[EU] Brexit negotiations at a standstill

[Huehuecoyotl]

Because it is a non issue. We do not have a problem with illegal immigration through the Irish border pre brexit and we won't have a problem post brexit either. If the EU want a border on Ireland let them build it at cost to their taxpayers rather than UK ones. Waste of time and money.

Honestly I feel like Rick Grimes amongst the remainer walking dead at times....

It's a non-issue at the moment, because there are easier ways to get into the UK. If you Brexit types get your way and the border is closed, it suddenly becomes the easiest way. Unless it's blocked. So, do you want to control people coming from the EU or not? Because if you do, you need a border in Ireland. If you don't, then why they hell do you even want a Brexit?

God, it's like explaining things to a toddler.

Then you, as in the EU, build that border already and stop whinging about it.

The EU need to build it to protect their market. We apparently need to build it to protect us from those horrid foreign types. Both sides have a reason for needing a border. Please try and keep up.

[Triks]

Because it is a non issue. We do not have a problem with illegal immigration through the Irish border pre brexit and we won't have a problem post brexit either. If the EU want a border on Ireland let them build it at cost to their taxpayers rather than UK ones. Waste of time and money.

Honestly I feel like Rick Grimes amongst the remainer walking dead at times....



Then you, as in the EU, build that border already and stop whinging about it.

Didn't you want to "control the borders"?

[dribbles]

Didn't you want to "control the borders"?

Physical infrastructure on Ireland is not required to do that.

It's a non-issue at the moment, because there are easier ways to get into the UK. If you Brexit types get your way and the border is closed, it suddenly becomes the easiest way. Unless it's blocked. So, do you want to control people coming from the EU or not? Because if you do, you need a border in Ireland. If you don't, then why they hell do you even want a Brexit?

God, it's like explaining things to a toddler.

Physical infrastructure on Ireland is not required to do that.

The EU need to build it to protect their market. We apparently need to build it to protect us from those horrid foreign types. Both sides have a reason for needing a border. Please try and keep up.

Glad you agree it is the EU's responsibility. Why haven't they started building it already? They have had over a year to start.

[Huehuecoyotl]

Physical infrastructure on Ireland is not required to do that.

Oh this gets better and better. Please talk me through how it will work. How are you going to stop EU people from simply walking into the UK without a border? Stern looks? Strongly worded emails?

Or have you decided that your version of Brexit doesn't need to remove freedom of movement? Are you finally coming around to a sensible viewpoint?

[Triks]

Physical infrastructure on Ireland is not required to do that.

Literally every border post in history that has customs checking has "physical infrastructure". Bulgaria's border with Macedonia - what you voted to be - has "physical infrastructure". Bulgari's border with Serbia has "physical infrastructure". Every time I go to countries outside of Schengen I have to pass through passport control at the airports.

[Ishayu]

Voters were warned.

But of course reality = project fear.

If by "reality" you mean European leaders being so complete and utter assholes it blows my mind. As Danish, and therefore represented by these people, I am appaled.

[dribbles]

Oh this gets better and better. Please talk me through how it will work. How are you going to stop EU people from simply walking into the UK without a border? Stern looks? Strongly worded emails?

Or have you decided that your version of Brexit doesn't need to remove freedom of movement? Are you finally coming around to a sensible viewpoint?

What will they do when they walk into the UK.

No 1 - they need to rent a property. All landlords having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.
No 2 - they need a job. All employers having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to employment denied.
No 3 - they need a bank account. All banks having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to money denied.
No 3 - they need a doctor. All doctors having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - They die.

Plenty of soft checks there, no hard border required.

[Triks]

What will they do when they walk into the UK.

No 1 - they need to rent a property. All landlords having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.
No 2 - they need a job. All employers having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to employment denied.
No 3 - they need a bank account. All banks having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to money denied.
No 3 - they need a doctor. All doctors having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - They die.

Plenty of soft checks there, no hard border required.

So you want the EU?

[Huehuecoyotl]

What will they do when they walk into the UK.

No 1 - they need to rent a property. All landlords having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.
No 2 - they need a job. All employers having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.
No 3 - they need a bank account. All banks having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.
No 3 - they need a doctor. All doctors having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - They die.

Plenty of soft checks there, no hard border required.

