Is Veganism really a healthy lifestyle?

[Raelbo]

The fact we can eat meat or not isn’t any real indication one way or another we also have teeth for chewing that carnivores don’t.

Since your arguments seems nigh incomprehensible, I traced it back to where it started:

We don't have sharp canines what are you talking about?

To answer your initial question: Our canines are sharper than our other teeth (namely our molars). They exist for the purpose of eating meat. Are they "sharp" relative to most pure carnivores? No, or course not. We're omnivores. Also we have, for a long time, learned to use tools (weapons to kill, cutlery to eat) to do what carnivores rely on their teeth for, so our canines have presumably been getting smaller over time.

I suggest you stop fixating on this argument because it's utterly pointless since it in no way affects the original point you were replying to (also, you don't seem to understand what those replying to you are trying to say, nor are you presenting your argument in a cogent manner, so they can't understand your viewpoint, meaning you're talking past each other)

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It's a difficult topic, most people get quite deffensive about it.

<snip>

Veganism is sadly a victim to a lot of misinformation and propaganda, but i don't think attacking people for being vegan OR non-vegan is going to lead to anything productive. Be open to change, think about what you're eating and don't let things get to your head.

The issue is that the choice to be vegan is generally driven primarily by a moral decision to not exploit animals. For people who aren't vegan, that comes across as being highly judgemental (regardless of whether it's actually true or not).

And given that our bodies are ostensibly designed to consume animal products, it's understandable that people would get defensive when they feel judged for doing so.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Since your arguments seems nigh incomprehensible, I traced it back to where it started:



To answer your initial question: Our canines are sharper than our other teeth (namely our molars). They exist for the purpose of eating meat. Are they "sharp" relative to most pure carnivores? No, or course not. We're omnivores. Also we have, for a long time, learned to use tools (weapons to kill, cutlery to eat) to do what carnivores rely on their teeth for, so our canines have presumably been getting smaller over time.

I suggest you stop fixating on this argument because it's utterly pointless since it in no way affects the original point you were replying to (also, you don't seem to understand what those replying to you are trying to say, nor are you presenting your argument in a cogent manner, so they can't understand your viewpoint, meaning you're talking past each other)

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The issue is that the choice to be vegan is generally driven primarily by a moral decision to not exploit animals. For people who aren't vegan, that comes across as being highly judgemental (regardless of whether it's actually true or not).

And given that our bodies are ostensibly designed to consume animal products, it's understandable that people would get defensive when they feel judged for doing so.

Humans seem more to be able to adapt to environments rather than choosing a diet based on whatever development but here’s a pretty good breakdown on teeth.

[Raelbo]

Humans seem more to be able to adapt to environments rather than choosing a diet based on whatever development but here’s a pretty good breakdown on teeth.

/facepalm

No, it's a shit breakdown on teeth, and it took me all of one google search to find a suitable rebuttal: by a vegan biologist

An image that constantly circulates in various places is this:

As much as I agree with veganism, distorting facts to make a point is not the way to go. In fact, it’s counterproductive.

I gave you the perfect opportunity to exit the hole you dug yourself into gracefully. But hell, if you choose to insist on trying to make everyone think you're a fool, please feel free to continue.

[Doctor Amadeus]

/facepalm

No, it's a shit breakdown on teeth, and it took me all of one google search to find a suitable rebuttal: by a vegan biologist



I gave you the perfect opportunity to exit the hole you dug yourself into gracefully. But hell, if you choose to insist on trying to make everyone think you're a fool, please feel free to continue.

We are talking teeth here, chop shop. I am not so enamoured with my ego if I am wrong on a point that I need to hide, I am ok with correcting myself, I am not ok with making bold grand assumptions if I am wrong in the opposite direction either.

I said humans have decided mostly now days and choose what is part of their diet and our bodies have reacting accordingly, I am not making any pronouncements about what human beings are in in terms of that, what I am saying though is teeth, being used as an example and teeth alone, don't let whatever name fool you into believing we are similar to carnivores in that department and you are flat out wrong.

