cases were nearly nothing alike, and their responses were nothing alike. It should be no surprise the endings are nothing alike, either.

Franken's voters are free to vote against him, as Moore's voters are. We will find out if this is behavior the American people choose to accept...I mean, accept again, they elected Trump for fuck's sake.

[Deletedaccount1]

So you're ok with having double standards based on party lines? That's great - I hope you're proud of yourself - you're demeaning every sexual assault victim out there. You're part of the problem.

Why am I okay with a double standard? It seems like you're just intentionally making up shit that I say.

[cubby]

Oh, well - that does it then. Case closed... right?

Yes, this is sarcasm BTW. >_<

But, I will admit at least this is appearing very civil between them ATM. :P

It will be interesting to see how this actually plays out. I'm curious to see if this is an isolated incident or if more accusations come out. Typically, we see multiple victims from a lifetime of behavior. Which doesn't discount a single victim at all.

[lazypeon100]

Given that he apologized, the woman accepted it, and no one else has come forward, I think I can forgive him.

Forget about it? No. This is still a stain on his reputation and should not be forgotten about. I absolutely hope that if this happened with any other woman that they come forward. As much as I want trump gone, I want to air our own dirty laundry as well, whatever that might be.

Still don't understand those trying to equate this to Roy Moore though.