Girl Scouts : Hugging relatives during the holidays violates consent

[Orby]

So to cut down the risk of molestation you as parents must sacrifice your own love for your children unless the children ask for it themselves.

As an uncle to a niece and nephew of 2 and 3 and baby sits a lot. I will hug these children every day publicly. My niece isn't a hugable person and when she wants out I will let go, my nephew is a hug machine anyway so I don't even have to ask, he'll charge at me arms open at random lol.

[Cassidin]

Everything is offensive. Everything is wrong. Everything has hidden meaning.

It's out of fucking control.

I am deeply offended by this, you are offensive and you have offended me. I will be live the rest of my life in fear of this offence you have caused me.

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Forcing your kids to go to school violates their consent too. We'd better just let them do what they want, otherwise we would be acting immorally.

I kinda think this idea of letting kids decide everything for themselves was tried a few years ago and didn't work out so well..... I guess enough years have gone past since Dr Spock's experiments for us to all want to try it again - go for it!

[draynay]

Must be time to send all the children away to be raised by psychologists, the only fit parents...

[Zindai]

No. It doesn't. It says if you shouldn't insist. It doesn't say it's wrong to teach kids about physical affection using hugs, etc. You just shouldn't guilt them into it or say that it's a necessity but an option.

This I can agree with. I ask the little boys (4 and 1) in my family if I can get a hug, and they usually give one. If not, then no big deal.

[Deleted]

And I suggest you look this up, children who aren't thought how to deal with other children have a massive increase in crime rates and social issues.

I'm going to trust the developmental psychologist, not random people on the internet

Btw You just flipped "let the child decide who they want to hug" into "anti-social children are more likely to be criminal". People who pull semantic rabbits out of hats are usually having the rabbit for lunch.

[Hashtronaut]

Is this an early April fools joke?

[Deleted]

Okay, so? Should I force you to hug some old wrinkly guy you don't know very well because it'll make him happy? What's the difference? "they're family" is shitty argument if you resort to that. You don't know them any better than you know the old wrinkly guy down the street.

The article isn't just talking about the potential of child abusers but that it helps teach kids about consent at an early age and that they're allowed to set personal boundaries. Again, you're missing the point of the article like every other poster in here against it.

You clearly are taking this out of context. Not even gonna bother explaining what we as a community mean with family.

[Deleted]

I have read quite a lot of books and articles on this subject, and the following points are undisputable truths.
1. Most sexual molestation happens in the home, and the offendes are most often family or friends.
2. One of the most common techniques used by such predators is to give kids gifts, take them out for ice cream, and then it comes to "Now maybe you do something for grampa".

If you teach your kid that physical contact as a means of gratitude is mandatory when receiving gifts, it might have an affect on a child's ability to know that something wrong just happened. And it's crucial that children realize that something wrong has happened so they can tell a parent about it.

Does this mean children shouldn't say thank you? No. But if you're a intelligent being you can understand that the article opposes telling children that they have to show gratitude via physical contact even if it's against their will. It does not mean children should be allowed to make their own decisions in all situations and it doesn't mean a hug from an uncle equals rape.

Everyone needs to learn the trait somewhere.... /facepalm

1. Never said that they did not, but that has exactly nothing to do with having to hug your grandparents. This is mostly due to shitty parenting, and the perpetuation of shitty parenting, parents that do not pay attention to their children, ect. take your pick.
2. Again, this has nothing to do with normal interaction and you should have learned your kids this from the beginning. There is a difference between giving your grandparents a hug and having to suck off a stranger in a buss because they got you ice cream.

You should learn your kid that there is nothing wrong with physical contact and hugging in general. In some social settings hugging is mandatory, no matter how you feel about it.

The "article" is making blanket statements on what is good for a child or not, and it lets the child be the arbiter of that. There isn't a single positive thing in the entire opinion piece, and on top of that it isn't talking about "children" its talking about "girls" and that right there makes is rather sexist.

[Deleted]

The child isn't deciding what's good for them. You're generalizing it again. They're deciding who gets to touch them when it's unnecessary. Again, it's fine to explain to them that it's normal but if they just don't want to you shouldn't force them. You're not even giving a real argument at this point.

If you read it then you didn't understand it which you demonstrate with your constant generalization.

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Your first sentence clearly shows you have no fucking clue what you're talking about. There's no point in even engaging you in conversation.

It is not generalizing, it is exactly what it is, they let the child decide what is a good form of physical interaction and what is not. They do not get to decide when it is unnecessary, that is up to their parents. There is a standard for this, and that standard includes that it is okay to hug people, and that sometimes you even have to hug people. Their parents get to decide what is good for them and what isn't, its called "parenting". That you should not force them into contact might be true for some children, but hardly for all. And then you claim that i am generalizing, lol.

[Deleted]

So, you used it incorrectly and are bitching about someone referring to the real definition after accusing them of watching too much TV?

How sad.

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Why do you keep making this argument? No one is saying you can't teach your kids how to deal with other kids and social interactions.

Not talking just about dealing with other kids, talking about dealing with people in general. I was thought to give grandma a kiss when I said goodbye to her...this article is suggesting the child should decide for himself if he or she should do that...guess what, thats what children already do.

If a child doesn't like something it will let you know...again...this is a non issue.

As I really consider this a non issue I won't come back to this thread...I've given my 2cents.

[Deleted]

No one is saying don't hug your kids. They're saying that you should pay attention to them and look for signs of unwillingness and talk to them about why they don't want to and let them know that it's okay to not want to but also tell them why people give each other hugs.