If it's just based on teeth, guess what you aren't in that club!

[ryan92084]

I find it ironic that they chose some sort of ape's mouth for the frugivorous picture since certain apes are known to occasionally hunt and eat meat.

[Rurin]

Yeast is Fungi (a.k.a. mushrooms) Fungi are genetically closer to animals than plants, even though they've got their own kingdom.

Yes, but just because they're closer doesn't make them animals just like how dogs aren't humans even though they're closer to us than they are to birds.

If the source of the food doesn't have feelings, it's vegan. If it has feelings but is able to consent, it's vegan. Otherwise it isn't. It's that simple.

Yeast is 100% vegan, it makes no sense to claim otherwise.

[Doctor Amadeus]

I find it ironic that they chose some sort of ape's mouth for the frugivorous picture since certain apes are known to occasionally hunt and eat meat.

1 I didn't put the photo together, 2 what animals will eat has nothing to do with the conversation of what they were meant to eat, and I am not specifically going to that. But our teeth aren't an indication of what we were meant to eat by themselves.

Our moths likes the rest of our bodies have adapted and changed dependent on their environment.

[ryan92084]

1 I didn't put the photo together, 2 what animals will eat has nothing to do with the conversation of what they were meant to eat, and I am not specifically going to that. But our teeth aren't an indication of what we were meant to eat by themselves.

Our moths likes the rest of our bodies have adapted and changed dependent on their environment.

Neat, I didn't say you did, it did, or they would. I only commented on a "info" graphic that made a poor choice when it was trying to push an agenda.

[Raelbo]

We are talking teeth here, chop shop. I am not so enamoured with my ego if I am wrong on a point that I need to hide, I am ok with correcting myself, I am not ok with making bold grand assumptions if I am wrong in the opposite direction either.

I said humans have decided mostly now days and choose what is part of their diet and our bodies have reacting accordingly, I am not making any pronouncements about what human beings are in in terms of that, what I am saying though is teeth, being used as an example and teeth alone, don't let whatever name fool you into believing we are similar to carnivores in that department and you are flat out wrong.

If it's just based on teeth, guess what you aren't in that club!

Time to stop digging. Read what I said in my first response and bow out with grace.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Neat, I didn't say you did, it did, or they would. I only commented on a "info" graphic that made a poor choice when it was trying to push an agenda.

Ok well I disagree, I mean it gives some other information too probably more along the lines of pronouncing about what Humans should be, and I think it's a pretty good break down so much that the rebuttal seemed to find a need to break it down which is also fine.

But I am just talking about teeth and no other pronouncements, I mean shit I didn't even know this was a hot debate

[Jibjub]

Eggs are the cheapest protein where I live.

The treatment of chickens, and the people who process chickens, however, is horrific.

I personally only buy eggs from some local farmers I know, for this reason.

Agreed. It's a shame that it's more expensive and harder to find eggs/meat from responsible, humane farms. But swearing off meat completely because of it is unfortunate. If red meat makes you feel terrible, sure avoid it. But not eating eggs and fish is just crazy.

I just go back to ... eat what you like and what doesn't make you feel like crap and what you are confident comes from a good source. If you're diet has a name, you're doing it wrong I can almost guarantee you.

[Deleted]

But not eating eggs and fish is just crazy.

Eh. I am allergic to eggs, and thus obviously avoid them - and it hasn't caused any issues for me.
You don't really need either of those two things.

[Doctor Amadeus]

Time to stop digging. Read what I said in my first response and bow out with grace.

I read what you wrote, and I haven't dug myself into anything, you simply found a hole in your mind for my argument you haven't proven contrary suggested your own views and misrepresented mine.