Your Brexit will radically reduce the number of workers available for certain areas of work. Work that will still need to be done. Which will create a booming black market of cash in hand jobs for these people. There are plenty of landlords that will be more than happy to cram twenty of them into a house to give themselves a huge income. And unless you are planning to introduce checks at A&E, they will simply go there if they are ill and get treated. So it's a good job that the NHS is getting an extra £350m a week out of this, eh?

And it will be as easy as you like getting all these black economy workers into the country, because Ireland doesn't have a border in your fever dream model. Sure, it's all illegal, but it is happening today. Your plan would turn it into an industry in its own right.

[Triks]

Your Brexit will radically reduce the number of workers available for certain areas of work. Work that will still need to be done. Which will create a booming black market of cash in hand jobs for these people. There are plenty of landlords that will be more than happy to cram twenty of them into a house to give themselves a huge income. And unless you are planning to introduce checks at A&E, they will simply go there if they are ill and get treated. So it's a good job that the NHS is getting an extra £350m a week out of this, eh?

And it will be as easy as you like getting all these black economy workers into the country, because Ireland doesn't have a border in your fever dream model. Sure, it's all illegal, but it is happening today. Your plan would turn it into an industry in its own right.

And that .

[Mayhem]

What will they do when they walk into the UK.

No 1 - they need to rent a property. All landlords having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.

Unless the landlord doesn't check their residental eligbility, then what?

No 2 - they need a job. All employers having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.

Unless the employer doesn't check their residental eligibility or simple doesn't care that they are employing illegals, then what?

No 3 - they need a bank account. All banks having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.

So you're saying everyone visiting the UK will need a british bank account?

No 3 - they need a doctor. All doctors having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - They die.

Unless of course doctors who don't check for that.

Plenty of soft checks there, no hard border required.

Plenty of checks that rely upon everyone in the UK to fight crime. Good luck with that.

So your solution is that people are pushed to become criminals, which is of course not really an issue for the ones who are illegally in the UK as they already are criminals.

Also how are you going to stop goods from being smuggled into the UK?

[Huehuecoyotl]

Also how are you going to stop goods from being smuggled into the UK?

Judging by Dribbles previous responses, I'm guessing he is expecting this to be handled by the Ministry of Magic. Anyone that tries to bring things in illegally will be identified by dementors and shipped off to Azkaban. Simples.

[Mayhem]

Judging by Dribbles previous responses, I'm guessing he is expecting this to be handled by the Ministry of Magic. Anyone that tries to bring things in illegally will be identified by dementors and shipped off to Azkaban. Simples.

Almost spit out my coffee reading that.

[Acidz]

What will they do when they walk into the UK.

No 1 - they need to rent a property. All landlords having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to accommodation denied.
No 2 - they need a job. All employers having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to employment denied.
No 3 - they need a bank account. All banks having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - Access to money denied.
No 3 - they need a doctor. All doctors having checked their residential eligibility will refuse - They die.

Plenty of soft checks there, no hard border required.

So you are saying the problem of illegal immigration is non-existent?

[Triks]

Judging by Dribbles previous responses, I'm guessing he is expecting this to be handled by the Ministry of Magic. Anyone that tries to bring things in illegally will be identified by dementors and shipped off to Azkaban. Simples.

Brexiters want the EU but they don't want to admit it. This proposal of his works if you are in a very deep trade and customs union with your neighbouring countries and relies on the ones having external borders to aggressively police them.

[dribbles]

Your Brexit will radically reduce the number of workers available for certain areas of work. Work that will still need to be done. Which will create a booming black market of cash in hand jobs for these people. There are plenty of landlords that will be more than happy to cram twenty of them into a house to give themselves a huge income. And unless you are planning to introduce checks at A&E, they will simply go there if they are ill and get treated. So it's a good job that the NHS is getting an extra £350m a week out of this, eh?

And it will be as easy as you like getting all these black economy workers into the country, because Ireland doesn't have a border in your fever dream model. Sure, it's all illegal, but it is happening today. Your plan would turn it into an industry in its own right.

Unless the landlord doesn't check their residental eligbility, then what?
Unless the employer doesn't check their residental eligibility or simple doesn't care that they are employing illegals, then what?
So you're saying everyone visiting the UK will need a british bank account?
Unless of course doctors who don't check for that.
Plenty of checks that rely upon everyone in the UK to fight crime. Good luck with that.
So your solution is that people are pushed to become criminals, which is of course not really an issue for the ones who are illegally in the UK as they already are criminals.