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Taking what out of context? You're the one generalizing shit and making leaps to other irrelevant shit. I'm talking about what the fucking article is talking about.

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Hugging is never mandatory. That's just complete and utter nonsense.

Right, would like to see the face your partner makes when they do not get a hug from you when they need one. Or the look on your mothers face when you refuse to hug her when she did something really nice for you, or is sad or what ever. There are plenty of occasions where hugging is basically mandatory.

[Elba]

Forcing someone to do physical contact against their will is a violation of consent. How hard is that to grasp?

If your kid does not want to hug granny should the kid be punished?

[Deleted]

Forcing someone to do physical contact against their will is a violation of consent. How hard is that to grasp?

If your kid does not want to hug granny should the kid be punished?

Yes, and the punishment should consist of having to hug granny. Social skills are no different from any other skill set, they have to be taught to people.

[Elba]

Very clearly made my point. Kids can be immature and not want to hug old people for childish reasons. If your parents recognize this and tell you to hug them anyways, it can result in the child gaining a healthy understanding of people's feelings.

Your parents/grandparents don't reflect the majority of families, as they were clearly fucked up monsters.

Kids have the right to refuse to hug anyone for any reason.

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Yes, and the punishment should consist of having to hug granny. Social skills are no different from any other skill set, they have to be taught to people.

Social skills are being forced to touch someone or else?

[Elba]

It is not generalizing, it is exactly what it is, they let the child decide what is a good form of physical interaction and what is not. They do not get to decide when it is unnecessary, that is up to their parents. There is a standard for this, and that standard includes that it is okay to hug people, and that sometimes you even have to hug people. Their parents get to decide what is good for them and what isn't, its called "parenting". That you should not force them into contact might be true for some children, but hardly for all. And then you claim that i am generalizing, lol.

You never have to hug people. Any human can refuse any physical contact for any reason.

[Deleted]

Everyone needs to learn the trait somewhere.... /facepalm

1. Never said that they did not, but that has exactly nothing to do with having to hug your grandparents. This is mostly due to shitty parenting, and the perpetuation of shitty parenting, parents that do not pay attention to their children, ect. take your pick.
2. Again, this has nothing to do with normal interaction and you should have learned your kids this from the beginning. There is a difference between giving your grandparents a hug and having to suck off a stranger in a buss because they got you ice cream.

You should learn your kid that there is nothing wrong with physical contact and hugging in general. In some social settings hugging is mandatory, no matter how you feel about it.

The "article" is making blanket statements on what is good for a child or not, and it lets the child be the arbiter of that. There isn't a single positive thing in the entire opinion piece, and on top of that it isn't talking about "children" its talking about "girls" and that right there makes is rather sexist.

Saying that sexual violence against children is mostly due to shitty parenting is a blanket statement if there ever was one (it's also incorrect).

The fact remains: teaching your children that physical contact as a means of gratitude being mandatory could be negative.
Now that's a topic we could discuss because we can't know for sure if there's danger in doing so, and to which degrees.

But you like most people aren't interested in that are you? You decided when you clicked on the link that it was gonna be "feminist bullshit", and you're only really interested in picking out the details that you can ridicule and bash.

[Deleted]

Kids have the right to refuse to hug anyone for any reason.

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Social skills are being forced to touch someone or else?

A part of social skills is learning when it is okay to touch someone or when its okay to be touched, hugs are a part of this. This is something parents have to teach their children.

[Elba]

I think its important to ask why they don't want to hug. If they're just being snotty over it (example: She has a skin tag!), then while I wouldnt force the issue, they also would lose any perks form the visit (like dessert or tv time).

Kids should learn consent, but they shoudnt have snotty attitudes coddled either.

Snotty reason? "I don't want to" is all the reason you need. Pretty bad lesson for a child that refusing physical contact will result in monetary loss.

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A part of social skills is learning when it is okay to touch someone or when its okay to be touched, hugs are a part of this. This is something parents have to teach their children.

It is ok to touch someone when both parties agree to touch. When one party refuses it is not okay. Why does a child not have the right o body autonomy?

[Deleted]

Saying that sexual violence against children is mostly due to shitty parenting is a blanket statement if there ever was one (it's also incorrect).

The fact remains: teaching your children that physical contact as a means of gratitude being mandatory could be negative.
Now that's a topic we could discuss because we can't know for sure if there's danger in doing so, and to which degrees.

But you like most people aren't interested in that are you? You decided when you clicked on the link that it was gonna be "feminist bullshit", and you're only really interested in picking out the details that you can ridicule and bash.

Right, children of parents that take time for them and listen to them are at the exact same risk of being taken advantage of as a neglected kid... Of course... Its not rocket science to deduce that when parents actually care for their children and are part of their children's lives that those children have far less chance of being taken advantage of then children who do not have that parents support. Yes, it is mostly due to shitty parenting, it can happen to anyone, but not being a shitty parent will be the thing that makes the difference here, not hugs to grandparents.

The only fact that there is is that this won't ever apply to all children, yes, for some children this might be the good way to go, but for most children this will not be a great way to handle the situation.

There isn't really anything else to do then bash this opinion piece, because that is what it is, an opinion piece, and a crappy one at that.

[Elba]

Being anti abortion isn't misogyny and no matter how much you and feminists want to use your buzzwords to make pro-lifers seem evil, it's not gonna work.

Saying women have no right to body autonomy is misogyny. It hardly gets more misogynistic. And yes, anti choicers are evil.