On teeth along you are not a omnivore If I thought teeth alone or any one detail alone determined this. If you want to go with other details around that such as your body structure your in ability to produces the PSI to make such natural teeth useful in any way, your stomach and the literal type of teeth I don't mean their shape, make you not a carnivore.

As far as omnivore that is just well I guess you are a little of both. Well we see a breakdown of Herbivores also. Our teeth look closer but honesty, it looks as though our teeth took the same route as the rest of our body parts and developed based on our choices.

[Deleted]

Funny how it is no mystery, yet obesity and heart diseases as well as diabetics and all other food related diseases are on the rise.

...and people always point and laugh at the vegans and vegetarians. Now shouldn't the question really be if our so called "normal" lifestyle is healthy?

Because of laziness, fast food, junk food and ease of access. There's enough evidence for a healthy diet involving meat & veg

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The canines are situated at the 'corners' of the dental arches. They have a sharp, pointed biting surface. Their function is to grip and tear food. There are four canine teeth in both primary and permanent dentitions.

Can we STFU about canine teeth now

[Elim Garak]

I have no issues that have bothered me enough to go to a doctor for the last 25 years, so I wouldn't know. Isn't that what people are worried about anyway, how much healthcare a fat person actually seeks out because it will cost them a rise in their own premiums? Well, no worries there, I have not sought out any healthcare for 25 years, my 340bs is not the cause of your healthcare premiums rising these past 25 years!

Wow, define enough? Blood pressure and insulin are sneaky. You get used to high blood pressure (I had 250 when I found out about it, I felt fine and they wanted to hospitalize me, but once they dropped my blood pressure - I understood what they meant) and insulin in your blood - well you won't feel anything directly related but it ends in Diabetes.

Do you actually wait for something that will require an ambulance? I understand that healthcare is not cheap where you live but man health is priceless. The damage obesity does to the body is irreversible. Spine is just bones it won't heal without a surgery and surgery is not magic either. Heart will not decrease in size after certain point. Your arteries are also hardly repairable. Your medical bill WILL be MUCH higher. Unless it's just a funeral service bill.

[Al Gorefiend]

Yes it can be if you commit to it.

I know a healthy vegan who rotates her diet and I know another vegan who only ever eats pasta, carbs and junk food

[Beardless Man]

If you consider the egotistical boost and the heavily lacking diet healthy...

[Zandalarian Paladin]

You have to balance your diet, or you'll die of malnutrition. Veganism doesn't cover the vast array of needs that your body have.

Vegetarianism can be done, assuming that you have no allergies to nuts and as long that you maintain a carefully planned diet.

[Jibjub]

Eh. I am allergic to eggs, and thus obviously avoid them - and it hasn't caused any issues for me.
You don't really need either of those two things.

Well obviously if you're allergic to eggs then you should probably avoid them! :P

You don't NEED eggs or fish, but to not eat them because you blindly yell "MEAT IS BAD FOR HUMANS!" is just incorrect and flies in the face of thousands of years of evolution. There is nothing but positive research about their health benefits. I just think veganism (and any diet with a name and books (i.e., any diet that is just a fad)) is silly and wrong.

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Oh. Also. Forcing your (wrong) vegan beliefs onto young babies and children is terrible. Which is another good indicator that your diet probably isn't great. If it can cause young babies and pregnant women to have serious issues ... maybe it's time to rethink your ideas on veganism????

[Deleted]

First things first this isn't a thread to bash Veganism nor preach it! I don't want people insulting each other over lifestyle choices, the thread is to discuss Veganism in a civil manner...

So we know a number of people become Vegan for ethical reasons BUT is it really better for your health than Vegetarianism and Meat-Eating?

no reason it cant be.

I'd recommend you use an app like myfitnesspal to enter your meals for a while when you start it to make sure you are getting the nutrients and vitamins you need, can be tricky to do that if you go full on veganism.

I'd not do it, but if you go that way, just put the effort in to begin with to learn what you need to eat.