Is it just me or the quality of people in M+ is...lacking?

[Deleted]

The higher keys you do, the smoother are the runs. That is not luck, party leaders check applicants more carefully when pugging higher runs.


This topic is about low keys (+12/+13 was mentioned in OP), and for those M+ scores are indeed irrelevant. For players that only do weekly runs, the score is completely random, depending on how early in the week they run M+ (to get on leaderboards), and whether they prefer to run only specific dungeons.

I think the M+ score becomes useful only once you start pushing keys around +16 or +17, and higher. That's about the point when you can expect that every player applying has put some effort to do every dungeon on at least +15 in time, and comparing the scores across different players starts to have some value.

I suppose I wasn't talking about just the Mythic score, rather the entire 'checking wowprogress' thing. Being able to check what keys a player has done is extremely useful and the score reflects that. If someone has done a lot of +15's they'll have a score that will indicate to me that they're worth taking to a 15 or 16. I don't just look at the score though, I scroll down to see what they've done.

I'm new to the wowprogress thing myself, though. I've been trying to get my score up precisely because I find it useful myself to check when I'm the one forming groups. Currently my score is 1.8k but I've not done upper kara yet, at all, and so I expect it'd jump to 1.9 when that's done. WoWProgress shows others that I've done most dungeons on 15, some on 14 and some on 16.

Maybe I'm thinking of something else and we're not talking about the same Mythic score as I'm not sure what you mean by the score is completely random. The column on the right 'score' seems pretty solid to me. The higher key you do, the higher the score and presumably, though I'm honestly not sure, that score is increased a little by how fast the key is cleared. A 14 gets me a score 140+, a 15 gets me a score of +150, a 16, 160 etc.

https://www.wowprogress.com/characte...crest/Sarithus

[bewbew]

People who leave other people's stones are the worst.

No one said it was "10 minutes Hall of Valor only or I'm out". Mistakes happen. People screw up.

It's very rare for someone to be absolutly awful and still be wanting to do a 15 stone.

[Nayami]

I donno tbh Mythic+ runs feel pretty easy this time around. I've been using the Raider.IO addon that shows you a player's M+ score and what role they play the most in M+ and I'm finding it great for finding good players (It's much better than just iLvl at least).

If you're having trouble though you could always go with a heavy CR comp while we can take advantage of this. I remember doing this for the first few weeks of tyrannical as many of my groups had problems especially with some bosses that became super OP with tyrannical and multiple CRs allowed us to get away with a lot of mistakes.

[Accendor]

It happens quite often when pugging +19, and nearly always for 20+ runs. Some key holders require to use voice even for +17 and +18, but you do not meet them very often.



I think we have to speak about the same the difficulty here. It is hard to make friends in weekly runs between +10 and +14. But once you start joining groups around +15 that try to push the key up, and then do the next key as follow-up (with the same people) - you get opportunities to befriend people. Basically, you need to be doing some entrance-level challenging content before the concept of possibly making friends can kick in. Players need to feel they put the effort to overcome some hard challenge together, not simply deleted mobs off the server in some +10 dungeon while having 940 gear. They also need to be motivated to push the keys as high as possible, and use that as a basis of their friendship.

I totally agree on that. This sounds very logical and perhaps my different view comes from the fact that I never do anything above +11, because there is simply no reason for it (in Terms of character progression). e.g. it is usually way faster to do 2 m+10 than 1 m+15, while the former also gives more rewards.
Perhaps I will try to push some keys, just for the sake of pushing them.
Thanks!

[Marrilaife]

The proof of this, is that when Blizzard removed most class buffs, the majority of the community was fine with it.

I was so very NOT fine with it, and consider it to be a HORRID design move, intended to cater to entitled casuals, who want to be GIVEN success, instead of having to work hard and earn it.

Yep, you heard it here first: class buffs make you skilled. Pressing blessing of salvation or whatever every 5 minutes was such a great way of working towards your in-game rewards, pinnacle of game design.

Can't wait until vanilla servers are opened so all these people can finally go there stew in their sauce.

[Hey There Guys its Metro]

I pug 20+ mythic+ a week and never have to leave a single one. Sounds like You are the problem. I can literally solo the ones I do, so if you are struggling with 12s you are in trouble when antorus comes out.

One problem that might be happening is those keys don't appeal to good players but really at the 12 level it shouldn't either matter. Focus on getting better at ways you can carry dungeons.

[cocacolawheresthesoda]

I pug 20+ mythic+ a week and never have to leave a single one. Sounds like You are the problem. I can literally solo the ones I do, so if you are struggling with 12s you are in trouble when antorus comes out.

One problem that might be happening is those keys don't appeal to good players but really at the 12 level it shouldn't either matter. Focus on getting better at ways you can carry dungeons.