Also how are you going to stop goods from being smuggled into the UK?

If that were the case it would be happening widely now with non EU migrants. In the very rare cases that it does happen now, the proceeds of crime act confiscates the illegally used property and illegal immigrants are arrested and deported. The same will happen after Brexit except in addition this will apply also to EU citizens.

Property owning landlords with assets and wealth don't like breaking the law and losing these properties.

Again under the current system of illegal employment it doesn't happen widely now. In the rare cases that are reported the business owner who illegally employs is fined, put out of business and the employee deported. Same for EU people after Brexit.

At the minute UK banks will open accounts for EU people, they need these to access valuable in work benefits. After exit EU citizens will not have easy access to work, benefits, housing, medicine or bank accounts. UK banks will refuse to open them anything but non resident accounts.

Why do you need a hard border in Ireland you say?

So you are saying the problem of illegal immigration is non-existent?

At the minute EU inward UK immigration is not illegal so yes non-existent. Post Brexit it will be, you don't need a hard border with infrastructure to counter it.

Also in figures out just a couple of days ago in the last 12 months net migration is down by over 100,000 mainly the constituents of that downward trend being EU citizens. Brexit working as intended.....

[Triks]

If that were the case it would be happening widely now with non EU migrants. In the very rare cases that it does happen now, the proceeds of crime act confiscates the illegally used property and illegal immigrants are arrested and deported. The same will happen after Brexit except in addition this will apply also to EU citizens.

Property owning landlords with assets and wealth don't like breaking the law and losing these properties.

Again under the current system of illegal employment it doesn't happen widely now. In the rare cases that are reported the business owner who illegally employs is fined, put out of business and the employee deported. Same for EU people after Brexit.

At the minute UK banks will open accounts for EU people, they need these to access valuable in work benefits. After exit EU citizens will not have easy access to work, benefits, housing, medicine or bank accounts. UK banks will refuse to open them anything but non resident accounts.

Why do you need a hard border in Ireland you say?



At the minute EU inward UK immigration is not illegal so yes non-existent. Post Brexit it will be, you don't need a hard border with infrastructure to counter it.

Also in figures out just a couple of days ago in the last 12 months net migration is down by over 100,000 mainly the constituents of that downward trend being EU citizens. Brexit working as intended.....

Dunno? Why do, say, Bulgaria and Serbia have a hard border?

[Deleted]

the proceeds of crime act confiscates the illegally used property and illegal immigrants are arrested and deported. The same will happen after Brexit except in addition this will apply also to EU citizens.

Property owning landlords with assets and wealth don't like breaking the law and losing these properties.

This isn't how that law works. It doesn't take away Landlords properties that they own and can prove the own. It would take away say a drug dealers property if they could not provide evidence of how they brought it. It already applies to EU citizens or infact anyone who commits crime in the UK.

Its nice to see your imagination at work making up things beyond brexit.

[dribbles]

Dunno? Why do, say, Bulgaria and Serbia have a hard border?

With respect a bastion of civilization hardly lies just to the south of you now does it? You cannot compare what lies just beneath you to the UK/Irish border.

This isn't how that law works. It doesn't take away Landlords properties that they own and can prove the own. It would take away say a drug dealers property if they could not provide evidence of how they brought it. It already applies to EU citizens or infact anyone who commits crime in the UK.

Its nice to see your imagination at work making up things beyond brexit.

Any illegal gain however accrued can be confiscated by the state, with additional penalties on top, it does not cover just drugs crime. The proceeds of crime act provides that, giving accommodation to illegal immigarnts would be covered. It is currently the legal duty of accommodation providers to check the status of people using property that they own.

Yes it would take away landlords property.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-10433897.html

[Slant]

Oh this gets better and better. Please talk me through how it will work. How are you going to stop EU people from simply walking into the UK without a border? Stern looks? Strongly worded emails?

Or have you decided that your version of Brexit doesn't need to remove freedom of movement? Are you finally coming around to a sensible viewpoint?

The citizens of the EU will appreciate the superior might of the British Empire and dare not set foot into the great Empire without an explicit invitation beforehand. Naturally. Because that is how the natural order of things has to be. In Dribbles' mind at least...