I wanna cut my veins when I read this. Objectively speaking, you have no base to say that. My success / fault is 1/5 of the team's.

It's almost never your fault if you're someone who thinks about the game. Most people don't.

It's simply a case of me being able to clear 15-17s with 0 issues in a good time when the team is good and wipe in 12s with inbred retards. People are dumb and unfortunately you can't always pick the best, because unless you get a MoS key, you delete it.

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What about skilled player who don't so M+ often so they don't have a good score, ignore them ?

Corrrect. Ignore, because they're not good. You're in the situation that every human is.

They think they're good with no basis.

"M+ score doesn't matter.". As soon as you hit 2k, you request it.

"ilvl doesn't matter". -> you're low ilvl. As soon as you git 940, you request no less than that.

Stop being a hypocrite. Sorry for attacking you, but it's getting tired, how unintelligent o you have to be to even contemplate saying these things?

I'm a 945, decent M+ score tank with all my alts at 940 or so and don't even play a lot, yet I can recognize that the only relevant stat is ilvl, because having seen plenty of 2K+ people, they never perform.

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Yes, I dont care about composition while doing M+ 10-12 for weekly. I just invite by ilvl needed and rarely have problems. If there is a problem with someone in group or even me, nothing stops me for doing another group later.
Never used any wowprogress ranking or some other thing, no joy in it, no fun in cherrypicking best players to overgear and overskill a place. Rng of choosing players only by ilvl is kinda exciting. I dont mind wiping and I dont rage ever.

You're clearly low ilvl and can't ask for more ilvl, stop being a hypocrite. As soon as you git 940, you request 940.

It's a law of nature to pick the easiest path possible. Why waste 30 mins when you can do it in 15?

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one day people will learn ilvl doesnt = skill. Nor do achievements. One day....

ilvl = the most objective indicator of skill.

You're clearly low ilvl, again, as per my other posts, stop being a hypocrite. You will request 940 as soon as you hit 940, you simply can't now.

It's like saying "money doesn't matter". Yea, it absolutely does and it matters most, but when you don't have it, you must say these things to cope.

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A habitual M+ group dropper believes that he's surrounded by bad players.

Let's see if we can spot the issue here.

I think I can see the issue. It's someone's negative IQ.

[RobertoCarlos]

I wanna cut my veins when I read this. Objectively speaking, you have no base to say that. My success / fault is 1/5 of the team's.

It's almost never your fault if you're someone who thinks about the game. Most people don't.

It's simply a case of me being able to clear 15-17s with 0 issues in a good time when the team is good and wipe in 12s with inbred retards. People are dumb and unfortunately you can't always pick the best, because unless you get a MoS key, you delete it.

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Corrrect. Ignore, because they're not good. You're in the situation that every human is.

They think they're good with no basis.

"M+ score doesn't matter.". As soon as you hit 2k, you request it.

"ilvl doesn't matter". -> you're low ilvl. As soon as you git 940, you request no less than that.

Stop being a hypocrite. Sorry for attacking you, but it's getting tired, how unintelligent o you have to be to even contemplate saying these things?

I'm a 945, decent M+ score tank with all my alts at 940 or so and don't even play a lot, yet I can recognize that the only relevant stat is ilvl, because having seen plenty of 2K+ people, they never perform.

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You're clearly low ilvl and can't ask for more ilvl, stop being a hypocrite. As soon as you git 940, you request 940.

It's a law of nature to pick the easiest path possible. Why waste 30 mins when you can do it in 15?

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ilvl = the most objective indicator of skill.

You're clearly low ilvl, again, as per my other posts, stop being a hypocrite. You will request 940 as soon as you hit 940, you simply can't now.

It's like saying "money doesn't matter". Yea, it absolutely does and it matters most, but when you don't have it, you must say these things to cope.

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I think I can see the issue. It's someone's negative IQ.

How low is my ilvl Mr I know everything. Tell me. I have 3 toons so you need 3 numbers. Will tell you if you get close

[ItsTiddles]

yet I can recognize that the only relevant stat is ilvl

ilvl = the most objective indicator of skill.

Okay OP confirmed a troll.

/thread

[Marrilaife]

unless you get a MoS key, you delete it.

That's sooo 7.1... MOS after 7.2 changes is much more punishing to pugs on both Tyrannical and Fortified than many other old dungeons. Several trash that can't be stunned, Helya being a long boss and really easy to die on, and so forth.

Generally I make groups on my own key as long as it's not any of the new dungeons (Kara, Cath, Seat), and most of the remaining ones are better options than Maw, Maw is only good on low keys super zerg mode because low key = nothing is punishing, you can do it in 3 mass pulls etc. Would I do Maw in 3 pulls on grievous / bolstering / bursting / explosive whatever other affix with pugs? Hell nope. They're pugs. You don't know how they're gonna fare. Maybe they will stand in defiant strikes. Maybe healer is weak. Maybe no one interrupts. And so forth.

I think my personal best choice is Darkheart Thicket. Court / Arcway is usually good too. Eye of Azshara I don't mind either. Neltharion is fine with half the affixes, with the other half is annoying. All the above better options than Maw.

So far the only key from the ones I don't personally exclude where I had problems finding people for, was Blackrook Hold. And even then, I eventually found enough pugs.

[MasterOfNone]

one day people will learn ilvl doesnt = skill. Nor do achievements. One day....

so much this. my hunter alt is fresh 110 so ilvl is like 867 or something as of now. i cant even get into mythic 0 because people are like "rofl ilvl"

@ op: i find people like you are the people that fail mechanics more often than not. you judge everyone else as you fail.

[Swiftshadow]

Heroic ToS is also way easier than 10-15 m+ yet consistently rewards more loot of better quality..

This is why i only tank M+10 ONCE a week per toon, no more no less unless guildies ask for help. The consistency of the rewards are not good enough for me to endure through the affixes annoyances or the time spent. It is quite possible for me to go through 5 consecutive M+13 or above and get no gear or what I do get I vendor away. At least H ToS STILL has chances of decent off-spec trinkets at the very least.

I do one +10 a week on my main and always do it with randoms that are 940+ and I have never had any issues. I have never looked at m+ score before nor do I care what mine or anyone elses is. Until I run into issues with not being able to complete a 10 then I may resort to m+ score.

Yep. My philosophy for M+ all the time.

[lockybalboa]

Just had a tank from goldrinn who would pull avoidable packs, and 2 packs at one time. The leader got so pissed that he kicked the tank right before the last boss died.

[MagusHenosis]

People think 930+ means you must be good at the game/class/something. The fact is getting gear is so easy now-a-days anyone can reach it.

The fact is that the GAME is "so easy" now.

That's what happens when you "dumb the game down" there Blizzard.

Who would have known, right???

I would have it seems, since I did lol!!!

Face it guys, I am easily #1 at knowing what is best for the game, since I just keep being right about it again and again, for over 10 years now.

I am able to do this, since my mind is not loaded with a bunch of BULLSHIT, like wanting an unfair advantage over other players via EXTREMELY OPd specs, and wanting others to be less than me, etc.

Perhaps if y'all next leveled your minds as I have, then you could see it too.

[Deleted]

You're clearly low ilvl and can't ask for more ilvl, stop being a hypocrite. As soon as you git 940, you request 940.

It's a law of nature to pick the easiest path possible. Why waste 30 mins when you can do it in 15?
.

Think you are totally lost in this thread, you are answering to wrong people.
But to answer you on this - you are jumping to conclusions very fast. I have two chars at 943 ilvl and I ask 925 for +10 and 930 for +12.
And its not about wasting time, its about helping people to easier get to groups for weekly chest. They helped me with my alts taking them to weekly, so I want to do the same for them. Yes, I like people, I want to help them. Doesnt matter I wont probably meet them again.
Sorry, I just cant be egocentric like you.

[Jastall]

Expect nothing of pugs and you won't be disappointed. I do +8/9/10s on my alts with pugs and it usually works, but any more than that and it's guild city for me.

[ComputerNerd]

Pick better groups /shrug

Pretty much this.
How are you actually judging people.

If it is by score, by item level, etc or anything that is over and done with in less than 10 seconds then we have nobody to blame but ourselves for poor results.

Look for quicker measures, get poor results, blame everyone but ourselves, look for even quicker measures to fix the last ones.
And so the cycle repeats.

[infinit]

M+ scores have been great for filtering out the majority of bad players, you still get the occasional bad ones but its miles ahead of just accepting everyone.
ilvl (most the most part) and achievements are pointless. (though good M+ scores also tend to come with high ilvls)

[Saphyron]

The m+ rating is just silly. Even though a person do 15+ easily enough but that person do one m+ a week for the weekly chest will show as someone with 1k rating or so and won't get invited to the group. But it seems to be the norm so whatyoudoabout it.

Guildgroups ftw!

I do upwards to 3 mythic+ a week. Which means my score is low since its 3 different chars. perfect example is my signatur.

[MasterOfNone]

Go to Argus and get 910 item level in like a day, then do M+, easy peasy

I’m not complaining. I know you can do that. Haven’t had much time. The time I did play I kinda wanted to do dungeons. No one will take you on a mythic zero even it seems unless you are 900 ilvl